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Innate/Passive Self Care Ability

     Based on my personal Dead By Daylight experience; It seems Self Care is a pretty hot perk for survivors. Matter of fact, it’s quite popular. It also seems to be powerful in almost every trial.
     So if Self care seems to be depicted as a necessity: Why not remove the perk and make it an ability ALL survivors can use- including our new players- from the start?
     Heck we could even give Killers a passive Iron Grasp! Free up those perk slots!

Comments

  • CorianderCoriander Member Posts: 837

    I hear what you're saying, but I feel a lot of the initial design was placed around health states. You're stuck injured, and you can either risk it by continuing on as normal, getting downed in one hit if you're found, or spend time seeking out teammates for help. Many of the games I do well on killer-side is because the survivors aren't healing each other; no one goes for help, no one seeks out injured teammates. It's a strong aspect of the game and I think it adds a level of strategy to the match.

    As far as Self Care goes, it certainly is a strong addition, although not mandatory. The survivors could bring, or find, health kits to heal themselves, freeing up the Self Care perk slot for something else. Since only one survivor has the Self Care perk at start (and that must be unlocked, in addition) I don't think they're meant to heal up immediately every time. Part of the game is that you can get injured, and escaping the killer means you have to figure out what to do next. It's one of the examples of how survivors should work together to help each other and escape, especially since it goes faster if you have help.

    I've thought about the innate self-healing before, but it would essentially remove a good bit of depth out of the game, making the killer less-frightening by getting caught and attacked. You should be afraid of the killer, and do everything you can to hide first and foremost; failing that, run for your life because your survival depends on it. If everyone can naturally heal up after every hit (given time, at least) the whole process isn't as thrilling or desperate, which is what a game of this nature is supposed to portray.

  • Dwight_ConfusionDwight_Confusion Member Posts: 1,561

    Sure. Just make it take 60 seconds to self heal then...

    And give killers NOED built in.

    ANd we'll do it.

  • ceridwen309ceridwen309 Member, Mod Posts: 479

    I don't believe it's an outright necessity, but one does get extremely dependent on it.

    If you don't bring self care, your options become:

    1. Bring a medkit (1-3 time use maybe)
    2. Bring Pharmacy perk and try to get a box immediately.(Plunder's instinct, probably.)
    3. Increase number of boxes, and Plunder's. Or hope for the best.
      .............
    4. Bring Empathy/Bond for being able to reunite with people and get backrubs.
    5. Hope to Vigo that you can find someone without perks in a timely manner without too much difficulty.

    now, this doesn't even take in the idea of Franklin's Demise, which would make the first three very difficult. But nothing gained without some risk eh'?

    Being that I noticed everyone(almost) runs self-care, I started countering with Nurse's Calling. It's been interesting to say the least.(without Botany Knowledge or a medkit of adequate quality, I usually catch them giving out free backrubs.)


    If I know how this future thing is going to go...I believe the devs are cooking up a killer that causes a status ailment that forces survivors to get "treatment" from another survivor or hope they have a medkit with a certain level of quality/add-on.

    That would force players to seek aid more often, being that self-care doesn't do anything to help this hypothetical ailment.

  • TheTimeMachineTheTimeMachine Member Posts: 229
    Coriander said:

    I've thought about the innate self-healing before, but it would essentially remove a good bit of depth out of the game, making the killer less-frightening by getting caught and attacked. You should be afraid of the killer, and do everything you can to hide first and foremost; failing that, run for your life because your survival depends on it. If everyone can naturally heal up after every hit (given time, at least) the whole process isn't as thrilling or desperate, which is what a game of this nature is supposed to portray.

         You speak the truth fellow member. But I fear it’s too late, as these “big-topic perks” are seemingly already on many players Go-To load outs. “Why if I could give myself a little bit of an edge over my opponent; a ‘thrilling’ experience may be a sacrifice” -a trade off that more players than we think, are willing to pay.
         You and I and a smaller group from the majority may appreciate the thrill of fear and uncertainty. And... 
         Halfway through my comment, I forgot Kill Your Friends can offer this niche indulgence more frequently than playing with random players anyway SO; May we wait and see what will our developers do regarding our “hot perks”?
  • thesuicidefoxthesuicidefox Member Posts: 5,023

    I'm a survivor main and I think Self Care should be taken out of the game. Seriously, that one perk ruins the entire meta. It's the reason DS, BT (old version), and literally everything else is so powerful BECAUSE you can self heal.

    If they took it out they wouldn't need to do anything else to balance the game.

  • ShadoureonShadoureon Member Posts: 493

    @thesuicidefox said:
    I'm a survivor main and I think Self Care should be taken out of the game. Seriously, that one perk ruins the entire meta. It's the reason DS, BT (old version), and literally everything else is so powerful BECAUSE you can self heal.

    If they took it out they wouldn't need to do anything else to balance the game.

    Not having self care makes the game so passive. Survivors are willing to take a hit to help teammates because if the killer doesnt chace they can self heal. Without the option to heal yourself would any survivor purposely get hit?

