Deranking discussion

13

Comments

  • micsanmicsan Member Posts: 95

    @PandaChris said:

    A whole bunch of stuff

    I agree that quoting becomes ridiculous after a while...anyways!

    As someone who's both rank 1 survivor and rank 1 killer, have been ever since I started the game. First three weeks of playing the game as survivor only I managed to get to rank 1 survivor. Next reset I started playing killer as well and hit rank 1 on both for the first time, my second season of being introduced to this game. Once you know the meta, it's not that hard. Once you know how to catch every survivor within 2 minutes maximum, it's really not as hard as many killers should make it seem.

    To get into a toxic swf game, that doesn't happen often enough to warrant getting SO fussed up about it. It can not be compared to the 45 minute wait time, the odd time you get into a game vs toxic survivors.

    That is my point. If you think that getting into swf groups.... OK, let's be real. It's not just SWF groups that you are having trouble against, it's good survivors that play as a group. You do not need voice comms for this. Some survivors just know certain things. For instance, If I'm across the map sitting on a gen, and you get hooked...I'm going to leave you hanging, even if I don't know where any of the other survivors are. Sure, there is a slight chance that you will either go to second phase or even die, but chances are way higher that there is at least one other survivor closer then I. Having voice comms doesn't make or break the game, like many would make it seem. You don't need to be in swf to make the killers day a living hell. The odd game you can get 4 rando survivors that will gen rush as hard as if they where swf, maybe even harder then most SWFs because most SWFs suck. If you still think that most SWFs are toxic genrushing machines, you are dead wrong. You are letting those few games dictate your entire experience with DbD.

    If you think it's comparable to be in even 45 minutes of PURE toxic SWFness to 45 minute lobby simulator, you obviously have not played enough on both sides. Either not enough survivor to waste enough time in lobby, or enough killer to actually not get [BAD WORD] in the ass all the time.

    If you really do feel like you are wasting your time, then you should simply stop playing like a lot of people are doing right now. But to put this blame on survivors is completely pointless. I mean, it's not like I'm blaming killers for these queue times, only the dodging part of it.

    I believe that there is a although small, but yet important, part of the reason for killers dodging lobbies is simply that they are not that good at the game.

    Hell, just yesterday someone made a video about how to deal with every single loop in the game as killer and had JenDenise (Pretty sure most people here know who Jendenise is and that she is insane) play as survivor and play VS him just to show how even a survivor with 7000 hours on the game can be beaten within 1-2 minutes of chasing, unless you suck and get mindgamed at every loop.

    Which is exactly what 99% of every single person I've discussed this with seems to keep forgetting, if you are in a chase for longer than a minute or two, you've lost this chase.

    I feel like I'm wasting my time when 15 min to get to a lobby then dodged as survivor, so I've quit the game. Waiting eagerly for them to fix. If you feel like you're wasting your time in anything, you should not keep giving them your time.

  • micsanmicsan Member Posts: 95

    @inkedsoulz said:

    >

    Depends on the survivor, a bad survivor will probably go down very fast after using DS, but a good survivor....
    They will take you for a ride even if you have Enduring.

    And lets not talk about the unsuspected DS's(the one's that are not the obsesion)....

    I mean, it's supposed to do that though...depend on the survivors skill and killers I guess (in the form of trying to place the DS far away from hooks, dribbling a little or something.)

    @PandaChris example of a perfect counter is in my opinion a broken counter.

    Having something in game that simply nullifies something else (Enduring removing the effects of DS entirely for example) would be extremely unfun.

  • MasterMaster Member Posts: 8,419

    @micsan said:

    @inkedsoulz said:

    >

    Depends on the survivor, a bad survivor will probably go down very fast after using DS, but a good survivor....
    They will take you for a ride even if you have Enduring.

    And lets not talk about the unsuspected DS's(the one's that are not the obsesion)....

    I mean, it's supposed to do that though...depend on the survivors skill and killers I guess (in the form of trying to place the DS far away from hooks, dribbling a little or something.)

    @PandaChris example of a perfect counter is in my opinion a broken counter.

    Having something in game that simply nullifies something else (Enduring removing the effects of DS entirely for example) would be extremely unfun.

    You mean sth like swf nullifying knock out or more like Ds nullifying the killers achievement down a survivor?

  • micsanmicsan Member Posts: 95
    edited January 21

    @Master said:
    You mean sth like swf nullifying knock out or more like Ds nullifying the killers achievement down a survivor?

    SWF doesn't counter knockout, "I'm by the L-walls close to the gate." you still have to look for him..."well, where tf is that?"

    Hardly an argument....If anything should be argued in regards to knockout, it should be that it is broken when players are NOT in SWF. If the killer only slugs, never hooks, it's going to be incredibly time consuming to run around the entire map looking or trying to hear the downed survivors.

