Huntress ? The simple fact Hag doesn't get infinited while she does makes Hag much more superior to her. And her range attack is very hindered by map design. And you really overrate Freddy.
But Huntress can potentially get hits/downs from across the map, and she can cut short loops on the first go around. Yea Huntress is hurt by certain loops but she also has insane pressure on groups of survivors. Catch them making a basement save and you can easily just eat through BT and down everyone really fast. They each have advantages and disadvantages. Like I said it's close.
Freddy is not close though, he is far above Hag. I'm not the only one who shares this opinion, I asked a few friends that have +4k hours and are really good survivors. They agree that Freddy is top 3 at least, if not the best killer potentially. He is insanely strong. Maybe you underrate him because he has literally all the tools needed to control the game. Like Freddy with Pop alone is stronger than half of the other killers.
Fact is Hag is not top 3. She is strong but not stronger than the best killers (Nurse, Spirit, Freddy).
Shhhhhhh! Dude ! Just shut up! Don't let them know that!
Long range hatchets are situational and can be easily countered by aware survivors.
Hag can cut any loop in the game with her traps. There are loops that Huntress simply can't contest.
Hag also has a very strong basement and on top of that, she has better anti loop, map pressure and perk synergy. She outclasses Huntress in almost every aspect.
I am in a Discord with players with thousands hours in the game and all of them agree that Hag is better than Freddy. So your argument about your friends is irrelevant.
Yet Freddy has the highest kill rate across all ranks and the highest kill rate at red ranks. Hag merely has the highest kill rate to pick rate ratio. The stats contradict your arguments. And the difference is significant enough to say that Freddy is clearly a superior killer.
If we are going by the stats, Nurse is the weakest killer in the game and she should be heavily buffed. Stats include : red rank killers playing against lower ranks survivors, survivors suiciding on hooks, survivors being overly altruistic in end game and getting killed only because of that and they don't include killer and survivors set up nor their skill level. These stats also are before Freddy's add-ons were nerfed, when most people were giving up against "Forever Freddy" builds and thus busting his kill rate. So these stats don't hold water and I don't take them into account in tier lists.
There's too many "Hag is only good for Camping" Killers out there. It skews the results. 😎
But really, the statistics that get vomited forth on occasion are useless. My own personal experience, even at higher ranks I feel more comfortable playing against a good Freddy than I do a good Hag, and I am a Hag main. Good Hags actually scare me a bit when I play against them.
Freddy is a great M1 Killer, very powerful, but he doesn't have the ability to shut down a map like the Hag can. He can teleport, with a cooldown. His snares will slow you, but it's easy AF to stay awake in a match. There's multiple ways to break out of sleeping. He has some neat gimmicks, but they are just that, gimmicks. There's lots of mindgames you can do with him, but the end result is he is heavily dependant on his add-ons to give him that extra boost to take out high ranked Survivors.
Hag isn't reliant on her add-ons for that. They give her more power certainly, but they aren't required to make her great in chases, loops, and overall map pressure. You never know when the hell she's going to pop out next to you and take a swipe if she's played well.
I don't have friends, so I can't make any special proclamation about what they think, but I find Freddy far easier to survive against, even in his new form, than a Hag. Both are tough when played correctly, but Hag comes out on top imo at least.
The nerfs to Freddy were actually very minimal. I went from 4k 5 gens most games to 4k 4/3 gens. Survivors get more done now yes, but the difference is moot when they all still die long before the gates power.
And yea there are anomalies, but the same could be said about Hag's stats. So at the end of the day there are inferences you can draw about the strength of the killers. Nurse has a low kill rate because she is very difficult to use. Freddy is much easier to use. Hag is harder to use, but I don't see how she can apply more pressure than Freddy in the average match. She is a very strong defensive character, where Freddy is a very strong offensive character, and generally speaking offensive style characters tend to be stronger at the highest levels because you can actively win the game, where defensive style characters are more passive. Being more passive means there is more room to counter play because the other side can move at their own pace. Against offensive style characters this isn't an option, you play at the pace set by that character.
Sorry but nothing you say is going to convince me Hag is stronger than Freddy. She is a good killer no doubt but Freddy has more tools and is more effective at what he does, with fewer counter options and less room to make mistakes.
Not the strongest killer because her power still has ALOT of counterplays. But she is still damn strong agree. I get mostly 4ks only with her. If survivors are lucky and get flashlights from chests then you are pretty much [BAD WORD]. Same goes to swf, if they are well coordinated and constantly trigger your trapps after you placed them, you will lose because you have pretty much no power.
