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I'm worried that the Dead Hard rework won't change its core issues

DoritoHeadDoritoHead Member Posts: 3,319

It'll absolutely be less useful in many situations, but I think that it will remain what caused it to be such a big problem in the first place- a perk that allows survivors to get away when they should go down.

The most obvious problem is that if there's no queue for it to activate such as a special animation, then killers will not know if it's active or not. I really hope they keep its animation, as weird as it would look when moving at normal speed.

Secondly, New DH can in some cases guarantee survivors won't go down at pallets or windows. Although it's niche and the timing must be just right, If the survivor anticipates that they will go down, all they need to do is press E before vaulting the window or pallet. In addition, Dh will still be able to prevent being hit by projectiles and be even more effective than before in the case of Trickster, Bubba, Billy, Pig, Blight, Oni and Nurse because instead of dodging a hit, you take the hit instead and get a speed boost.

All that being said, I certainly think that DH won't be as problematic or unhealthy as before- for Certain killers at least. M1 killers will definitely benefit from this change.


  • legacycoltlegacycolt Member Posts: 1,363

    At least it’ll still be good against nurse.

  • RenRenRenRen Member Posts: 1,351

    Maybe they will add some sort of animation to see it activate, though I will say that even if they add an animation, if the survivors have a good connection and good reaction speed, it's still basically the same.

  • DoritoHeadDoritoHead Member Posts: 3,319

    if rubberbanding isn't fixed new DH will be so painful to go against lol

  • drsoontmdrsoontm Member Posts: 2,460

    That's kind of what I expect too. It feels better than before to me, in the sense there is more margin of error for the survivor.

  • HexPleaseLetMeSpeakHexPleaseLetMeSpeak Member Posts: 276

    Yes but the other exhaustion perks usually SET UP a chase and don't benefit much mid chase. Smash hit and balanced are very niche and don't happen often. Dead hard is literally there to be used mid chase, doesn't matter how long the chase has been, and then just extend it even longer making the killer waste even more time.

  • neotaxneotax Member Posts: 13

    DH was not only strong because of the distance and the iframe but because you could completely ignore killer abilities e.g. Trappers traps, or Deathslinger's shots etc. And that is no longer possible with the new effect.

  • Science_GuyScience_Guy Member Posts: 1,659

    That's a feature, not a bug.

    SB's ability to set up a a favorable chase environment is going to far outshine whatever utility players manage to salvage from this weakened DH.

  • HexPleaseLetMeSpeakHexPleaseLetMeSpeak Member Posts: 276

    Think u replied to the wrong thing because I never mentioned anything about a bug.

  • SlowpeachSlowpeach Member Posts: 438

    Honestly I still think DH will be the exhaustion perk of choice. It can still be used for distance. 1 second is a very long time and often makes the difference over whether you make a pallet or window. It also still can be activated whenever the user desires.

    I dunno I really wish they just changed what it did entirely. Sniffing the survivors butt just sucks.

  • KaitsjaKaitsja Member Posts: 915

    This rework removes the Dead Hard for distance issue. I think we'll see Dead Hard's usage reduced, and an increase in Sprint Burst and Overcome.

  • DoritoHeadDoritoHead Member Posts: 3,319

    Other exhaustion perks have some sort of condition to activate, the only exception being Sprint Burst if you 99 it.

    Lithe? Need a window.

    Overcome? Need to get hit.

    Balanced Landing? Need a high place.

    The problem with DH is that you can use it any time you want to guarantee you don’t go down, most often when the killer would have otherwise caught you.

  • MazoobiMazoobi Member Posts: 1,339

    They removed the distance aspect, right? Perhaps it'll be a lot easier to deal with :p

  • DoritoHeadDoritoHead Member Posts: 3,319

    Are you saying you want it to be 100% useless?

    In a word, yes.

  • ramon46ramon46 Member Posts: 6

    I personally would've rather keep the dead hard for distance, but remove the invulnerable part. My biggest problem is deadharding through traps (which i guess isn't possible anymore), or hatchets clearly hitting but not damaging.

  • Grandpa_Crack_PipeGrandpa_Crack_Pipe Member Posts: 2,681

    Aaaaall it needs is 1 second of Endurance and 2 seconds of Incapacitated. That's it. DH at pallets and windows, fixed.

    Did you fail to read the DH? Hit endured, they speed away, all is well. Did you successfully read the DH? They can't pull the pallet down or vault the window, got 'em.

  • CybilCybil Member Posts: 612

    I really need to see the rework in action before I can judge it.

  • SeraphorSeraphor Member Posts: 4,266
    edited June 24

    A well timed DH was always fine. If you swing, and at the same time they dash forward and dodge the hit, that's DH working as intended. Complaining about that is simply complaining about survivors using the perks they have available, which is on par with complaining about killers running BBQ or MYC.

    No, the problems with DH have always been abusing it for things that aren't intended; using DH purely for making distance (hitting E when the killer is nowhere close to striking distance, but still allows you to make a vault, pallet or exit gate, doesn't require any sense of timing) and using DH to avoid killer powers like bear traps.

    Both of which have now been removed as possibilities.

    It's a healthy change, regardless if the 'as intended' effect is a slight buff or not.

  • TheLastHookTheLastHook Member Posts: 329
    edited June 24
  • MrMoriMrMori Member Posts: 578
    edited June 24

    Using Dead Hard to "reach" a pallet or window is in no way different than using Dead Hard when less than 1s away from a window or pallet to guarantee that you can drop/vault safely. It also doesn't fix killers mindgaming the survivor, going for the swing and then getting Dead Harded, since now you'll just hit them normally and they'll get a speedboost. The only time new DH is any worse is already dropped pallets, since you can grab them there.

    I hate it, but we simply have to wait till PTB to see. If the window was a lot lower, like 0.6 seconds, but the reward was a speedboost similar to Smash Hit I'd be on board. 1 second is far longer than people think.

    And just like someone else mentioned, killers are tired of having to wait out their swing and "bait" out their opponents god damn Street Fighter Counter Attack move. Let us swing at survivors that are in our range, please. That's all I want.

  • SeraphorSeraphor Member Posts: 4,266

    The difference is current DH can be used at any point in the 10 or so seconds up to the pallet or vault, and the survivor will still make it. It's guaranteed and requires no sense of timing.

    Waiting out a dead hard might be irritating, but it's a fair shot. Either one of you can mess it up. The trick is to get right behind the survivor and don't lunge, this gives you a 50/50 shot.

    Currently waiting out a dead hard still gives the survivor extra time, because even if they pop it early, they still get the distance and still extend the chase. Now if they pop dead hard too early, they gain no distance, you wait 1s for the animation to finish, then you smack them.

  • MrMoriMrMori Member Posts: 578

    You might be right that it'll be a little better to play against as M1. At least someone like Wraith can fake hits and stuff, and Slinger will basically own new DH. We'll just have to wait and see.

    I'm just so incredibly tired of having to "bait" this perk with my attack. Let me swing, man. But, if it drops in usage and stays down as people notice it's not as easy to use, then I'll not mind it as much. Yeah this PTB can't come soon enough.

  • C3ToothC3Tooth Member Posts: 4,862

    The Incapacitate is a good idea.. Because between new & old DH, its will not be much different at window/pallet.

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