    DS "nullify the achievemnt down a survivor" <- doesn't make sense, but i'll try to respond.

    DS, has to hit a hard skillcheck to be successful and has a one time use. To be fair to your point, DS "nullifies" one of the two hits required to down a survivor, by using this hard to hit skillcheck one time use ability. Still, far from being a broken counter, it is as soft as it can be without being removed. They could maybe reduce the stun duration from 3-3.5-4 to 2-2.5-3, but it wouldn't make much of a difference. People will still complain about this until it's removed or reworked, simply because of how devastating it CAN be when a really good survivor runs it. Key point here being a REALLY GOOD SURVIVOR, as in they would run circles around you if you don't know how to do loops as killer anyway. In reality, DS effectively gives you one extra health state once per game, hardly anything broken in and of itself. My reasoning for this is because if you imagine you got hit instead of downed the second hit, you would get a sprint burst and distance that would be equal to that of a DS stun, maybe a little bit less.

    If SWF and DS really is that hard for you, you simply need to practice chasing as a killer more. It really isn't going to make or break the game, which is what an unbalanced perk\add on or whatever will do.

    If a survivor sucks and has DS, he will not win against a good killer.
    If a survivor sucks and is in SWF, he will not win against a good killer.

  • MasterMaster Member Posts: 8,419

    @micsan said:

    @Master said:
    You mean sth like swf nullifying knock out or more like Ds nullifying the killers achievement down a survivor?

    SWF doesn't counter knockout, "I'm by the L-walls close to the gate." you still have to look for him..."well, where tf is that?"

    Hardly an argument....If anything should be argued in regards to knockout, it should be that it is broken when players are NOT in SWF. If the killer only slugs, never hooks, it's going to be incredibly time consuming to run around the entire map looking or trying to hear the downed survivors.

    DS "nullify the achievemnt down a survivor" <- doesn't make sense, but i'll try to respond.

    DS, has to hit a hard skillcheck to be successful and has a one time use. To be fair to your point, DS "nullifies" one of the two hits required to down a survivor, by using this hard to hit skillcheck one time use ability. Still, far from being a broken counter, it is as soft as it can be without being removed. They could maybe reduce the stun duration from 3-3.5-4 to 2-2.5-3, but it wouldn't make much of a difference. People will still complain about this until it's removed or reworked, simply because of how devastating it CAN be when a really good survivor runs it. Key point here being a REALLY GOOD SURVIVOR, as in they would run circles around you if you don't know how to do loops as killer anyway. In reality, DS effectively gives you one extra health state once per game, hardly anything broken in and of itself. My reasoning for this is because if you imagine you got hit instead of downed the second hit, you would get a sprint burst and distance that would be equal to that of a DS stun, maybe a little bit less.

    If SWF and DS really is that hard for you, you simply need to practice chasing as a killer more. It really isn't going to make or break the game, which is what an unbalanced perk\add on or whatever will do.

    If a survivor sucks and has DS, he will not win against a good killer.
    If a survivor sucks and is in SWF, he will not win against a good killer.

    SWF counters knockout indeed.

    If you cant hit the DS skillcheck, then you need to git gud, no other way to put this, sorry....

    Exactly, a good survivor will loop you and thats the reason why DS is so good. Nobody as an issue playing against potato survivors either missing the skillcheck or going down a few seconds later.

    So its fine that a good killer wins only if the survivors suck? :smile:

  • PiiFreePiiFree Member Posts: 477

    @micsan said:
    Hell, just yesterday someone made a video about how to deal with every single loop in the game as killer and had JenDenise (Pretty sure most people here know who Jendenise is and that she is insane) play as survivor and play VS him just to show how even a survivor with 7000 hours on the game can be beaten within 1-2 minutes of chasing, unless you suck and get mindgamed at every loop.

    Do you have a link to said video?

  • TigerKirby215TigerKirby215 Member Posts: 441

    This is why these forums needed to keep the "LOL" reaction.

  • inkedsoulzinkedsoulz Member Posts: 93

    @micsan said:

    Hell, just yesterday someone made a video about how to deal with every single loop in the game as killer and had JenDenise (Pretty sure most people here know who Jendenise is and that she is insane) play as survivor and play VS him just to show how even a survivor with 7000 hours on the game can be beaten within 1-2 minutes of chasing, unless you suck and get mindgamed at every loop.

    2 Minutes of chase is more than enough for the rest of the survivors to finish 3 gens.

    Even if the killer is good, and never gets mindgamed and plays every loop perfect, as you say it takes around 2 minutes to chase down a good survivor. Each gen takes around 100 seconds to complete(if only 1 survivor is working on it) thats easily 3 gens completed on those 2 minutes of chase.

