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Hatch change suggestions?

The killers ability to close the hatch is not ballanced at all. You're lucky to make it that far in a trial to begin with, let alone complete one more gen to re-open the hatch. It will be nearly impossible to get a hatch escape with the killer just patrolling the last remaining gens.

Here are my suggestions on making it more ballanced:
-Remove killers ability to see gen auras when one survivor remains in the trial.
-Remove the ability for the killer to grab a survivor from the hatch if the survivor has found the hatch first or has re-opened the hatch.
-Give the survivor a significant speed buff to completing the gen they need to re-open the hatch.
-Hatch can only be closed by the killer once per trial.
-Alternative switch for the hatch to be re-opened that the survivor & killer have to find somewhere in the level.

A combination of these suggestions could make the hatch change more ballanced and more fun for everyone. 

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Comments

  • AnteroAntero Member Posts: 33

    I agree in the way that if killer close the hatch and survivor manage to do another gen to re-open it that would be good to have a reward for survivor for doing that cause it's pretty hard (not impossible) to 1 v 1 a killer in this situation.
    But if You remove the ability to grab and make hatch only closed once by the killer, also removing his ability to see gens and speed buff for doing gens is a bit of an overkill.
    Survivor should be in hard spot cause he is not the power class in this situation and his entire team is dead, so You have to do as much as You can in this scenario and by the great effort You can come out on top.

  • MeowLuxMeowLux Member Posts: 80

    TL;DR Hatch changes are fine, currently the hatch is a free win for the survivor. Some power back to the killer would be nice and your chances of surviving when being the last survivor should be minimal and not guaranteed.

    The hatch is already a free escape for the survivor if he finds it first. If the killer finds it first he should win, if the killer finds it, but the survivor finds it too, the killer should win, but this isn't the case right now. The Hatch is a 100% free win for the survivor as long as they aren't dumb.
    Survivors already made several mistakes to get into that situation. The hatch changes are completely fine and bring some power back to killers. It removes hatch standoffs and balances it out to not be a free escape every time.
    If the killer got 3 kills before 5 gens got done then the survivors weren't playing good, so what makes the 4th person entitled to get a free escape? Because he got a bad team? You forgot that to escape you need to work as a team also there is already a perk called Left Behind that boosts your gen repair time a lot.

  • GolgiNeaGolgiNea Member Posts: 157

    @MeowLux said:
    TL;DR Hatch changes are fine, currently the hatch is a free win for the survivor. Some power back to the killer would be nice and your chances of surviving when being the last survivor should be minimal and not guaranteed.

    The hatch is already a free escape for the survivor if he finds it first. If the killer finds it first he should win, if the killer finds it, but the survivor finds it too, the killer should win, but this isn't the case right now. The Hatch is a 100% free win for the survivor as long as they aren't dumb.
    Survivors already made several mistakes to get into that situation. The hatch changes are completely fine and bring some power back to killers.

    The killer has a massive advantage at finding the hatch first. They dont have to sneak around to find it.

  • MeowLuxMeowLux Member Posts: 80

    @GolgiNea said:

    @MeowLux said:
    TL;DR Hatch changes are fine, currently the hatch is a free win for the survivor. Some power back to the killer would be nice and your chances of surviving when being the last survivor should be minimal and not guaranteed.

    The hatch is already a free escape for the survivor if he finds it first. If the killer finds it first he should win, if the killer finds it, but the survivor finds it too, the killer should win, but this isn't the case right now. The Hatch is a 100% free win for the survivor as long as they aren't dumb.
    Survivors already made several mistakes to get into that situation. The hatch changes are completely fine and bring some power back to killers.

    The killer has a massive advantage at finding the hatch first. They dont have to sneak around to find it.

    The killer is supposed to have an advantage immediatly. If you end up in that situation as I said. Your survival chances should be MINIMAL. You aren't supposed to escape every match. The killer should be the power role, but the survivors completely decide the flow of the game. The hatch changes are fine, it isn't a free escape anymore and needs you to actually play skillfully to escape in a 1v1 situation.

