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Killers should be able to see the aura of the hatch when there's five or four gens remaining

Nutty_ProfessorNutty_Professor Member Posts: 337
edited January 25 in Feedback and Suggestions

First, I am a survivor main.

Before the end game collapse update survivors use to have to complete two generators before the hatch would even spawn.

So my idea is that if the survivors were unable to complete two generators the hatch would show it's aura to the killer. This mechanic is already in the game as Bill's perk Left Behind, so would be simple to implement.

If the game is going badly for the survivors, the survivors don't really have an incentive to work on generators as the Hatch will spawn anyway.

As a survivor main I would not have any issues if this was implemented as the survivors failed to do their objective. The advantage the killer would have with being able to see the hatch aura is a reward for preventing the survivors from doing their objective.

EDIT: Due to some confusion. The hatch would still have the same spawning requirements. However, when the hatch spawns with five or four gens remaining, the hatch will show it's aura to the killer. This would create an incentive for the survivors to complete at least two generators before the second to last survivor dies, to prevent the killer from being able to see the hatch's aura. Therefore, the last survivor will have a higher chance of a getting a hatch escape.

Post edited by Nutty_Professor on
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Comments

  • Doc_W__HOLLIDAYDoc_W__HOLLIDAY Member Posts: 2,295

    Um no. Nice try with the survivor main thing though.


    It just isn't fair. If killer finds hatch, he deserves to have the odds stacked in his favor. If the survivor does, they may potentially deserve the escape (as sometimes a good survivor is stuck with bad teammates)

  • Nutty_ProfessorNutty_Professor Member Posts: 337

    I am a survivor main. Just because I can see the inbalances on the survivor side doesn't make me a killer main.

    How is it not fair?

    I've played the game since July 2018, before the end game collapse the hatch would not spawn until the there was three generators left. If you were the last survivor and there was five or four gens left, the hatch did not spawn. At least with my suggestion the survivor still has a chance of getting the hatch.

    In my opinion no matter how good the survivor is if the survivor team were unable to do two generators, then no survivors on that survivor team deserves to escape.

    Considering I'm Devotion four, if I'm a killer main why I'm I prestiging my survivors?

  • thehotdogman93thehotdogman93 Member Posts: 81
    edited January 25

    I'll start off by saying that I am a (supposedly) killer main myself.

    Edit: I should of done my research before posting this reply as I had no idea that the spawning of the hatch depends on the amount of survivors still alive in addition to the amount of generators completed.

    (Irrelevant) When I first read your discussion title, I had to disagree with what it said, but after reading through your whole discussion, I think I see what you're trying to say, but you need to be clear on a couple of things.

    1(Irrelevant). Are you talking about 'as long as there are 4 - 5 generators remaining'? This would let the killer see the hatch at the beginning of the game and I disagree with this. The killer would memorize where it's at, and go to it even if there was one only gen left and it came down to a 1v1.

    2(Irrelevant). Or do you mean, 'as long as there are 4 - 5 generators remaining AND the hatch is open'? This is interesting because it forces the survivors to do at least 2 gens before they use a skeleton key. Otherwise, the killer is going to see the hatch as soon as it opens, which allows the killer to step in and take action against a super early hatch opening.

    3. Or finally, do you mean 'as long as there are 4 - 5 generators remaining and there's only one player left'? This seems like it could be a legitimate feature of the game but it may be too late at that point because of the possibility that the last survivor decided to search for the hatch while letting his teamate die, and by the time you see the hatch's aura, it's already GG for him. This could still be usefull if the last survivor didn't search for the hatch in the first place.


    If you think about it, there's so many different things you can do when it comes to giving the killer an aura of the hatch. Make it normal perk, or a hex perk. Or maybe add a distance requirement just like in bill's version. (Irrelevant) Change the amount of players that need to be alive, or change the amount of generators that still need to be inactive for the ability to activate.

    There's so much (Edit: Scratch that. Not as much as I thought) potential in this and I'm glad you brought this up.

    Post edited by thehotdogman93 on
  • Nutty_ProfessorNutty_Professor Member Posts: 337

    I might need to edit my main post. What I meant is that when there is only one survivor left and the hatch spawns, if there are still four or five generators left the aura of the hatch would reveal itself to the killer.

    This would create an incentive for survivors to complete at least two generators, as if the survivors complete at least two generators before the last survivor dies, the killer won't be able to see the aura of the hatch. Giving the last survivor a higher chance to find the hatch.

    With the killer being able to memorize the hatch location at the start of the game would not be an issue, because the hatch would not have spawned yet.

  • Cici_CastleCici_Castle Member Posts: 8

    UMM...HOW ABOUT NO. WHY DON’T YOU JUST GO AHEAD AND CLAIM ALL SURVIVORS NEED TO BE SPAWNED ON THE HOOK...’CAUSE THAT’S WHAT THAT EQUALS, BABY... 👶🏻🍼😀

  • Nutty_ProfessorNutty_Professor Member Posts: 337

    No, it's not. I don't think you read my suggestion properly.