    So the reward for the killer for playing perfect is losing the game when he/she is against a good survivor.
    Just shows how strong survivors are on this game.

    When the survivors are good, no matter what the killer(or how skilled he/she is) does, he/she will lose.
    Except when the killer is the Nurse, in this case is about the Nurses's skill, if the Nurse is skilled enough, no matter how good the survivors are, they cant win.

  • inkedsoulzinkedsoulz Member Posts: 93

    @micsan said:
    Hell, just yesterday someone made a video about how to deal with every single loop in the game as killer and had JenDenise (Pretty sure most people here know who Jendenise is and that she is insane) play as survivor and play VS him just to show how even a survivor with 7000 hours on the game can be beaten within 1-2 minutes of chasing, unless you suck and get mindgamed at every loop.

    2 minutes is more than enough for the rest of the team to finish 3 gens.

    So if the killer plays every loop perfect and is never mindgamed, like you said a good survivor will go down in around 2 minutes. Thing is, if you chase someone for around 2 minutes, you already lost the game.

    No matter what the killer does or how good he/she is, they cant really win when vsing good survivors.

    Except when the killer is Nurse, then its about how good the Nurse is, if the Nurse is good enough, there is nothing survivors can do, no matter how good they are, they will lose.

    Just shows how strong survivors are on this game, when there is only 1 killer that can be reliable on dictating the pace of the game.

  • CarpemortumCarpemortum Member Posts: 534
    Looping is bad game design? You mean outrunning, or outsmarting a murderous killer while you have NO way to fight back is a shit idea? 

    😆 [1] LOL!
  • micsanmicsan Member Posts: 95

    @Master said:
    So its fine that a good killer wins only if the survivors suck? :smile:

    Depends entirely on your definition of winning. 4k, then yes.

    @PiiFree said:

    @micsan said:
    Hell, just yesterday someone made a video about how to deal with every single loop in the game as killer and had JenDenise (Pretty sure most people here know who Jendenise is and that she is insane) play as survivor and play VS him just to show how even a survivor with 7000 hours on the game can be beaten within 1-2 minutes of chasing, unless you suck and get mindgamed at every loop.

    Do you have a link to said video?

    Sure do mate,
    I recommend everyone to take the time to watch this, survivor or killer doesn't matter. It's extremely useful information.

    @inkedsoulz said:

    2 minutes is more than enough for the rest of the team to finish 3 gens.

    So if the killer plays every loop perfect and is never mindgamed, like you said a good survivor will go down in around 2 minutes. Thing is, if you chase someone for around 2 minutes, you already lost the game.

    No matter what the killer does or how good he/she is, they cant really win when vsing good survivors.

    Just shows how strong survivors are on this game, when there is only 1 killer that can be reliable on dictating the pace of the game.

    If you do chase someone for 2 minutes, and they do 3 gens you are still on pace to win in the eyes of Behaviour who has balanced this game towards getting two kills. Getting a 4k is like getting a flawless victory in a fighting game, by getting 4k the survivors never had a chance.

    If you think otherwise, there is no wonder why you never feel like you can "win" against survivors.

  • thesuicidefoxthesuicidefox Member Posts: 2,567
    edited January 22

    Last night I ran into a depipping killer twice. He didn't offer anything or use any add-ons. He would wait until the game loaded in then quit immediately to depip by 2 pips. Made us lose our offerings both times. The first time he was around rank 3, the second time he was at rank 6 meaning he did it many times. This is unacceptable. I reported him but this is Xbox so IDK what will happen if anything. If you're gonna do that at least have the courtesy to message the survivors so we know not to use offerings (or leave if we don't want the free 5k BP).

  • PiiFreePiiFree Member Posts: 477

    @micsan said:
    If you do chase someone for 2 minutes, and they do 3 gens you are still on pace to win in the eyes of Behaviour who has balanced this game towards getting two kills. Getting a 4k is like getting a flawless victory in a fighting game, by getting 4k the survivors never had a chance.

    If you think otherwise, there is no wonder why you never feel like you can "win" against survivors.

    Thanks for the vid, will watch it later.

    A lot of 4k's happen randomly due to incompetence or overaltruism of survivors.

    I often have matches where I get one hook when the gates are powered and I still ended up with a 4k in the end because they want the 4x escape so badly. It's more that Killers had ONE chance for the 4k while Survivors had 100 chances for a 3x escape but apparently 3x escape is not enough, so they throw the game and end up with no escapes at all. "Survivors never had a chance" is a very rare case in Rank 1, for a 4k it requires 4 survivors to mess up.

