Uhm . . . if you people want to be like " Camping is a strategy we don't encourage " ; well SWF is a strategy then.
Get over it. Games are meant to be played with friends and generally not all of them are on the same level. The game literally has you able to add people on other consoles and outside of your PS friends for ONLY in the game. They WANT you to play with friends because that is literally what games are FOR.
The game isn't so unbalanced that SWF makes much of a difference at all. Killers don't want to hear it but they do have quite the lean in terms of who is favored. Sorry, but you do. If you're getting spun by survivors ? I'm sorry but they're good and you're probably just not at their level like you think you are. Sorry, but it's a lot harder to loop and run a killer than it is to chase and one-shot or hit over pallets. ( I would know. I hate first person and I got to Rank 5 near rank 4 in 3 nights of playing killer as Trickster from rank 13 and I NEVER play killer. )
Survivors have a limited amount of " safety " in the form of pallets , they're on limited lives and even if you manage to not have sacrificed one or two by the time they have 3 gens done . . . they're probably on their last hooks and the gens they have left are either close together or ones in the center they're not ballsy enough for. I'd know, they always try and go for ones around the edges as much as they can with coverage and leave the ones in the open for last which is a big no-no. ( Since you could actually be more likely to finish the out in the open ones when you've got more people to do them with or distractions. )
It's not potentially since deathgarden is the proof
Poeple assume SWF is OP.
My whole team is bad and, I would generally assume the same for most people who just want to play with friends.
Now all Red ranked SWF might be another issue but, how many people is that, my guess, not many.
I feel this, when playing survivor, I spend these days solo queueing about 80% of the time - I recently lost my job so sad to say DBD is the only thing keeping my mind busy lately, but a couple nights a week I play with a group. We honestly just dick around a lot of the time and just end up sandbagging eachother. If we aren't meme perkin', 2-3 of us run bond and 2 of us run kindred cause we rarely communicate anything because we get into in depth convos about random bullshit while we play or scream because we got scared by a mikey with scratched mirror or something. I honest to god escape more solo queue matches than our swf matches. I'm glad bhvr hasn't listened to the swf nerfs over the years ( like limiting perks to 1, or no one can run the same perk - you will take our slippery meat builds from our cold, dead bodies!)
I'm fairly confident this is the norm.
I've been playing more killer lately than survivor, I'd say maybe 60/40 at this point - and while I only maybe have 50-70hrs in killer, I straight up have only faced 1 sweaty swf team (a rank 1 survivor, rank 5, and 2 20's) when I was at rank 13 from the reset, so not red rank by any means. It was awful, yeah, way above the rank I'd normally be playing at - but I mean, I'm not going to get better if I just play babies or destroy uncoordinated solo queuer's all the time. People only remember the sweaty games where they lose, but forget they probably face swf and not even know it on a daily basis.
Idk, just my 2 cents, if it's worth anything
I saw the deleted comment about tournaments.
Okay, so OP wants to nerf swf because of people who already go into the game with the mindset of 'winning at all costs' (who usually have only one MO that is pretty damn easy to counter once you realized it's that kind of group). they're on coms because they can't stand the idea of not 'winning', compared to quite probably the majority of users who rather 'try to win', but not at all costs.
just look at average NON BNF streams when there's a group. usually it's just chaos.
the idea that bhvr won't do anything 'because it makes money'... i know the community loves it and I often enough do get that feeling myself, but in this case it's really rather because you'd be punishing the many for the sins of the few
Every match isn't SWF. Stop blaming SWF because you lost.
Literally get better at killer. If every group of friends is rolling you so hard you feel the need to come to the forums and ask for swf nerfs then you could probably use a few depips. I'm not the greatest killer on the planet but I still sit at rank 1 and double pip most games even against your average swf because every team isn't a tournament squad. Most swfs are like 1 or 2 really good loopers and the rest just hold m1 and think it's fun to be playing with friends. Don't waste the whole game chasing the good ones and recognize when you've lost a chase.
Can you name any game that penalizes players for playing with their friends?
Honest question. I don't know of any, but if there were examples maybe we could learn a lesson or two from their successes. Or failures.
There is no way to nerf SWF because the advantages inherent to SWF come from outside the game. If you were to try to nerf SWF, you'd just end up nerfing solo survivors.
Even if your wish to nerf SWF come true, how do you want to balance it? Why should the 4 friend messing whith each other after work get the same debuff as the 4 man depip squad? Because essentialy the first team may be even weaker than a solo queue, but they will still get nerfed because some player are annoyed about the 10% of swf that are efficient.
When will this community understand that it is by bringing solo closer to swf by giving them more information (kindred teamates aura base kit, indication that a survivor started a chase ect.) that then we will be able to buff killer accordingly, thus making them have a better chance against those efficient swf.
