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Devs you have the kick animation...so

IhatelifeIhatelife Member Posts: 5,069
edited December 2020 in Feedback and Suggestions

How about we're gonna add a perk that allows survivors to instantly destroy the totem or hex totem by kicking it, but it requires from survivors to do something like stunning the killer etc.

Post edited by MandyTalk on

Comments

  • TerroTerro Member Posts: 1,171

    It makes a loud notification for the killer. The survivor gets a stubbed toe status effect where they moan and limp with a 0.2 m/s debuff for 30 seconds but the survivor does not actually lose a health state. They also can't kick another totem while they have the stubbed toe status effect.

  • ukenickyukenicky Member Posts: 1,122

    I actually like this idea.

    If we don't get something like this I at least hope they change the way cleansing a totem works so that the progress rapidly regresses rather than going STRAIGHT to 0 the second you let go of it.

    If a killer is camping and protecting their hex totem (I'm not bashing the act of doing that if you wanna do that you're valid) it's next to impossible to fully cleanse a totem. My idea is a bit more fair but I do love this idea of using the kick animation to instantly pop a totem. It could really help with noed in end game or just in general, to dispel a hex totem quickly. As long as it has a decent prerequisite I don't see why it would be so bad since they still need to find the lit totem and charge the ability to use the kick.


    In general I want to see more totem cleansing related perks for survivors though so yeah I like these kinds of ideas.

  • BuckobenBuckoben Member Posts: 348

    okay propose something better. OP has a point it doesn't have to be pallet stuns buddy.

  • Thanotos_OmegaThanotos_Omega Member Posts: 100


    It would need to be insane, like 5 stuns at tier 3, Hexs already need Undying just to be viable due to their vulnerability, and allot of them like Lullaby aren't even all that powerful without allot of work from the killer,

  • PassarinoTPassarinoT Member Posts: 903

    I have plenty of better ideas, but just because you have an animation, you do not need to use it on everything. Hell, why not create a survivor perk that allows survivors to kick the killer and stun them? Why stop there? Let survivors kick exit gates open right away. You clearly don't see that this is just an extremely unbalanced situation.

  • BuckobenBuckoben Member Posts: 348

    honestly if this imaginary perk were a thing it should only effect dull totems. Again it doesn't have to be stuns.

  • Thanotos_OmegaThanotos_Omega Member Posts: 100

    Dull totems are valuable too, they boost thrill of the hunt and are needed for undying to do it's thing,

  • BuckobenBuckoben Member Posts: 348

    Why can't you just help to think of ways to make a good perk instead of just shooting down every idea. you could even make it a one time use and have it be conditional if it would be that broken, but stop being that guy who add nothing to a conversation

  • savevatznicksavevatznick Member Posts: 651

    Can we also use the killer kick animation to stomp on dying survivors to make their bleedout timer go down?

  • StibbityStabbityStibbityStabbity Member Posts: 1,449

    So, totems are there as a secondary objective that uses Survivor time. While you may think it's a good idea to create a scenario where they can be done instantly, all that does is remove the point of a secondary objective: To give the Killer time to go after Survivors. As it stands, Undying + Ruin works so well because it forces Survivors to spend more time on secondaries. While that may seem annoying at times, that is the express function of totems in the first place. If you invalidate the time it takes to do them, or drastically shorten it, you are completely shutting off an entire segment of the game design which is, right now, sorely needed. Totems aren't even a required secondary, which causes a lot of games to go much faster than they are likely intended, and leads to rather toxic behavior on both sides of the playerbase.

    Also, remember that totems are, in fact, an objective. Same as generators. They may be secondary, but they ARE an objective. Asking for the ability to instantly remove one from the game is similar to asking to instantly remove a generator. Yes, you don't NEED to do totems to win, but if you feel that having a perk to wipe one out instantly is worth while, then apparently they ARE important enough to NOT become an after thought via a perk. If you look at similar perks that affect generators, you notice that they cut down the time it takes to do a generator without outright invalidating the repair of a generator. This is for a GOOD REASON. Mostly in that the ENTIRE game is built around the Survivors creating the timer that the Killer has to do their job. Cutting that timer drastically is an extreme penalty to the Killer.

    I would also like to point out that there is a lot of OTHERWORDLINESS going on in DbD. Entity, Fog, never dying, etc. As such, totems may not be kickable in the first place, and require that someone take them apart the same way they are put together, else they are magically stuck to the ground.