  • SnakeSound222SnakeSound222 Member Posts: 2,856

    No, the hatch changes are fine. The Killer is SUPPOSED to have an advantage. None of your suggestions except the third one could actually work. You need to learn that the hatch is not a free escape.

  • Jack11803Jack11803 Member Posts: 3,930

    No, no, no. The hatch changes are horrible because of what they will cause. As a doc main, I’m mad they’re changing it. Can’t wait to have a survivor hide and do nothing every match for 40 minutes.

    Either kill them completely super easy like reveal aura, or just keep the hatch as a free win, anything in between will cause games to be held hostage amass.

  • Dwight_ConfusionDwight_Confusion Member Posts: 1,640

    I like the change. No more automatic getting out because you did 2/5 gens.

    Killer finds the hatch 1st? Okay he closes it. Doing 1 gen will reopen the hatch, but he can close it again.

    SOunds fair to me. This whole backpocket of the hatch being a EZ thing needs to stop, and it will. Thank God.

    This isn't called "Survive by Daylight"... some of you think this, but this game is actually called "Dead by Daylight"

  • DreadfulProtonDreadfulProton Member Posts: 27

    I understand the necessity for a change in how the hatch works. However I disagree with the changes currently in testing. On the one hand in its current state it makes escaping as the last survivor frustratingly easy when you consider the killers perspective. So, this game being asymmetric, I understand how it seems unfair to the killer. Some of OP's suggestions are valid I'd say, especially when you consider there are other ways that survivors are being disadvantaged. Pallet loops are also getting nerfed, as well as a reduced number of pallets all together (Which was implemented a few months ago). I know that by the nature of the game survivors are supposed to be at a disadvantage, but all of these things ontop of this hatch change, it seems like too much of a disadvantage.

    If face camping is considered a viable and legitimate strategy, then they must not feel the same about looping considering the change they are making to it. Also consider the doctor, that killer and many perks that dont involve the doctor make stealth nearly impossible. Its no wonder survivors are upset about the hatch and loop change.

  • BrettClaudioBrettClaudio Member Posts: 9

    I completely agree that Killers should be the ones in power, especially if they killed/sacrificed 3 Survivors already. I'm a big fan of the new Hatch closing mechanic!

    Perhaps after the Hatch is closed, if the Survivor powers a generator, the Hatch then respawns elsewhere on the map so it becomes another hunt for both parties? Other than that, I don't think any changes need to be made to this new mechanic (at least on paper, we haven't tried it yet lol).

  • GolgiNeaGolgiNea Member Posts: 157

    @BrettClaudio said:
    Perhaps after the Hatch is closed, if the Survivor powers a generator, the Hatch then respawns elsewhere on the map so it becomes another hunt for both parties? Other than that, I don't think any changes need to be made to this new mechanic (at least on paper, we haven't tried it yet lol).

    I do like this suggestion as well!

  • TheAngryPickleTheAngryPickle Member Posts: 73

    @GolgiNea said:

    @MeowLux said:
    TL;DR Hatch changes are fine, currently the hatch is a free win for the survivor. Some power back to the killer would be nice and your chances of surviving when being the last survivor should be minimal and not guaranteed.

    The hatch is already a free escape for the survivor if he finds it first. If the killer finds it first he should win, if the killer finds it, but the survivor finds it too, the killer should win, but this isn't the case right now. The Hatch is a 100% free win for the survivor as long as they aren't dumb.
    Survivors already made several mistakes to get into that situation. The hatch changes are completely fine and bring some power back to killers.

    The killer has a massive advantage at finding the hatch first. They dont have to sneak around to find it.

    Killers currently don't have a way to prevent a survivor from using the hatch. If the killer finds it first, he should win.

