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Killing two birds with one stone (SWF and Mori)

KyxlectKyxlect Member Posts: 230
edited August 2020 in Feedback and Suggestions

Killers hate SWF's and Survivor's hate Mori's right? How about a change that affects both at the same time?

Firstly, remove Mori's entirely but implement a built-in system that allows the Killer to kill Survivors that are in an SWF group naturally.

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2-Man SWF Group: Ability to Kill one of the Survivors in the group at any time after they've been hooked once. After the 4th Generator has been activated, the other Survivor in the group can be Killed after they've been hooked once.

3-Man SWF Group: Ability to Kill one of the Survivors in the group at any time after they've been hooked once. After the 3rd Generator has been activated, another member of the group can be Killed at any time after they've been hooked once. After the 4th Generator has been activated, the final member of the group can be Killed at any time after they've been hooked once.

4-Man SWF Group: Ability to Kill one of the Survivors in the group at any time after they've been hooked. After the 2nd Generator has been activated, another member of the group can be Killed at any time after they've been hooked once. After the 3rd Generator has been activated, another member of the group can be Killed at any time after they've been hooked once. After the 4th Generator has been activated, the final member of the group can be Killed at any time after they've been hooked once.

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The purpose of this change is intended to create balance. Personally, I've never cared much for Mori's and never really used any until here recently when BHVR decided to disable the ability to select a different Killer for their new matchmaking system but when they disabled that they decided to keep Killer switching disabled.

Yes, it punishes people that just want to play with their friends but Killer's should not have to weather the frustration of dealing with the unfair advantage that playing with your friends causes. There's no way to deal with third party applications where you can communicate vital information to each other. I think this system is fair but feel free to give any feedback.

^- Additionally, I have it set to the 4th generator because setting it to the 5th and final generator seems pointless since again, even if you kill a member of an SWF group that doesn't mean they'll immediately leave. They can still spectate and communicate with their teammate(s). This was something I came up with based off my experience as Killer. The most effective way of slowing down the game when you play against SWF's is to cut off their communications entirely meaning that all members of the group are dead and no longer have any advantage to speak of.

This does of course bring into question the use of alternative killing methods such as Hex: Devour Hope, Rancor and Myers' Tombstone add-ons. To me, Devour Hope seems fine since it's still a Hex. Rancor and the Tombstone add-ons are questionable. My thoughts about changing Rancor is that it randomly selects any non-SWF Survivor as the obsession. That perk combined with Nemesis seem like a problem but I feel like that's a discussion for a later time since it's already existed for a good while and Myers' Tombstone add-ons already have their negative drawbacks for their use.

Thoughts?

Comments

  • notstarboardnotstarboard Member Posts: 3,702

    I wouldn't support any system that penalizes you for playing with your friends, especially when that would affect the rank 5 showing his two rank 20 buddies the game just as much as it would affect those elusive god-tier SWFs. I think the best way to handle SWF is to buff solo queue. I would support heavily nerfing or removing Moris, though.

  • KyxlectKyxlect Member Posts: 230

    I feel like it's in bad taste to show your Rank 20 buddies the game by pitting them against a Killer near your Rank...

  • KyxlectKyxlect Member Posts: 230

    I feel like it's in bad taste to pit your Rank 20 buddies against a Killer matched up against you when you're a Rank 5 Survivor in order to show them the game. You can make a new steam account and play DbD through Family Sharing I believe. Of course, that would mean you would be smurfing and once again validate the purpose of the system.

  • notstarboardnotstarboard Member Posts: 3,702

    Well, once they fix up matchmaking it should be smart enough to pick killers that are an appropriate skill level for the survivor team. Like, if I'm a rank 5 and I have two rank 20 buddies, I'd hope the game would give us like a rank 14 killer so things sort of even out. You're right that right now there isn't really a great option. Either queue up as normal and give us a disadvantage or smurf and give us an advantage. I really would prefer a good matchmaking system as a solution here instead of penalizing SWF, though.