  • micsanmicsan Member Posts: 95

    @PiiFree said:

    @micsan said:
    If you do chase someone for 2 minutes, and they do 3 gens you are still on pace to win in the eyes of Behaviour who has balanced this game towards getting two kills. Getting a 4k is like getting a flawless victory in a fighting game, by getting 4k the survivors never had a chance.

    If you think otherwise, there is no wonder why you never feel like you can "win" against survivors.

    Thanks for the vid, will watch it later.

    A lot of 4k's happen randomly due to incompetence or overaltruism of survivors.

    I often have matches where I get one hook when the gates are powered and I still ended up with a 4k in the end because they want the 4x escape so badly. It's more that Killers had ONE chance for the 4k while Survivors had 100 chances for a 3x escape but apparently 3x escape is not enough, so they throw the game and end up with no escapes at all. "Survivors never had a chance" is a very rare case in Rank 1, for a 4k it requires 4 survivors to mess up.

    Your welcome, it is a gamechanger for those who don't know how to deal with these loops already. I admit I was doing the window loop at shack that he shows how to avoid really easily. I guess I was just under the impression that shack was OP, because of how many people say it is. I can deal with the shack loop which was giving me way too much trouble.

    In your example of getting one hook when gates are powered or even opened and still getting a 4k, that is exactly what I mean about not every SWF being toxic or unbeatable. Very few SWFs will willingly sacrifice one of their team and you end up getting more kills then you should have. When me and my mates play swf, I'm often one to sacrifice myself because I got most of the perks that I want. In reality, I play way worse with my friends then I do when solo.

    It's just sad that such a huge percentage of killers don't realize this and base their entire SWF experience on those few games where they were vastly outskilled and it being a SWF. Even at rank 1 you rarely have people sacrificing their teammates, and I suspect that is because rank 1 people don't give a shit about rank and a lot of them have p3 everything so they don't care about BPs either.

  • MasterMaster Member Posts: 8,419

    @thesuicidefox said:
    Last night I ran into a depipping killer twice. He didn't offer anything or use any add-ons. He would wait until the game loaded in then quit immediately to depip by 2 pips. Made us lose our offerings both times. The first time he was around rank 3, the second time he was at rank 6 meaning he did it many times. This is unacceptable. I reported him but this is Xbox so IDK what will happen if anything. If you're gonna do that at least have the courtesy to message the survivors so we know not to use offerings (or leave if we don't want the free 5k BP).

    We are not supposed to report DCing. There is an automatic system that will trigger if the DC rate exceeds an absurdly high rate. Certain fogstreamers have proved already that its ok to dernak by DCing in order to hover at certain ranks.

    Oh and just a note, you will get punished for falsefy reporting too :wink:

  • AshleyWBAshleyWB Member Posts: 1,360
    Anyone who boasts about winning while in a swf are either blind at the imbalance or stupid. 
    Bringing in good items with white wards because you can't risk losing them is not something to be boasted about.
    When you feel you should all bring d strike for a free escape is nothing to boast about, even if you miss the skill check.
    When the killer suspects you have deliverance and makes sure you don't have a chance to use it, that's the survivors lack of skill to survive long enough to make a save.

    I hereby order all swf groups to pay the swf tax in which allocates 5% of their bloodpoints towards solo survivors.
  • TRGrayblesTRGraybles Member Posts: 144

    @witulo said:

    • Looping (BAD GAME DESIGN)
    • Camping (BAD GAME DESIGN)
    • Hatch (BAD GAME DESIGN)
    • Huntress hatchets, Hillbilly chainsaw (Ridiculous collisions)
    • Decisive strike (Fixable, but devs are absolutely petrified to change it, pathetic really!)
    • Borrowed time (Revert the deep wounds change)
    • HEX perks (Why are these a thing seriously, did you forget its 1v4 people?)
    • SWF (Limit to two survivors)

    Deranking is fixed quite easily by making more viable killers, if streamers REALLY don't want to go against nurse and hillbilly, then make more than 2 viable killers. In addition to this STOP MAKING KILLERS ON YOUR PERCEIVED SUBJECTIVE VIEW OF FUN!

    • Most of this seems pretty on the nose, for the Hex Totems though they are gonna fix them in the next patch.
    • for SWF groups if you want to go with a full SWF group get a 5th friend to play the killer would also be an option.

    I do fully agree with the more viable killers, this game is a 1vs4 and Survivors should work together more but a lot of their perks give them way to much utility to badger a killer in solo style, that is just to unrealistic. BHVR seems to afraid to actually make a stronger killer system because they will scare away all the survivors if they do (but that would be a sulotion for the survivor queues that are now skyrocketing becasue no one really likes to play killers agains the SWF groups). And when they reply to question about it they give an answer like "We design killers to be fun, not poweful." tell me again how fun it is to play a killer that gets run ragged for 20m because he has no killing power what so ever?