  • Ahos490Ahos490 Member Posts: 1
    edited May 2018
    I really hate these changes. If you're going to lock us out of the hatch then at the very least give us the pallet loops and pallets back. The game is leaning much too far in the favor of the killers and it's honestly really disheartening to see. The hatch respawn ay a different location would be much better and I feel if they gave a speed buff to repairing the gen to fix it similar to a green tier toolbox it would feel a bit more balanced. This will certainly make face camping a more viable option which will see a dramatic drop in survivor mains playing.
  • MantaManta Member Posts: 117
    I dont like the entire concept of closing the hatch. A survivor needs HOPE to make the game interesting- if not, why not just disconnect?! 
    My suggestion instead of closing the hatch:
    * Survivors can't be grabbed jumping into the hatch.
    * Survivors receive exposed status if within audio range of the hatch.
    * Cannot crawl into the hatch within 10 seconds of entering the dying state.


    On a side note, I personally think survivors shouldn't be REWARDED for using the hatch- it should be an emergency exit. My suggestions:
    * No bonus escape points for using the hatch.
    * 25% normal survived points
    *Killer gets a nominal amount of points for "forcing" a hatch escape.
     

    This way, it's not a positive option- it's a way of saving your items and scraping a few survival points.

    There's probably a million reasons why this wouldn't work, just a suggestion :)
  • Queen_ShepisQueen_Shepis Member Posts: 40

    From the beginning I said that they just need to remove that the killer can grab a survivor to avoid hatch stand offs. If you find the hatch, you have won/escaped, period. All those try hard killers camping the hatch should accept that

  • AkimboJEsusAkimboJEsus Member Posts: 26
    edited May 2018

    @Queen_Shepis said:
    From the beginning I said that they just need to remove that the killer can grab a survivor to avoid hatch stand offs. If you find the hatch, you have won/escaped, period. All those try hard killers camping the hatch should accept that

    Well nobody here is saying that, and the devs seem to agree. We agree a change needed to be made, just maybe not this one. The idea that the last survivor can get a guaranteed escape if two generators are done is a little silly.

    @Manta said:
    I dont like the entire concept of closing the hatch. A survivor needs HOPE to make the game interesting- if not, why not just disconnect?! 
    My suggestion instead of closing the hatch:

    • Survivors can't be grabbed jumping into the hatch.
    • Survivors receive exposed status if within audio range of the hatch.
    • Cannot crawl into the hatch within 10 seconds of entering the dying state.

    On a side note, I personally think survivors shouldn't be REWARDED for using the hatch- it should be an emergency exit. My suggestions:

    • No bonus escape points for using the hatch.
    • 25% normal survived points
      *Killer gets a nominal amount of points for "forcing" a hatch escape.
       

    This way, it's not a positive option- it's a way of saving your items and scraping a few survival points.

    There's probably a million reasons why this wouldn't work, just a suggestion :)

    I like these changes a bit more, as a killer main. It keeps the game's spirit alive: Hide and Seek. > @Jack11803 said:

    No, no, no. The hatch changes are horrible because of what they will cause. As a doc main, I’m mad they’re changing it. Can’t wait to have a survivor hide and do nothing every match for 40 minutes.

    Either kill them completely super easy like reveal aura, or just keep the hatch as a free win, anything in between will cause games to be held hostage amass.

    Games are already held hostage. The survivor walks up to the hatch, the killer sits there and waits for him to jump in while the survivor waits to be hit. Both people are holding the game hostage. This is a dumb system.

  • AkimboJEsusAkimboJEsus Member Posts: 26
    edited May 2018

    @Queen_Shepis said:
    From the beginning I said that they just need to remove that the killer can grab a survivor to avoid hatch stand offs. If you find the hatch, you have won/escaped, period. All those try hard killers camping the hatch should accept that

    Nobody here is saying anything that extreme, and the devs seem to agree. The idea that you automatically win because your whole team did 2 gens and you sat on your ass is a bit silly.