    I think games will be more passive and will take much longer wich ruins it. Some people already wait for someone to get hit by a killer before they start a generator. This will only happen more if you remove self care imo.

  • ASpazNamedSteveASpazNamedSteve Member Posts: 729

    If it was a very slow self heal, I COMPLEEEETELY agree.

    It's obvious the devs don't have the balls to give this perk a substantial nerf, so it should be added to base and turned into something else. This perk desperately needs to be less mandatory, all other perks change from person to person... but Self Care? Self Care is ALWAYS in every survivor's build.

  • TheTimeMachineTheTimeMachine Member Posts: 229

    @thesuicidefox said:
    I'm a survivor main and I think Self Care should be taken out of the game. Seriously, that one perk ruins the entire meta. It's the reason DS, BT (old version), and literally everything else is so powerful BECAUSE you can self heal.

    If they took it out they wouldn't need to do anything else to balance the game.

    Not having self care makes the game so passive. Survivors are willing to take a hit to help teammates because if the killer doesnt chace they can self heal. Without the option to heal yourself would any survivor purposely get hit?

    I think games will be more passive and will take much longer wich ruins it. Some people already wait for someone to get hit by a killer before they start a generator. This will only happen more if you remove self care imo.

         I see your point; A “passive game” due to survivors not willing to “take a hit”. But should our survivor players really feel like it’s not a huge risk for a Killer to rip at their flesh? I’ve never gotten to run Self Care once (although I’d like to try), but I’ve taken hits, lethal hits for my fellow survivors; And sometimes this means exchanging my life for theirs. But alas, it is a risk that I find incredibly worth the satisfaction of saving a friend (or stranger).
  • TheTimeMachineTheTimeMachine Member Posts: 229

    If it was a very slow self heal, I COMPLEEEETELY agree.

    It's obvious the devs don't have the balls to give this perk a substantial nerf, so it should be added to base and turned into something else. This perk desperately needs to be less mandatory, all other perks change from person to person... but Self Care? Self Care is ALWAYS in every survivor's build.

         You and I have the same attitude. While your forthrightness is shocking, it is also justified. I’m just... less crass. 
         We’ll just have to wait and see how things progress.
  • ShadoureonShadoureon Member Posts: 493

    @TheTimeMachine said:
    Shadoureon said:

    @thesuicidefox said:

    I'm a survivor main and I think Self Care should be taken out of the game. Seriously, that one perk ruins the entire meta. It's the reason DS, BT (old version), and literally everything else is so powerful BECAUSE you can self heal.

    If they took it out they wouldn't need to do anything else to balance the game.

    Not having self care makes the game so passive. Survivors are willing to take a hit to help teammates because if the killer doesnt chace they can self heal. Without the option to heal yourself would any survivor purposely get hit?

    I think games will be more passive and will take much longer wich ruins it. Some people already wait for someone to get hit by a killer before they start a generator. This will only happen more if you remove self care imo.

         I see your point; A “passive game” due to survivors not willing to “take a hit”. But should our survivor players really feel like it’s not a huge risk for a Killer to rip at their flesh? I’ve never gotten to run Self Care once (although I’d like to try), but I’ve taken hits, lethal hits for my fellow survivors; And sometimes this means exchanging my life for theirs. But alas, it is a risk that I find incredibly worth the satisfaction of saving a friend (or stranger).

    People always come with the argument that its a horror game and survivors are supposed to be scared so I udnerstand you but at the same time we have to be honest here that as long theres a hearthbeat the game simply isnt scary. It probably never will. If you already take hits now just wait untill you get selfcare. I currently am farming bloodpoints with BQQ and chilli on killers in solo games but when I am in a SWF with a friend I run Were gonna live forever and simply run to the killer when hes holding someone to get the free stack knowing I can heal myself again.

    I think self care as a passive wont be bad but it probably wont happen. In return I wouldnt give iron grasp since its not really at the powerlevel of self care. I would go with Nurse Calling or Thanataphobia as killer passives but yeah dont think this will ever happen.

  • CorianderCoriander Member Posts: 837

    The games should be taking longer, not finished in 5 minutes. I wish it was more of a hunt for the killer, rather than just finding people right away. Imagine sneaking through areas, fearful of the killer finding you at any moment, knowing you have little to no way of fighting back. A tense game like that would be a lot of fun, I think. I already throw myself at the killer to let others escape; it's the greatest joy I have playing this. I know other people feel differently, and that quickly healing up means you can throw yourself in front of a hit for a rescue, but it all seems more arcade-like instead of horror. A hide-and-seek like version would be great, but not the battle royal style that all the games are going these days. I don't want to be the last and only survivor, I want to help lots of others escape.