  • BrequeBreque Member Posts: 427

    Why everyone wanna to nerf SWF

    They just wanna to play with friends and in the same way has so much survivals that play in SWF that are horrible

    i have 2 group of friends one that if we tryhard we will probably win because everyone has game sense and know loops and etc

    and the other group that if i do my best and pass all the cals we will still lose because i can be good but they have like 24Hours of game and we all that i can do is have fun and dont tryhard

    If in the second group i cant even win normally imagine if it has these nerfs

    And in the first group we will not be abble to win or we will have to let all the gens 99% to we dont have an mori

    No you cant nerf SWF if you nerf everyone that dont have the first group that i have will BE DESTROYED

  • KyxlectKyxlect Member Posts: 230

    The question is though...who'd want to play against SWF's in general even after they re-enable matchmaking? In my opinion, matchmaking will not resolve the issue SWF's have been bringing to the table and have been for years. Even if the system matches a Killer, they may not want to deal with the frustration of playing against SWF's. With this, they at least have incentive to try since they might just win, right?

    Everyone wants to nerf SWF's because they're overpowered.

    It sounds like you're saying that SWF is fine as it currently is since it only ruins the Killer's experience when you're tryharding. That's a pretty selfish thing to say but regardless, once matchmaking is re-enabled it should put you up against Killer's around your skill level but that still wont make it entirely perfect either since SWF's will still have that unfair advantage.

  • notstarboardnotstarboard Member Posts: 3,702

    I would happily play against SWFs, especially when matchmaking has determined that they're at my skill level. People make a big deal about SWF but I don't think it's as much of a problem as people say. They have more information, but they often have bigger disparities in skill and make costly mistakes because they play too altruistically.

  • MrLimonkaMrLimonka Member Posts: 545

    Please tell me you are baiting.

    Maybe survivors who play SWF should start the match on a hook, and they have to kobe to play the game? Would be totally balanced then, right?

  • BrequeBreque Member Posts: 427

    What i was saying was i canot nerf the first grup without fucyng the seconds

    And you really wanna punish someone just for playing with friends?

    And i just tryhard when the killer is camping - tunnel or is using moris just because i just wanna that the guy that uses moris tunnel and camp be mad

  • MoundshroudMoundshroud Member Posts: 4,460

    Since I mainly take the Mori to equalize against the power of the 5th Perk (Comms) provided by SWF, I've no problem with this. I don't see them implementing it, but it would certainly address my concern. I don't want to lose the only effective tool I have against Comms.

  • DisappointedUserDisappointedUser Member Posts: 420

    Elusive? You clearly don’t watch top tier killers play this game. You can find them every other game watching Otz try to get his 50 game win streaks. Teams that complete 5 gens 3 minutes into the game. And that’s against a 2500hr killer.


    same happens to many of the other really good killers that stream. Whatever rhetoric you want to use against these streamers, it doesn’t change the fact that it is mechanically impossible to win against these teams.

  • notstarboardnotstarboard Member Posts: 3,702
    edited August 2020

    Otz mains Trapper, which is a notoriously gen-rushable killer because of his slow start and the inherent inconsistency of his power. I'm a red rank killer as well using the same rank-based matchmaking system and in my experience those squads are rare.

    My personal experience could certainly be an outlier, but the stats don't lie. As of November 2019, which are the newest numbers we have, the kill rate was ~70% at red ranks and ~65% at all ranks. Two questions:

    1) If god-tier SWFs are both common and OP, why is the kill rate higher at red ranks than for all ranks? The game has changed a bit since the end of last year, but SWF has existed in its current form since well before then.

    2) If kill rates are that high, especially considering there's a hatch, how is it possible that there are lots of god-tier SWFs? Even if solo queue were a near guaranteed death these SWFs would still need to be a minority of matches. It's more likely that these god-tier SWFs are rare and/or not as dominant as they're made out to be.

  • XpljesusXpljesus Member Posts: 393

    Serious question here, is this a troll post?

  • striphestriphe Member Posts: 4

    Would not support mori nerf or removal, would support a survivor perk that challenges mori with a skill check or button mash face off like wiggle between killer and survivor. Killer wins, mori happens, survivor wins, one health state healed.

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