    @Manta said:
    I dont like the entire concept of closing the hatch. A survivor needs HOPE to make the game interesting- if not, why not just disconnect?! 
    My suggestion instead of closing the hatch:

    • Survivors can't be grabbed jumping into the hatch.
    • Survivors receive exposed status if within audio range of the hatch.
    • Cannot crawl into the hatch within 10 seconds of entering the dying state.

    On a side note, I personally think survivors shouldn't be REWARDED for using the hatch- it should be an emergency exit. My suggestions:

    • No bonus escape points for using the hatch.
    • 25% normal survived points
      *Killer gets a nominal amount of points for "forcing" a hatch escape.
       

    This way, it's not a positive option- it's a way of saving your items and scraping a few survival points.

    There's probably a million reasons why this wouldn't work, just a suggestion :)

    I like these changes. It keeps the spirit of the game alive: Hide and Seek

    @Jack11803 said:
    No, no, no. The hatch changes are horrible because of what they will cause. As a doc main, I’m mad they’re changing it. Can’t wait to have a survivor hide and do nothing every match for 40 minutes.

    Either kill them completely super easy like reveal aura, or just keep the hatch as a free win, anything in between will cause games to be held hostage amass.

    The games are already held hostage. That's why these changes were made. Ever had a standoff at a hatch? Both sides hold the game hostage. A survivor stands at the hatch and the killer waits for them to jump in because the survivor is invulnerable. And unless your The Pig, you can't really leave the hatch without the survivor totally getting into it.

  • ZagridZagrid Member Posts: 721

    @GolgiNea said:
    The killers ability to close the hatch is not ballanced at all. You're lucky to make it that far in a trial to begin with, let alone complete one more gen to re-open the hatch. It will be nearly impossible to get a hatch escape with the killer just patrolling the last remaining gens. Here are my suggestions on making it more ballanced:
    -Remove killers ability to see gen auras when one survivor remains in the trial.
    -Remove the ability for the killer to grab a survivor from the hatch if the survivor has found the hatch first or has re-opened the hatch.
    -Give the survivor a significant speed buff to completing the gen they need to re-open the hatch.
    -Hatch can only be closed by the killer once per trial.
    -Alternative switch for the hatch to be re-opened that the survivor & killer have to find somewhere in the level.

    A combination of these suggestions could make the hatch change more ballanced and more fun for everyone. 

    One this was correct about this. You are lucky to make it that far into the trial because most of the time the gens get rushed and the killer gets T bagged. Or the killer disconnects.

  • ZagridZagrid Member Posts: 721

    @AkimboJEsus said:

    @Queen_Shepis said:
    From the beginning I said that they just need to remove that the killer can grab a survivor to avoid hatch stand offs. If you find the hatch, you have won/escaped, period. All those try hard killers camping the hatch should accept that

    Nobody here is saying anything that extreme, and the devs seem to agree. The idea that you automatically win because your whole team did 2 gens and you sat on your ass is a bit silly.

    @Manta said:
    I dont like the entire concept of closing the hatch. A survivor needs HOPE to make the game interesting- if not, why not just disconnect?! 
    My suggestion instead of closing the hatch:

    • Survivors can't be grabbed jumping into the hatch.
    • Survivors receive exposed status if within audio range of the hatch.
    • Cannot crawl into the hatch within 10 seconds of entering the dying state.

    On a side note, I personally think survivors shouldn't be REWARDED for using the hatch- it should be an emergency exit. My suggestions:

    • No bonus escape points for using the hatch.
    • 25% normal survived points
      *Killer gets a nominal amount of points for "forcing" a hatch escape.
       

    This way, it's not a positive option- it's a way of saving your items and scraping a few survival points.

    There's probably a million reasons why this wouldn't work, just a suggestion :)

    I like these changes. It keeps the spirit of the game alive: Hide and Seek

    @Jack11803 said:
    No, no, no. The hatch changes are horrible because of what they will cause. As a doc main, I’m mad they’re changing it. Can’t wait to have a survivor hide and do nothing every match for 40 minutes.