  • Thanotos_OmegaThanotos_Omega Member Posts: 100

    because nerfing hex's in anyway is bad, there is no way to make it work, unless hexs were buffed before hand, like giving them gen length cleanse times increasing their numbers requiring survivors to have special items to clense them in the first place, hexs are literally dependent on a single crutch perk to really be viable and even then can be hard countered, i mean how would you feel if someone suggested a perk for killers that let them permakill a gen?

  • chieften333chieften333 Member Posts: 1,554

    Totems are a gamble as is, requiring a hex perk ( which is already a gamble within itself ) to be able to protect yourself from horrible RNG. Even then, rng can just spawn your undying right next to a survivor.

    Plus the whole reason their is a "cleanse" animation lorewise, is to prevent the character from being cursed.

    So unless their are HEAVY downsides to it, this is a no go.

  • XyvieliaXyvielia Member Posts: 1,652

    Just a pile of neatly stacked bones... totally kickable

    Magnificent idea; keep em coming!

  • XyvieliaXyvielia Member Posts: 1,652

    There are 3 sacred circles on each map that a survivor must walk through in order to activate Divine Sanctity on their shoes, causing their feet to glow, and enabling them to fully cleanse totems with one swift stomp😇

  • HopesfallHopesfall Member Posts: 828

    Why do survivors feel the need for more things to speed up the already embarrassingly quick games?

  • CosmicParagonCosmicParagon Member Posts: 959

    The answer is nothing. The killer already takes a massive risk in running a totem, and the Twins are the only killer that can be in 2 places at once. Either tough it out and do gens, or pop the totem while the killer is busy.

  • Demogordon_RamsayDemogordon_Ramsay Member Posts: 1,503

    Cleansing bones is already fast and easy. It doesn't need a massive buff like that.

  • TragicSolitudeTragicSolitude Member Posts: 5,080

    Hex totems are already super risky. There's no world in which I think a survivor should be able to instantly remove one of the killer's perks. The killer only gets four perks. There should be no instant way to completely remove one of the killer's only four perks from the entire match. Unless it requires like 20 tokens. Okay, you stun the killer 20 times or get 20 hook saves, then sure, you can kick the hex totem.

    Wait, what do I care, I don't even run hex totems. Ya know what, nevermind. Let's get this perk fast-tracked. I want survivors to waste their perk slots with this in my matches.

  • dezzmontdezzmont Member Posts: 476

    I could see something to let you just pop totems faster, but the downside would need to be truly ridiculous. Otherwise you get something like an OoO situation where it breaks the game when SWF can play entirely around the downside.

    Hexes are already a huge risk and result in the killer (ideally slowly) getting weaker as time goes on, forcing them to exploit the hexes early and midgame. Fast hex clear counters not just hexes, but a lot of hex protection abilities like TOTH and Undying that exist to allow the killer to play around hexes, which kinda sucks.

    So while it would be possible to design a 'fair' way to do this, that doesn't mean it would be a good design, because the differences in potential outcomes diverge a lot: You don't want the best case scenario for this perk and the worst case scenario to be too disparate (Which is already a problem with hexes, by the way, and why undying is a good design, it 'evens out' the expected results of Hexes to their baseline even if people bring anti-hex stuff like maps).

    In the case of this perk, lets take the 'you become exposed' effect idea. Being exposed is low key a not as powerful version of being injured and generally is only relevant when its a surprise. A smart SWF team can really exploit any limited duration self expose by just tracking the killer and having the exposed party play edge of map for a bit while other people play centrally to know where the killer is. But even an 'Your exposed until your next down' effect would be weird for this perk, despite how awful that seems for survivors. Why would you want to insta-clense one totem if the killer isn't pressuring you? If the killer is pressuring you, you would only expose yourself if your very confident or the totem is critical, removing the ability for the killer to use a totem at the cost of just 1 hook state, which isn't very much.

    So it would need to be even worse than even 'perma-expose...' but that just makes it more and more solidly a 'It basically costs 1 hook state cuz I am not going to kick if I don't need it to get the totem anyway' ability. There are other ways to balance it (ex: The survivor with this perk literally can't repair gens until ALL totems are gone would make the downside actually matter, and make it useful for your team's totem hunter) but they still create wild game variance (imagine someone with this just not finding a totem or not being able to reach it at all, or the map being huge) in a way that isn't fun.

    Any anti-totem perk is a perk that lets survivors essentially remove a perk slot (or more) from killers, which is why the design space for it is very limited. Survivors already have a perk number advantage, so 1:1 negation (ignoring 1 perk can shut down MULTIPLE killer perks) is just... not good. Survivor perks are meant to be more personal and have less impact on the killer as much as on themselves, compared to the killer's perks which generally affect the entire tone of the game (especially hex perks, which are meant to be powerful global abilities the survivors have to actively think about).

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