So in answer to this post, yes, nerfing swf will make the game lose his playerbase, because most of the team that will be nerfed are those that have nothing to do with the problem.
What's wrong with that? I play with my friends with no call because I play late and I can't be loud and I'm still playing normally with them what's wrong with that?
Who is "Devs" and why does he decide what's best for the game.
Solo queue needs a buff, not the other way round. Additionally, most swf aren't that good anyways, and I'm a killer main.
Killers really need to stop thinking that SWF is activating some secret Godmode. 4 Potatoes playing in an SWF will not turn into Team Oracle, they will be 4 Potatoes on Comms.
The only problematic teams are tournament squads and you dont even see them in public games.
Every Killer has probably beaten hundreds of 4 man SWFs already, what should those groups do when they get nerfed? Lose even harder?
Action speed debuff. If two people are in swf, those two suffer action speed debuff of 15% on healing and repair. If its 3 or 4 people, than 3 or 4 people suffer the action debuff.
The biggest issue with swf is that they complete objective way faster than solo because they get many information perks for free to optimize healing & repair. The chases are about the same and rely on individual skill-level. In the end, SWF is just power-trip for survivor. A power-trip that is forbidden to talk about and that killers just have to get good.
That will also affect solo survivors who happen to be in a lobby with SWF.
I mean you're not wrong. But the coordination of a SWF, even a casual one, is really beneficial. It inevitably makes the game much harder because each member of the SWF knows when to go for a safe, when to work on a gens, what perks the killer might be using or just straight up where the killer is most of the time.
It doesn't improve their individual skills, but it does improve their teamwork. Seeing how most of the killers we have are mostly designed to be really strong in a 1v1 but really aren't as strong in the 4v1 (Deathslinger, Nemesis, Huntress, Clown, ...), it does create some issues. There is also just the aspect of ranking: in red ranks, there aren't that many potato SWF that are just completely terrible and only make bad choices during the game.
It's really just a complete mess, originating from terribly designed killers who are oppressive in the 1v1 (and as a result will be really strong against soloqueue due to their lack of coordination) but will struggle against the 4v1 (which only gets worse if you add some coordination to it). The irony of it all is that most people absolutely hate going against these 1v1 killers as well, whether they are soloqueue or in a SWF, because their powers are just borderline stupid so there really aren't any winners in this situation.
"SWF isn't the problem, 3rd party communication software is the problem" - me every single time a "nerf SWF" topic pops up
I doubt you get a lot of 4man SWF, its mostly 2man squad.
How do devs can nerf SWF? markibg communication apps as hacks?
Additionally, any buff to the survivor basekit will also buff "swf".
In my opinion, the only thing to close the gap, without buffing the people who already use comms, is to add voicechat in the game.
A custom message system like "do gens" etc would not close the gap completely, but not buff swf.
A ping system is enhancing/gets enhanced by Comms as the ping either gets a better explanation or the "im chased by killer" gets a location.
SWFs are fair, voice chat softwares are not
If voice chat is fair why do stealth killers or perks like tinkerer kindred or bond even exist?
VC is the real problem here and it isn't fair if it isn't an official feature
obviously. it is swf game/lobby. don't worry, this was not interesting. Nerf freddy was more important.
Nerfing SWF will also nerf solo, buffing solo will also buff SWF, but not to the same degree. You can give solo players what SWF players already have anyway. Yes, it will still buff SWF slightly, but not that much. But at the end the global Killer vs Survivor balance will have to be readjusted anyway, so it's not a problem.
Another big advantage to buffing solo instead of nerfing SWF is related to programming issues. If you want to nerf SWF, you have to make a lot of special cases in the code (the famous "Spaghetti-code"), since you will have to differentiate between solo and SWF players in the code, which is more time consuming, less error-prone and will make creation of new content much more problematic.
And the last problem with nerfing SWF is that there are too many kinds of SWF groups: 2-man, 3-man, 4-man and some of them are on comms and others are not. That's too many variants of strength of an SWF groups to deal with selectively and you can't even find out if an SWF group is using comms. Thus a much better approach is to buff all survivors to the information/strength level of a 4-man SWF with comms and buff killers to the same level at the same time.
So, the only right way to close the solo vs SWF gap is to buff solo and killers.
######### is this statement? VC exist in any game and because almost any gamer uses discord and/or teamspeak or whatever it is almost never imolemented in the game itself.
Seeing how toxic is end game chat or other games who suffer from in-game chat (Overwatch) its better to have external one
just make it so swfs can't run duplicate perks and it would be a lot more bearable
The other games are not asymmetrical survival horror games, and this game is not a shooter nor a party game
This game is not designed to be played with VC, and the results are evident
why not? is it written somewhere in rules?
Game is not designed for so many things and nurse is just one of them yet it works
Because stealth and lack of information are factors in this game
And is it balanced?