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The truth about SWF

First, the elephant in the room, SWF with comms will give an advantage compared to a solo q. This is a fact, indisputable, end of story.

BUT, that does not mean swf is the boogieman it's made out to be. The fabled toxic 4-man isn't really a problem. In fact, I find the opposite true, most 4-mans tend to goof off far more then a group of 4 solo's, making them easier to kill. They also play stupidly altruistic compared to randoms. Also the gen rushing death squads who know all the loops, are fairly rare. Will you get the occasional rude, stereotypical 4-mans? Sure, it's likely you'll run into many different play style's and players, toxic people among them.

In truth, most of the time SWF is just used as a excuse for a bad experience. I played badly? Gen rushing 4-man SWF. Got a rude person in post game chat? Toxic entitled 4-man SWF. Rarely, in my 1000 hours of playtime, have I seen that be the rule, not the exception.

So really, SWF doesn't need a change, it's fine as is. Could the solo experiance use some improving, yes, I believe so, but it doesn't mean the opposite is a problem.



  • oxygenoxygen Member Posts: 2,886

    You're completely right that some people use the magic word "SWF" as a convenient excuse to immediately invalidate their loss, bonus points if they say "swf?" after a match when every player is a solo with a public profile + friends list.

    I'd certainly like to see base survivors and killers changed to make the advantage less potent, but I don't really know how to do that besides giving more information to increase the potential efficiency solo players can employ. It's really the only remotely possible change besides SWF indicators and BP bonuses for playing with SWF, but I guess a lot of people will never realize that stuff like mechanical nerfs or the truly absurd ideas like removing SWF or trying to interfere with VOIP apps will quite simply never ever happen.

  • RuncoreRuncore Member Posts: 328
    edited December 2019

    Voice comm possibility is giving unfair advantage to these groups. Its giving them literaly free perks like Bond, Emphaty or Kindred coz SWF can easily tell others position on map or killer position near hook. Like playing vs survivors with 7 perks and more while killer has to choose carefuly 4 perks. Killer cannot have friend on voice comm that tell him positions of survivors and simulate some aura reading perks. Killers facing premade groups should have small buffs to counter-balance this perks imbalance.

  • PistolTimbPistolTimb Member Posts: 1,414

    The way I see it, Survivor friends can never truly be removed or nerfed. At least 50% of survivors are in at least a 2 man swf, so it isn't healthy to alienate half the player base. The only way to achieve balance is to buff the base kit of survivors, to at least be on par with the information of swfs. Then we balance killers around this.

    The only problem with this is I doubt bhvr would EVER go for this. They are content with releasing more and more content, all the while ignoring this glaring balance issue. Then they rework a map every 7 months and pat themselves on the back.

  • Aura_babyyAura_babyy Member Posts: 583

    Giving voice comms to solo players is an unfair advantage?

    What is stopping one random solo Q survivor to just invite the rest of his team to a voice chat? I've seen people go the extra mile for that. On console, this happens a lot.

    Killers do not have someone calling survivors out because they simply do not need them. As a Killer, you KNOW where survivors are bound to be, and that is generators. If the Killer was unable to see where Generators were located at, then this would be a different story.

  • SkeletonWitchSkeletonWitch Member Posts: 94

    I rarely play with friends but when I do we just play for fun, we farm each other, we get each other killed and over all not take the game seriously, we are definitely NOT an organized SWF team, we’re barely a team.

  • ImmersedNurseImmersedNurse Member Posts: 3,099

    This is unfortunately very accurate.

    A lot of the time when I'm playing solo survivor, the killer will lose and immediately accuse us of 'gen-rushing', 'SWF', 'pallet looping' etc.

    SWF used to be a big problem in terms of game balance but the game has come a long way since then and killers have a lot more power now. I see it mostly used as an excuse by bad killers nowadays.

  • SquirrelKnightSquirrelKnight Member Posts: 951

    I just had an idea, how about attaching voice comms to the game, like, what if when survivors spoke into their mics, its literally said ingame. Eeehh thinking about it it has a flaw, it still screws over nonserious survivors, but i still feel being able to hear the survivors talking is a step in the right direction

  • WaffleyumboyWaffleyumboy Member Posts: 7,318

    Purple rank queues as survivor are instant. My friend says red ranks take 5+ minutes. It's probably a ranking system thing (too easy to pip as survivor) and not a lack of killers. There's no way less than 20% of people playing are killers but there is super lots of ways less than 20% of red ranks are killers.

  • WaffleyumboyWaffleyumboy Member Posts: 7,318

    Agree. Swf is not op, it's a game mechanic. People should be able to play with friends if they want.

  • OshiOshi Member Posts: 306

    I dodged 4/5 games in lobby vs 3+ SWF, in lobby number five i gived up, complete Legion's mission and DC. I hope devs is proud about SWF problem.