  • WalterWh1teWalterWh1te Member Posts: 112
    still waiting for that official statement or any form of consequences (rank rework, adjustment of the dc threshold or whatever). guess its time to go to r15 and make some people uninstall.
  • MasterMaster Member Posts: 8,419

    @TRGraybles said:

    @witulo said:

    • Looping (BAD GAME DESIGN)
    • Camping (BAD GAME DESIGN)
    • Hatch (BAD GAME DESIGN)
    • Huntress hatchets, Hillbilly chainsaw (Ridiculous collisions)
    • Decisive strike (Fixable, but devs are absolutely petrified to change it, pathetic really!)
    • Borrowed time (Revert the deep wounds change)
    • HEX perks (Why are these a thing seriously, did you forget its 1v4 people?)
    • SWF (Limit to two survivors)

    Deranking is fixed quite easily by making more viable killers, if streamers REALLY don't want to go against nurse and hillbilly, then make more than 2 viable killers. In addition to this STOP MAKING KILLERS ON YOUR PERCEIVED SUBJECTIVE VIEW OF FUN!

    • Most of this seems pretty on the nose, for the Hex Totems though they are gonna fix them in the next patch.
    • for SWF groups if you want to go with a full SWF group get a 5th friend to play the killer would also be an option.

    I do fully agree with the more viable killers, this game is a 1vs4 and Survivors should work together more but a lot of their perks give them way to much utility to badger a killer in solo style, that is just to unrealistic. BHVR seems to afraid to actually make a stronger killer system because they will scare away all the survivors if they do (but that would be a sulotion for the survivor queues that are now skyrocketing becasue no one really likes to play killers agains the SWF groups). And when they reply to question about it they give an answer like "We design killers to be fun, not poweful." tell me again how fun it is to play a killer that gets run ragged for 20m because he has no killing power what so ever?

    You misunderstood something here.
    Fun for the survivors, not for the killer :wink:

  • PiiFreePiiFree Member Posts: 477

    @micsan said:
    It's just sad that such a huge percentage of killers don't realize this and base their entire SWF experience on those few games where they were vastly outskilled and it being a SWF. Even at rank 1 you rarely have people sacrificing their teammates, and I suspect that is because rank 1 people don't give a shit about rank and a lot of them have p3 everything so they don't care about BPs either.

    Just because the match ends with a 4k doesn't mean it was enjoyable for the Killer. If it takes me 5 gens to get a hook, that match was certainly not a funny experience for me. Yes, I might get lucky and 4k them, this is a very satisfying ending but the overall experience was just shitty because of those SWFs.

    I played in and against many different SWFs and they all have one thing in common. They all claim: "We just play for fun!". Thing is, they don't realize that their fun usually comes at the cost of the Killers fun. I'm guilty of this myself, when I played in a SWF with voice communication I always tried to be that guy to run the Killer for ages while keeping everyone updates about their doings and failures. I did it because it's fun for us and I knew that I was playing with competent players that will be there to safe me or push through gens while I get camped. We will win if the Killer tried to ruin our fun. if the Killer was actually skilled and managed to stomp us, we'd get upset and call them sweaty tryhard.

    From my experience, that's exactly how most SWFs play like. They might not be toxic per se but they still only care about their own fun, 4x escape is their number one priority and the Killers experience is mostly irrelevant, which is why I understand Killers that dodge them. If the Killer kills them, they're tryhards that don't know how to play for fun ect....

    It's my reflection after 2000 hours of playtime. SWFs are more likely to ruin the opposite players experience than the other way around.

  • micsanmicsan Member Posts: 95

    @PiiFree said:

    @micsan said:
    It's just sad that such a huge percentage of killers don't realize this and base their entire SWF experience on those few games where they were vastly outskilled and it being a SWF. Even at rank 1 you rarely have people sacrificing their teammates, and I suspect that is because rank 1 people don't give a shit about rank and a lot of them have p3 everything so they don't care about BPs either.

    Just because the match ends with a 4k doesn't mean it was enjoyable for the Killer. If it takes me 5 gens to get a hook, that match was certainly not a funny experience for me. Yes, I might get lucky and 4k them, this is a very satisfying ending but the overall experience was just shitty because of those SWFs.

    I played in and against many different SWFs and they all have one thing in common. They all claim: "We just play for fun!". Thing is, they don't realize that their fun usually comes at the cost of the Killers fun. I'm guilty of this myself, when I played in a SWF with voice communication I always tried to be that guy to run the Killer for ages while keeping everyone updates about their doings and failures. I did it because it's fun for us and I knew that I was playing with competent players that will be there to safe me or push through gens while I get camped. We will win if the Killer tried to ruin our fun. if the Killer was actually skilled and managed to stomp us, we'd get upset and call them sweaty tryhard.