  • Cici_CastleCici_Castle Member Posts: 8

    Really probably would not be a good idea though, cause then NOBODY would stand a chance of getting out the hatch...that’s just the way it would be. 😕😕😕

  • Doc_W__HOLLIDAYDoc_W__HOLLIDAY Member Posts: 2,295

    I've played since the game released on console so i know the pain of the old hatch system. I think the current one is fair enough, and this is coming from someone who plays both sides rather equally.


    Plus i don't think its fair to punish someone for getting paired with 3 potatoes. Maybe when the rank system actually does its purpose this can happen. But as long as i and other players are being matched with R20 teammates. I say no.

  • Nutty_ProfessorNutty_Professor Member Posts: 337
    edited January 25

    Um yes there would be if the survivors completed more then two generators, then killer would not see the aura to the hatch.

  • TragicSolitudeTragicSolitude Member Posts: 2,160

    I like this idea. While I understand why the devs made it so that the hatch spawns even when zero gens are done, I've always thought that they didn't balance properly for it. Not when combined with the RNG of it being able to spawn at the last survivor's feet (man, I really felt like I cheated those killers out of a 4k). If the killer kills three survivors and fewer than two gens were completed, then showing the killer the hatch's aura would be a nice reward for putting that much pressure on the survivors. And it's still not a guarantee the killer will get to it first, especially not if it spawns across the map from a low-mobility killer.

  • thehotdogman93thehotdogman93 Member Posts: 81

    Would you mind it if was included in the game as a perk? What if it included a range so you had to be within a certain distance to see the hatch?

    What I'm really asking is if what if the killer had access to a carbon copy of Bill's "Left Behind" perk. If you think that's still unfair for a sole survivor who got stuck with potato players, would it be better if it was a hex perk?

    I think the killer needs a way to counter hatch camping. As a matter of fact, I remember someone complaining that a match was going on for too long after I had a perfect 3 gen setup and their teammates were being useless by camping hatch.

  • Cici_CastleCici_Castle Member Posts: 8

    Bottom Line: The killers already find the hatch easy enough. EVERY survivor knows this. Almost every game I play as a survivor, they find it immediately. If you really played a survivor more often like you say, you would understand my point of view. 👍🏻

  • Doc_W__HOLLIDAYDoc_W__HOLLIDAY Member Posts: 2,295

    As a perk it'd be acceptable. I don't think making it a hex is necessary since hexes hardly last throughout a match, and the perk would be too situational to warrant a hex status.

  • TragicSolitudeTragicSolitude Member Posts: 2,160

    A perk to show the killer the hatch's aura if they kill 3 survivors before 2 gens are done would be really situational. I don't think that happens that often for most killers. As a killer, I wouldn't bet one of my perk slots on being able to stop survivors from completing more than one gen during the match.

    I almost never see anyone running Left Behind, and that has a lot more utility.

  • thehotdogman93thehotdogman93 Member Posts: 81

    Left Behind doesn't have a gen requirement either, and that's what I would want on this perk. Knowing that this is such a situational perk, I wouldn't expect this to end up on a lot of builds other than begginer builds or maybe troll builds possibly. It could be a perk that a begginer takes with him / her for lack of a better one.

  • MarcavecuncMarcavecunc Member Posts: 987

    Big no. "alright, the hatch is in the shack, I'll remember that when there's only one survivor left"

    Might as well remove the hatch from the game entirely.

  • Nutty_ProfessorNutty_Professor Member Posts: 337

    Another person that didn't read my suggestion properly. Read it again.

    No killers won't be able to remember where the hatch spawn is because the hatch would not have spawned.

    Does the hatch spawn currently spawn at the start of the game? No it doesn't.

  • MarcavecuncMarcavecunc Member Posts: 987

    The suggesting you made without knowing how the game mechanics work and made two pages long for apparently no reason? Yeah that suggestion is bad. And even if the suggestion was "show the killer the hatch aura for 5 seconds when it appears in the game" it would still be a bad idea. Why? Cause part of the game is seeing who will find it first. If you want the killer to see the hatch then have them waste a perk slot for it, to work exactly like "left behind".. Or, you know, leave it the way it is.

  • Nutty_ProfessorNutty_Professor Member Posts: 337

    I've played this game for nearly two years at red ranks on both sides I know how the game mechanics work. I find that insulting to be honest.

    Before end game collapse the hatch would not even spawn if there was five or four generators remaining. I think killers should have some advantage of finding the hatch if there are still five or four gens remaining, as a reward for preventing the survivors from completing their objective.

    My suggestion has nothing to do with it being a perk, that's what other people have suggested in the discussion.

  • MarcavecuncMarcavecunc Member Posts: 987

    It still would be too killer-sided though. And as someone who plays both sides, it's really a matter of finding it first when it opens.. Having the killer see where the hatch spawned (even when it's still closed, for a few seconds) would give them a huge advantage if they're already doing well.