  • immortalls96immortalls96 Member Posts: 4,652

    This whole post is verifiably false..pretending swf are rare is not true either..even when I play with my lower level buddies it is sad how easy it has been at times..easy setups to make killer pressure meaningless..rare or not the fact this issue exists is the problem and cannot be ignored

  • WaffleyumboyWaffleyumboy Member Posts: 7,318

    "Swf problem"

    They're just like any survivor except camping doesn't work on them.

  • WaffleyumboyWaffleyumboy Member Posts: 7,318

    It doesn't change how you need to play as killer much. Find survivors, down them, hook them, repeat.

  • Mr_KMr_K Member Posts: 7,828

    Some people are too quick to blame SWF for bad games. Solos can take hits for others and body block too. Run BT, DS, repair gens, and be toxic.

    But teams of four good survivors do exists.

  • OshiOshi Member Posts: 306
    edited December 2019

    Oh look at this dude, he defend SWF. I guess you never play solo Q, pleb.

  • WaffleyumboyWaffleyumboy Member Posts: 7,318

    I have a thread about why I don't play solo queue. Bad teammates.

  • OshiOshi Member Posts: 306

    It's no hard to check steam profiles before and after game for friend list.

  • Mr_KMr_K Member Posts: 7,828

    As a solo survivor, every once in awhile a killer would cry out toxic swf in chat. I would go through my teammates profiles and see they too were solo que. Some are just too quick to blame their loss on SWFs.

    There are things that survivors do that are attributed to only SWF groups that solos do all the time.

  • OshiOshi Member Posts: 306

    You can tell SWF members where is Ruin while you randomly found it in chase with a killer - fair. 

  • well i remember that the devs didn't want to put a voice chat option in the game so that the survivors wouldn't have a huge advantage but swf kinda defeats that whole purpose lol

  • edgarpoopedgarpoop Member Posts: 5,805

    It's a ridiculous advantage to the groups that can/want to use it in such a way. It's the best perk survivors could possibly have and they don't have to spend a perk slot for it. It's Kindred and OoO for every survivor without downsides. Just because many SWFs goof off doesn't mean it's not completely broken when used efficiently.

  • Quiet_ObserverQuiet_Observer Member Posts: 68

    I'd like to know what killers have power in this game xD they are all, other than 2 or 3, weak

  • MikeasaurusMikeasaurus Member Posts: 2,326

    I've run into many SwF on Xbox and not every single one is a OP monster Gen rusher. Hell, I've had a full SwF so bad, they went down in 2 minutes, and these weren't low ranked either. Killers are only as weak as you make them. People are quick to point the finger to 'Killers are weak', and I'm guilty of it myself in the past. But you just gotta adapt and try a different strategy. People seem to try constantly brute force against survivors, but let's face it, that never works well.

  • GamerCustardGamerCustard Member Posts: 59

    As someone who sometimes goes SWF I can say that our level or co-ordination is.. Well, goes about as far as finding out if one if us in a chase(generally a 2-3 man SWF, very very rarely a 4 man) but I feel that SWF groups from my experience of both being in one and potentially being in a lobby with a separate one hasn't been too much of an issue or advantage (my group doesn't all make it out alive) however, solo survivors definitely need a way of communication or some kind of basekit to put that level of information on par with SWF groups.. The way I've been trying to do that is running Premonition + Empathy - I know when a killer is coming close, and if they're chasing an injured near me..

    I don't think that voice comms for solos should be the answer though, as that would bring up other problems that can't be solved with a patch, like players with no mics or toxic solos using comms to abuse and troll teammates as well as the killer, and taking into account the people who like playing in silence without having to deal with potential mic spamming from randoms which you can't mute because it's in game. I know this last one applies to me, and as a result I wait for a friend group in certain games that have an in game chat, so we can go party comms instead..

    That's just imo though

  • Quiet_ObserverQuiet_Observer Member Posts: 68

    Killers are weak, just because you beat bad players who are using swf doesn't mean anything other than they were just bad, good players using swf dominate most games, being able to communicate mid game is too strong against the killer especially since most killers are just bad

  • RakimSockemRakimSockem Member Posts: 1,873

    This is not the case anymore, at least in my experience. My killer queues are less than 2 minutes around rank 8. Some as quick as 30 seconds. My survivor queues recently have been around 3 minutes solo, and like 5-10 minutes for SWF.

  • ThisGuuy83ThisGuuy83 Member Posts: 1,303

    SWF's is killing the game for killers on higher rank for ps4. Actually, it's more coms then sWF's, because it's so easy to create a party chat and invite everyone to it. That's the big elephant in the room. Sure, SWF can be strong, but when they have the ability to tell each other every move the killer makes, or say "Hey, the killers after me, so I'm gonna get him to chase me, and you 3 gen rush with super tool boxes." Or "Hey, I have a key, meet me here".That is a HUGE disadvantage that the devs refuse to acknowledge, and the surv base acts like it's perfectly fine, and gives them no advantage... When you have a good team of sWF's running coms, your chances are slim to none., and that's the problem....

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