    From my experience, that's exactly how most SWFs play like. They might not be toxic per se but they still only care about their own fun, 4x escape is their number one priority and the Killers experience is mostly irrelevant, which is why I understand Killers that dodge them. If the Killer kills them, they're tryhards that don't know how to play for fun ect....

    It's my reflection after 2000 hours of playtime. SWFs are more likely to ruin the opposite players experience than the other way around.

    I mean, in what game does anyone care about other people's fun? Especially in a PvP game.

    Some people do think it's fun to be a toxic sabo squad with comms as if they where a SWAT team, but I suspect they are in the minority. I've not spent even close to what you have, I started playing in Oktober and have probably spent 3-4 hours on average every day since then only very recently being turned off due to the [BAD WORD] up queue times for SWF. But, during that time I quickly got to rank 1 and have been playing at this rank for most of my gametime.

    My experience with SWFs is the opposite of yours, most of them are just altruistic suicide squads that are farming BP or just goofing around having fun. Also, I play on PS4 so there is no post game chat. This removes a lot of toxicity as people are usually angry or salty after a "bad game"(example being a SWF hugging the hooked survivor and you camp because of this, then they all die because of this) and simply lash out in the post game chat because it's there and available.

    On ps4 you need to create a chat room and invite the player you want to chat with (you can block all invites, btw), resulting in hardly anyone bothering with endgame chat toxicity.

    Also a side-note, If the killer is bad enough I know that some players will turn toxic because of this, simply because they are bad themselves and never actually get to be toxic. Friend of mine admitted to this one time and I told him to [BAD WORD] off with that shit.

  • PiiFreePiiFree Member Posts: 477

    @micsan said:
    I mean, in what game does anyone care about other people's fun? Especially in a PvP game.

    Many players expect you to care, or how do you explain the ~600 comments on my steam profile mainly coming from Survivors complaining about my playstyle? Sounds ridiculous? I've seen Killer profiles with over a thousand insulting comments because the Survivors didn't like their playstyle.

    @micsan said:
    Some people do think it's fun to be a toxic sabo squad with comms as if they where a SWAT team, but I suspect they are in the minority. I've not spent even close to what you have, I started playing in Oktober and have probably spent 3-4 hours on average every day since then only very recently being turned off due to the [BAD WORD] up queue times for SWF. But, during that time I quickly got to rank 1 and have been playing at this rank for most of my gametime.
    My experience with SWFs is the opposite of yours, most of them are just altruistic suicide squads that are farming BP or just goofing around having fun. Also, I play on PS4 so there is no post game chat. This removes a lot of toxicity as people are usually angry or salty after a "bad game"(example being a SWF hugging the hooked survivor and you camp because of this, then they all die because of this) and simply lash out in the post game chat because it's there and available.

    Fair enough, that's your experience. I can only speak for myself based on my personal experience and that's what I stated in my post. People have to realize that their own experience is not representative for the global dbd players experience. If people refuse to play against SWFs the yobviously have their reason for that. Maybe it's justified, maybe it's not but one thing I can say for sure: Someone that just started playing DbD doesn't even know that SWF exists. They just play the game andone day they'll notice a huge difference in playstyles, that's when they realize SWFs exist and that's the moment when they start to judge them and avoid them based on the experience they leave behind.

    @micsan said:
    Also a side-note, If the killer is bad enough I know that some players will turn toxic because of this, simply because they are bad themselves and never actually get to be toxic. Friend of mine admitted to this one time and I told him to [BAD WORD] off with that shit.

    You're the good guy that tries to make DbD a better place but trust me, many friends would join in and give the Killers twice the shit isntead to not piss off their friend(s).

  • micsanmicsan Member Posts: 95

    @PiiFree said:

    @micsan said:
    I mean, in what game does anyone care about other people's fun? Especially in a PvP game.

    Many players expect you to care, or how do you explain the ~600 comments on my steam profile mainly coming from Survivors complaining about my playstyle? Sounds ridiculous? I've seen Killer profiles with over a thousand insulting comments because the Survivors didn't like their playstyle.

    This is the case for many PvP games though, if you run a cheesy character or a cheesy strategy that generally requires little skill to pull off compared to how effective it is. Fighting games often suffer from this.

    This is pretty much what happens to a camper or tunneler.

    You simply have to stop caring about those messages, people are going to get salty in DbD because of how it is designed.

    Like you mentioned, people base their opinions off of their own experiences. If they've never experienced playing killer and that as a killer you need to hang around the hook if you know there is someone there right now.