  • ShadoureonShadoureon Member Posts: 493

    @Coriander said:
    The games should be taking longer, not finished in 5 minutes. I wish it was more of a hunt for the killer, rather than just finding people right away. Imagine sneaking through areas, fearful of the killer finding you at any moment, knowing you have little to no way of fighting back. A tense game like that would be a lot of fun, I think. I already throw myself at the killer to let others escape; it's the greatest joy I have playing this. I know other people feel differently, and that quickly healing up means you can throw yourself in front of a hit for a rescue, but it all seems more arcade-like instead of horror. A hide-and-seek like version would be great, but not the battle royal style that all the games are going these days. I don't want to be the last and only survivor, I want to help lots of others escape.

    Then they should do a PTB to test the game without a hearthbeat on any killer. Just give the Doctor a static visual effect on the border of the screen to tell you you are in his range.

    I think thats one step.

  • CorianderCoriander Member Posts: 837

    I'd try that mode if they removed scratches. In Lery's Memorial =)

  • Jack11803Jack11803 Member Posts: 3,930

    @TheTimeMachine said:
    Coriander said:

    I've thought about the innate self-healing before, but it would essentially remove a good bit of depth out of the game, making the killer less-frightening by getting caught and attacked. You should be afraid of the killer, and do everything you can to hide first and foremost; failing that, run for your life because your survival depends on it. If everyone can naturally heal up after every hit (given time, at least) the whole process isn't as thrilling or desperate, which is what a game of this nature is supposed to portray.

         You speak the truth fellow member. But I fear it’s too late, as these “big-topic perks” are seemingly already on many players Go-To load outs. “Why if I could give myself a little bit of an edge over my opponent; a ‘thrilling’ experience may be a sacrifice” -a trade off that more players than we think, are willing to pay.
         You and I and a smaller group from the majority may appreciate the thrill of fear and uncertainty. And... 
         Halfway through my comment, I forgot Kill Your Friends can offer this niche indulgence more frequently than playing with random players anyway SO; May we wait and see what will our developers do regarding our “hot perks”?

    And because camping exists. Camping may be OK, but it kills any immersion you had, like, really hard too. People would do ANYTHING to avoid camping, which also means avoiding the hook in general.

  • ASpazNamedSteveASpazNamedSteve Member Posts: 729

    @TheTimeMachine said:
         You and I have the same attitude. While your forthrightness is shocking, it is also justified. I’m just... less crass. 
         We’ll just have to wait and see how things progress.

    Haha my bad. It's just been that way for 2 years with no significant changes, hence the forthrightness :P

  • TheTimeMachineTheTimeMachine Member Posts: 229
    edited June 2018
         Am I the only one who still gets tense hearing a heartbeat intensify?? I mean, I’ll admit I’m a scaredy cat. I’ve even been jumpscared playing Killer (My most embarrassing moment is getting scared by my own illusion as The Doctor). Sure, some of the sound effects are exaggerations, but it still leaves me shaking in a locker!

         (Off topic, I apologize.)
  • thesuicidefoxthesuicidefox Member Posts: 5,023

    @Shadoureon said:

    @thesuicidefox said:
    I'm a survivor main and I think Self Care should be taken out of the game. Seriously, that one perk ruins the entire meta. It's the reason DS, BT (old version), and literally everything else is so powerful BECAUSE you can self heal.

    If they took it out they wouldn't need to do anything else to balance the game.

    Not having self care makes the game so passive. Survivors are willing to take a hit to help teammates because if the killer doesnt chace they can self heal. Without the option to heal yourself would any survivor purposely get hit?

    I think games will be more passive and will take much longer wich ruins it. Some people already wait for someone to get hit by a killer before they start a generator. This will only happen more if you remove self care imo.

    I would still take the hit if it means you will get free. 2 injured > 1 healthy and 1 hooked. Also you could still have a medkit if you want to self care, you just can't do it without one.

  • RuniverRuniver Member Posts: 2,095

    Self-care for Iron Grasp ?

  • Jack11803Jack11803 Member Posts: 3,930

    @Runiver said:
    Self-care for Iron Grasp ?

    Self Care for more JPEG? Maybe? Please?

  • BeaburdBeaburd Member Posts: 101
    edited June 2018

    Oh, ohh!

    I want a free passive devour hope perk that isn't attached to totems. Then you can haz your passive infinite healing.

  • Well_Placed_HexTotemWell_Placed_HexTotem Member Posts: 582

    I'm a survivor main and I think Self Care should be taken out of the game. Seriously, that one perk ruins the entire meta. It's the reason DS, BT (old version), and literally everything else is so powerful BECAUSE you can self heal.

    If they took it out they wouldn't need to do anything else to balance the game.

    Yep. I’ve stopped running self care as a survivor because it makes the game too unbalanced and easy. It screws me over a lot because I mostly solo queue and other survivors are complete morons about healing teammates.

    But if they removed it, it would make the game so much more balanced and would nerf some of the most OP survivor perks but also strengthen some of the other ones. There are some perks that make you stronger when injured that no one uses because people just self care. There’s also botany which could make med kits a lot better.

    Survivor mains would throw hissy fits though, so it won’t happen. 
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