    Either kill them completely super easy like reveal aura, or just keep the hatch as a free win, anything in between will cause games to be held hostage amass.

    The games are already held hostage. That's why these changes were made. Ever had a standoff at a hatch? Both sides hold the game hostage. A survivor stands at the hatch and the killer waits for them to jump in because the survivor is invulnerable. And unless your The Pig, you can't really leave the hatch without the survivor totally getting into it.

    I saw a streamer called Scottjund do a hatch standoff for nearly 2 hours and he won it because the survivor tried to jump in. Next time, it was a hatch standoff lasting nearly 1 hour but Scott did not win because what he tried to do was disconnect before the survivor could get the hatch, but it failed. The hatch closing I think is balanced because if the killer finds the hatch first the survivor lost the hatch, they should not feel entitled to get the hatch after having a killer dominate a game, the killer wants to win sometimes you know?

  • GolgiNeaGolgiNea Member Posts: 157

    @AkimboJEsus said:

    I like these changes. It keeps the spirit of the game alive: Hide and Seek

    I love the hide and seek aspect of the game as well, it helps to immerse yourself in the game more. I did like their suggestions also!

    @Jack11803 said:
    No, no, no. The hatch changes are horrible because of what they will cause. As a doc main, I’m mad they’re changing it. Can’t wait to have a survivor hide and do nothing every match for 40 minutes.

    Either kill them completely super easy like reveal aura, or just keep the hatch as a free win, anything in between will cause games to be held hostage amass.

    The games are already held hostage. That's why these changes were made. Ever had a standoff at a hatch? Both sides hold the game hostage. A survivor stands at the hatch and the killer waits for them to jump in because the survivor is invulnerable. And unless your The Pig, you can't really leave the hatch without the survivor totally getting into it.

    I think he was mentioning how now a survivor will have no hope of getting anything done at this point so they will be more enticed to just do nothing and hide. Its pretty much impossible to complete a gen with the killer just mindlessly doing nothing but patrolling gens at this stage in the trial. When people say "Its not impossible!" they must be referring to the small chance that your killer has to go afk, theyre slight derpy, or they dont mind if you do what you need to do to get out.

  • SnakeSound222SnakeSound222 Member Posts: 2,856
    Ahos490 said:
    I really hate these changes. If you're going to lock us out of the hatch then at the very least give us the pallet loops and pallets back. The game is leaning much too far in the favor of the killers and it's honestly really disheartening to see. The hatch respawn ay a different location would be much better and I feel if they gave a speed buff to repairing the gen to fix it similar to a green tier toolbox it would feel a bit more balanced. This will certainly make face camping a more viable option which will see a dramatic drop in survivor mains playing.
    The game is supposed to favor the Killers. You’re just going to have to get better now that your free escape and pallet vacuums are gone. 
  • GolgiNeaGolgiNea Member Posts: 157

    @Zagrid said:
    I saw a streamer called Scottjund do a hatch standoff for nearly 2 hours and he won it because the survivor tried to jump in. Next time, it was a hatch standoff lasting nearly 1 hour but Scott did not win because what he tried to do was disconnect before the survivor could get the hatch, but it failed. The hatch closing I think is balanced because if the killer finds the hatch first the survivor lost the hatch, they should not feel entitled to get the hatch after having a killer dominate a game, the killer wants to win sometimes you know?

    If I have gotten 3/4 kills already I call that a win. The end 1v1 should be fun for both sides dont you think? Something needs to give because whats in the ptb right now regarding the hatch is not fun. There is no hope for the survivor at all when its at this point in the trial. Its 5k points for escaping, maybe if they gave a bonus to survivors points based on emblems they recieved post trial, an escape would'nt mean so much. Killers generally get way more bloodpoints than survivors anyway, even with 3/4 kills.