    The killer has to camp or he is gimping himself and the survivors ONLY see that he is camping, not what they are doing themselves, which effectively gives him no other option then to camp or throw the game.

    In the end, you simply can not care about other people's fun. That's not your responsibility, that's Behaviours responsibility. There is a difference between being a dick, and not caring about other people's fun, though.

    @micsan said:
    Also a side-note, If the killer is bad enough I know that some players will turn toxic because of this, simply because they are bad themselves and never actually get to be toxic. Friend of mine admitted to this one time and I told him to [BAD WORD] off with that shit.

    You're the good guy that tries to make DbD a better place but trust me, many friends would join in and give the Killers twice the shit isntead to not piss off their friend(s).

    Mostly kids do that, there are a lot of kids in DbD so this is sort of unavoidable when interacting with them. Kids can be mean. Most adults don't do something they don't feel is right just to not piss off their friends. I mean, my friend stopped once I explained to him how it is to be a killer VSing a toxic survivor.

  • PiiFreePiiFree Member Posts: 477

    @micsan said:
    This is the case for many PvP games though, if you run a cheesy character or a cheesy strategy that generally requires little skill to pull off compared to how effective it is. Fighting games often suffer from this.

    This is pretty much what happens to a camper or tunneler.

    I'm playing on the same steam account since 10 years and I didn't receive a single profile comment until I started with DbD. I have 3000 hours in Dota 2; 2000 hours in ARK PvP and several hundred hours in other PvP games (CS, CoD,...).

    But the toxicity in DbD is another story, not really relevant to the topic (and neither is SWF now that I think about it).

    I think we ended up here because people compared "deranking on purpose" with "lobby dodging" which lead to SWF = dodge, which lead to SWF = unfun, which lead to "no one cares about the opposite sides fun".

  • thesuicidefoxthesuicidefox Member Posts: 2,567

    @Master said:

    @thesuicidefox said:
    Last night I ran into a depipping killer twice. He didn't offer anything or use any add-ons. He would wait until the game loaded in then quit immediately to depip by 2 pips. Made us lose our offerings both times. The first time he was around rank 3, the second time he was at rank 6 meaning he did it many times. This is unacceptable. I reported him but this is Xbox so IDK what will happen if anything. If you're gonna do that at least have the courtesy to message the survivors so we know not to use offerings (or leave if we don't want the free 5k BP).

    We are not supposed to report DCing. There is an automatic system that will trigger if the DC rate exceeds an absurdly high rate. Certain fogstreamers have proved already that its ok to dernak by DCing in order to hover at certain ranks.

    Oh and just a note, you will get punished for falsefy reporting too :wink:

    It's not a false report, one of the options literally says "disconnecting from the game" and one of the options under Xbox reports is "quit early". Tell me how if the killer leaves right when the game starts as a way to depip it is a false report.

    The stupid shit people say around here I swear man...

  • micsanmicsan Member Posts: 95

    @PiiFree said:

    @micsan said:
    This is the case for many PvP games though, if you run a cheesy character or a cheesy strategy that generally requires little skill to pull off compared to how effective it is. Fighting games often suffer from this.

    This is pretty much what happens to a camper or tunneler.

    I'm playing on the same steam account since 10 years and I didn't receive a single profile comment until I started with DbD. I have 3000 hours in Dota 2; 2000 hours in ARK PvP and several hundred hours in other PvP games (CS, CoD,...).

    But the toxicity in DbD is another story, not really relevant to the topic (and neither is SWF now that I think about it).

    I think we ended up here because people compared "deranking on purpose" with "lobby dodging" which lead to SWF = dodge, which lead to SWF = unfun, which lead to "no one cares about the opposite sides fun".

    If you played Ark official PvP I don't believe that you have not received a single message, lol. Unless you where a super good guy that never killed anyones dinos or raided anyone. That game is literally the worst in regards to other players messing up your progress, which is why I believe that game is so cutthroat and becomes Toxic because of it. That game is the best worst game I've ever played.

    I do agree that the toxicity is on a completely different level in DbD, I believe it's because of the reasons you stated but also one more key point, most people don't play both killer and survivor at the same rank. This makes people extremely one sided, and since the difference between surviving and killing is so huge, a lot of hate gets thrown to the opposite side.

    Saw a reddit thread a while back, "What game has the worst community". DbD was nr 1 on toxicity...It is known that this game has the worst community by people who haven't even touched this game.

  • PiiFreePiiFree Member Posts: 477

    @micsan said:
    If you played Ark official PvP I don't believe that you have not received a single message, lol. Unless you where a super good guy that never killed anyones dinos or raided anyone. That game is literally the worst in regards to other players messing up your progress, which is why I believe that game is so cutthroat and becomes Toxic because of it. That game is the best worst game I've ever played.