I mean with triggering, when you are too far away for teleports or they just instantly run away and you cant reach them anymore. But these are situations that rarely happen. I personally dont understand why noone plays her, I like hag, especially with make your choice, a ton of fun :D
Your arguments also didn't convince me neither. Especially because most of your arguments were flawed.
Huntress is far superior than hag. And I can show it to you
She's great but not the strongest. She's helped by the fact that most survivors don't know how to best deal with her - if you know where a trap is and you're not currently on a gen or unhooking, go pop it! If you walk up to it and run directly away the moment it's triggered you'll easily make it to a loop before the Hag can hit you, as she has a brief slowdown after teleporting. Try to keep an eye on where she is across the game to get a sense of where her traps generally are, as the Hag can't trap the entire map. This means if you get hit you can easily run to a dead zone in the map that her traps can't stretch to, and she'll have to risk committing to the chase to get a down.
If a team is proactive with disabling her web she really, really struggles, and this is why Object of Obsession is such a massive counter to her, especially with a flashlight because then there's 0 risk to disabling a trap.
Yeah, show me how she gets looped for entire minutes on maps with tons of high walls loops like Cowshed or Family Residence or how she gets infinited looped on the super safe buildings from Disturbed Ward or Grim Pantry.
I destroyed a team formed by some of the best survs in europe in cowshed. A team that would destroy any hag that writes here.
Family reaidence Is good for hiding, you are not going to loop me much there. Actually you're not going to loop me much on any map.
Why would any killer follow someone in a infinite considering there's no gen there. Btw, most probably you won't get to reach those infinites.
Grim pantry is a good Huntress map, disturbed ward is also a good huntress map.
you don't seem to know that an experienced premade with OOO and maybe ( not even needed) some flashlights would completely destroy hag on any map. And if you think this is wrong, I can bring a premade vs your hag. And if you say Huntress would get stomped too, I tell you, bring any swf you want, I'll be the huntress.
I've noticed with Hag is that she has every aspect of the best killers in the game, and a relatively easier time with it - especially with add on's, but remains under the radar since not enough play her.
So let's all just stay quiet, and BHVR will never touch our little mud muffin.
As long as the hag player is good in both predicting survivors and actually playing her she is a very strong character that can snow ball and end chases quickly. However she is not the best if compared to the best nurse player.
Shh, don't spill our secrets!
We played the hag successfully for years, just out of sight of the public. Just as we like it, so no one would pay too close attention to her and start crying for nerfs.
Truth is, the hag is one of the strongest killer in the game, but requires a specific mindset and gameplay. You cannot simply m1 hunt your prey down and except to win. Not a lot people enjoy that playstyle.
because you need a certain mindset to play hag effectively. Most players can't or dont like to strategically place traps, have good reaction times for tping to traps, knowing if it is better to tp to a trap out of a chase, and/or knowing when to give up a chase. of course their are more things to think about when playing specifically hag so all the choices and trap maintenance makes players want to play the other killers instead which have a much more simpler play style of get close for the hit.
Also barely anyone played nurse before her nerf but she was considered the strongest killer in the game and the reason for her being so unplayed was her difficulty.
Most players dont enjoy a camping based playstyle. Tastes differ, but if hag couldnt trap hooks, i'd play her a lot more, she is a very interesting character. Ruined by her hard-to-counter camping powers. And her natural strength vs solos compared to getting hardcountered vs swfs. Such an oddball, but her playstyle of trapping the map and turning it into her swamp and territory is really cool. But teleporting and protecting hooks ruins it for me. Its too devastating against solos
Something everyone is either forgetting or hasn't thought about is the impact that dedicated servers have had on her performance.
Depending on the lag, it's possible for a survivor to trigger a trap and move away while you get a late teleport prompt and the survivor is further away after you teleport than they would be without lag.
The servers have a stronger effect on the hag than any other killer which may drop her viability even more since even a small mistake will cost you the match.
But well, how many times can you fall for the hook trap? Run around, trigger, hide, then unhook
Just don't trap hooks, nobody is forcing you to do so if you don't want.
I could agree with you, but some other killers at the highest skill level can completely make a team lose hope and lose quickly
If you trigger and hide nearby, she'll just get a free hit on you and draw another trap at the hook. Your team has 1 more injury, you lost gentime and hooktime and the situation is still the same. She is waiting for survivors to waste time like that. Its her choice to go far enough away from the hook to allow a crouchsave. But she can also stay closish and deny every crouchsave attempt. If she wants you dead, you're dead basically. And the only counter is a merciless genrush without even trying to unhook, unless the hag wanders completely off for some reason.