  • mdg2018mdg2018 Member Posts: 131

    i have no problem with the hatch being able to close but with it spawns open both the killer and survivor should be given a notification of where it is like how the do the gates

  • powerbatspowerbats Member Posts: 7,071

    Personally I don't like it since it rewards campers, especially those with really op perks. If you're going to be able to lock it then have it despawn and respawn someplace completely different. It spawns automatically locked and has a 10 second or so skill check timer to open it. If you fail it or leave it locks it for a longer period of time or despawns again.

    As far as those basically saying git gud that's all fine and dandy with svf but with randoms and all the rage quitters on survivor side. The especially bad games where someone gets downed early and simply disconnects. Well now it's 1v3 and the killer has an even bigger advantage and they just need to find and camp 1 survivor and pretty much win from that point.

    The survivors are already at a huge disadvantage when it comes to complete randoms against highly geared and experienced killers. Throw in the right maps and some completely new/less experienced players and it's auto 4 sacrifices.

  • mintchapstickmintchapstick Member Posts: 340

    The new hatch system is ridiculous & way too balanced in the killer's favor. It's pretty much a guaranteed 4k. & zero hope of survival on the survivor's side even if you have the drive to walk around completing gens bit by bit for the next hour.

    Killers are already faster, stronger, and can track you by your footsteps, your breath, by crows, and sometimes just by existing, so how is it fair that they can close the hatch?

  • StarletStarlet Member Posts: 1

    Honestly Please DEV's Leave the hatch alone if you wanna figure out a way to balance the game do it other ways the hatch has always been fine.. hatch stand offs are just people whining.. Killers cause standoffs anyways by camping the catch and if it comes down to a killer and one survivor and the end of the game looking for the hatch..well that Killer already did damn well and just being greedy.. the hatch is FIne PLEASE leave it alone..find other ways.. i mean work on killers and survivors better..

    leavetheHatchalone

  • AlexAnarchyAlexAnarchy Member Posts: 685

    The killer has a massive advantage at finding the hatch first. They dont have to sneak around to find it.

    Hmmm..whens the last time i ever seen a survivor not standing at the hatch just waiting for the third person to die on the hook?...

  • AlexAnarchyAlexAnarchy Member Posts: 685

    @powerbats said:
    Personally I don't like it since it rewards campers, especially those with really op perks. If you're going to be able to lock it then have it despawn and respawn someplace completely different. It spawns automatically locked and has a 10 second or so skill check timer to open it. If you fail it or leave it locks it for a longer period of time or despawns again.

    As far as those basically saying git gud that's all fine and dandy with svf but with randoms and all the rage quitters on survivor side. The especially bad games where someone gets downed early and simply disconnects. Well now it's 1v3 and the killer has an even bigger advantage and they just need to find and camp 1 survivor and pretty much win from that point.

    The survivors are already at a huge disadvantage when it comes to complete randoms against highly geared and experienced killers. Throw in the right maps and some completely new/less experienced players and it's auto 4 sacrifices.

    Someone clearly knows nothing at all about what this games original concept and idea was at first...4 randos normally and camping still works 100% as intended from day 1 of the dev diary 3 killers release.

  • AlexAnarchyAlexAnarchy Member Posts: 685

    The game is supposed to favor the Killers. You’re just going to have to get better now that your free escape and pallet vacuums are gone. 

    Welcome to being closer to an actual asymmetrical game folks.

  • AlexAnarchyAlexAnarchy Member Posts: 685

    @Ahos490 said:
    I really hate these changes. If you're going to lock us out of the hatch then at the very least give us the pallet loops and pallets back. The game is leaning much too far in the favor of the killers and it's honestly really disheartening to see. The hatch respawn ay a different location would be much better and I feel if they gave a speed buff to repairing the gen to fix it similar to a green tier toolbox it would feel a bit more balanced. This will certainly make face camping a more viable option which will see a dramatic drop in survivor mains playing.

    Welcome too playing something closer to what an Asymmetrical game is supposed to be like. where 1 is supposed to equal up to the enemy 4.

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