    I do agree that the toxicity is on a completely different level in DbD, I believe it's because of the reasons you stated but also one more key point, most people don't play both killer and survivor at the same rank. This makes people extremely one sided, and since the difference between surviving and killing is so huge, a lot of hate gets thrown to the opposite side.

    Saw a reddit thread a while back, "What game has the worst community". DbD was nr 1 on toxicity...It is known that this game has the worst community by people who haven't even touched this game.

    Ohh of course there is toxicity in ARK but I didn't get a single profile comment in all that playtime. The toxicity stays ingame, no one cares about your "steam identity". Same in Dota 2 or CSGO, you get flamed in one match but they only very rarely head over to your steam profile to insult you. In DbD it's like normal (almost exclusively for Survivors, I gotta say) to head over to the Killers profile and insult them. A bit cringy imo :) ...but as I said, that's another story

  • micsanmicsan Member Posts: 95
    edited January 23

    @PiiFree said:

    @micsan said:
    If you played Ark official PvP I don't believe that you have not received a single message, lol. Unless you where a super good guy that never killed anyones dinos or raided anyone. That game is literally the worst in regards to other players messing up your progress, which is why I believe that game is so cutthroat and becomes Toxic because of it. That game is the best worst game I've ever played.

    I do agree that the toxicity is on a completely different level in DbD, I believe it's because of the reasons you stated but also one more key point, most people don't play both killer and survivor at the same rank. This makes people extremely one sided, and since the difference between surviving and killing is so huge, a lot of hate gets thrown to the opposite side.

    Saw a reddit thread a while back, "What game has the worst community". DbD was nr 1 on toxicity...It is known that this game has the worst community by people who haven't even touched this game.

    Ohh of course there is toxicity in ARK but I didn't get a single profile comment in all that playtime. The toxicity stays ingame, no one cares about your "steam identity". Same in Dota 2 or CSGO, you get flamed in one match but they only very rarely head over to your steam profile to insult you. In DbD it's like normal (almost exclusively for Survivors, I gotta say) to head over to the Killers profile and insult them. A bit cringy imo :) ...but as I said, that's another story

    Interesting, these things aren't really applicable to how we play on PS4 and Xbox. As you HAVE to go through someone's profile to even send a message, there is no way to communicate ingame, no post game chat.

    I always suspected that this makes people less likely to send hateful messages, a very small but effective barrier. And yes, it's almost always survivors messaging killers, not the other way around.

    I think I only had that happen to me once as survivor, that a killer called me "baby survivor, easiest 4k of my life" or something like that. Thing is, I was also playing solo and I'm certain the killer thought we were SWF, as he mentioned my friends also being bad and that we should just uninstall the game etc.

    Getting so mad that you feel the need to go out of your way to trash talk someone is indeed extremely cringy. This is a game and a game where winning or losing really doesn't affect you at all, other then Blood Points I guess. Other games have some sort of incentive to win other than simply being the winner, or getting high rank simply to be high ranked.

  • MasterMaster Member Posts: 8,419

    @thesuicidefox said:

    @Master said:

    @thesuicidefox said:
    Last night I ran into a depipping killer twice. He didn't offer anything or use any add-ons. He would wait until the game loaded in then quit immediately to depip by 2 pips. Made us lose our offerings both times. The first time he was around rank 3, the second time he was at rank 6 meaning he did it many times. This is unacceptable. I reported him but this is Xbox so IDK what will happen if anything. If you're gonna do that at least have the courtesy to message the survivors so we know not to use offerings (or leave if we don't want the free 5k BP).

    We are not supposed to report DCing. There is an automatic system that will trigger if the DC rate exceeds an absurdly high rate. Certain fogstreamers have proved already that its ok to dernak by DCing in order to hover at certain ranks.

    Oh and just a note, you will get punished for falsefy reporting too :wink:

    It's not a false report, one of the options literally says "disconnecting from the game" and one of the options under Xbox reports is "quit early". Tell me how if the killer leaves right when the game starts as a way to depip it is a false report.

    The stupid shit people say around here I swear man...

    Just for the last stupid kid, I will post you the link:
    https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/19450/game-rules-and-report-system

    In case you lack some braincells and cant find the line, I will even copy it for you:
    Disconnects (leaving the match before killed or sacrificed) - DO NOT REPORT

  • thesuicidefoxthesuicidefox Member Posts: 2,567

    @Master said:
    Just for the last stupid kid, I will post you the link:
    https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/19450/game-rules-and-report-system

    In case you lack some braincells and cant find the line, I will even copy it for you:
    Disconnects (leaving the match before killed or sacrificed) - DO NOT REPORT

    Right there in game. Not a false report.

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