  • Nutty_ProfessorNutty_Professor Member Posts: 337

    Again I don't think you read my suggestion at all.

    My suggestion relates to the scenario when three survivors are dead, and there's only one survivor remaining, the hatch spawns no matter how many generators have been repaired.

    So when the killer would see the aura of the hatch, is when the killer sacrifices the second to last survivor with five or four gens remaining. If the killer sacrifices the second to last survivor with three generators remaining, the killer would not see the hatch.

    It might be killer sided when there are five or four generators remaining, but the killer would have earned that advantage by preventing the survivors from completing their objective.

  • MarcavecuncMarcavecunc Member Posts: 987

    Then might as well remove the hatch entirely because your suggesting definitely is killer sided. There's literally no reason to implement such a change in the game, hatch is fine as it is right now.

  • Nutty_ProfessorNutty_Professor Member Posts: 337

    Not really the killer would only have the aura advantage if there was five or four gens remaining.

  • thehotdogman93thehotdogman93 Member Posts: 81

    You're right. Especially since I like to follow the logic of "If it isn't broken, don't fix it". This discussion definitely isn't a balancing request, so I was the one that suggested it as a perk, in knowing that it favors the killer. You must of quoted the wrong person earlier when you were talking about making a suggestion without knowing how the game mechanics work, since that was the mistake I made. And finally, I don't think you understood what I was talking about as a limitation to this supposed 'perk'. I wasn't talking about a 'Time Duration' to see the hatch for 5 seconds, no, because the hatch doesn't move. What I ment was a literal carbon copy of bill's perk for the killer where he / she needs to be within a certain distance to see the hatch, and it only activates when there is only one survivor left.

  • thehotdogman93thehotdogman93 Member Posts: 81

    What!? That doesn't make any sense. The hatch doesn't open until there's only one person, that means it doesn't open even if there's two people with someone still on the hook. If you actually read his suggestion, the killer can't 'memorize' where the hatch is because he wouldn't be able to see it UNTIL there's only one survivor remaining.

  • thehotdogman93thehotdogman93 Member Posts: 81

    Bro. Ok, yeah I am little new. When I made my first reply, I didn't know how the spawns worked for the hatch. But I looked it up, I know that it spawns when the amount of generators completed is one more then the amount of players remaining. But you also skipped over Nutty_Professor's reply when he said that it won't kick in unless there is ONLY one player remaining. That's the part you missed, and you're assuming that he means when if FIRST SPAWNS. No, he means when, again, when there is only one player in the game, and there are 4 - 5 gens remaining. That's another thing. Are you sure YOU know how it works. Either you completely skipped over professor's reply, or you don't know that it doesn't spawn until the # of completed gens is equal to the amount of players in the game +1, and I'm guessing it's the former.


    When there are 4 - 5 gens left to be done in the game, if you do simple math, you know that the hatch won't spawn if there are 4 players, 3 players, or even 2 players, because there would only be at most one generator completed at that point. There's one exception to this rule that we all know; it's when there is only one survivor left. At that point, it doesn't matter how many gens are completed, the hatch will spawn and open automatically. This is the situation that Nut_Professor is talking about. At that point, because all of the survivors were potatoes and were unable to get more than one gen completed, the killer should be able to steamroll the last survivor and see an aura of the hatch at that point.

    That's what this discussion is about; there's no possibility of the hatch spawning closed and the killer seeing it's aura before it's open, because we're only covering the situation where no more then 4 - 5 gens are done.

  • thehotdogman93thehotdogman93 Member Posts: 81
    edited January 26

    Now those are all valid points. So I'll bring up my suggestion again and try to make it as short as possible.

    1. Make it a perk

    2. Get rid of the gen requirement

    3. Add a range requirement to it.

    4. Add a 'only one player left' clause to it

    Edit: 5. Increase the range of the audio cue for the hatch


    This proposed perk is literally a carbon copy of bill's perk of "Left Behind"(Besides increasing the audio cue). I feel like some killer players would probably run this to get 4K's easier. The range requirement would still make it so you have to search for the hatch, it just makes the search easier.

  • thehotdogman93thehotdogman93 Member Posts: 81

    I'm imagining that new killer players, or vet players who have a lot of confidence that they only need three decent perks to kill most of the survivors would run it. It definitely would not be meta, mostly just an extra perk that some take along for the lack of a better perk.

  • emptyCupsemptyCups Member Posts: 486

    Only read the first few comments...

    Aura reading the hatch on last survivor if no gens would be ok.

    As killer

    I dont think the hatch is deserved in any way it's just a free escape.

    As survivor

    I find it far more effective to hide at a gate until killer hits the hatch unless I have enough gens to see it before it gets down to me anyway

    But what do I know playing both sides


    Solo ques should be punished.

    Make friends its not hard. This Is comp. You dont solo show up in rainbow 6 and expect to Ace on defence. Pleasantly speak to people who beat you and learn there tricks, encourage people who co-operate well to get better with you.

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