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Proof that you don’t need ruin

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Comments

  • ImpalaImpala Member Posts: 92
    edited September 25

    Oh, really? I'd call a chill player someone like AngryPug, SwagDracula or Monto, not someone that talks every single time about red ranks viability, pipping/winning and "optimal builds". These things shows us that he is competitive in this game, being competitive results in try-harding. Might just be me...

    P.S. To prove my point, he recently had a "chill stream" (literally the name of the stream) in which he didn't talk about all the stuff I mentioned, but this is once in 2 weeks.

    P.P.S. I don't have anything with Tru3 if anyone is wondering, I am just objective about him as we all should be in an argument.

  • MemberBerryMemberBerry Member Posts: 382

    You also don't need DS and DH to survive, but hey, it's illegal to say anything about survivors, am I right?

  • BlueberryBlueberry Member Posts: 4,173

    True even states in many of his videos how required Ruin is. Posting a few videos showing a good game without it means nothing.

    My grandma smoked her whole life and didn't get cancer. Does that mean smoking doesn't cause cancer? No, it doesn't.

    There will always be exceptions and one off scenarios where you get lucky or have potatoes you're playing against, but "generally" in most cases yes, it will be required if you are playing against an even half decent high rank team.

  • NMCKENMCKE Member, Trusted Posts: 5,617
    edited September 25

    I have to agree with Shiny on this one, generators can go extremely fast if you don't apply any pressure. The key here is pressure, and if you don't get any pressure within the first minute, without Ruin (sometimes with Ruin), 3 generators are going to be popping soon.


    I haven't checked the videos yet, but keep in mind that you can prove anything if the survivors are not up to par.

    For example: Leather Face is OP with Speed Limiter.


    All in all, I don't think videos should be our only source of proof in my opinion — not when rank is unpredictable. :)

  • jthm0138jthm0138 Member Posts: 224

    If video isn't proof that something in game is happening what the hell do you people need? Do we need to find a local corn field and some gens to play the game in RL? ... I gotta warn ya, Bubba is going to be a lot more interesting if that's what you want.

  • CarpemortumCarpemortum Member Posts: 2,669

    You say, while commenting on someone elses comment, yours being LESS relevant to the discussion by it's own nature.

  • WeckWeck Member Posts: 1,172

    Maybe we just need more videos...

    They can't all be "bad survivors" right? XD


    Hell... I can post some of mine and people would probably say the survivors are just worse than me...

    Let's test that...


  • CashelP14CashelP14 Member Posts: 676

    Every game is different. You could beat a 4 man swf with legion no perks and no add-ons, depending on how the game goes. Many factors contribute to winning a game without ruin such as how quickly you down survivors, the map and loops, if survivors heal or not, killer and add-ons.

    Tru3 is a good killer but don't think just because he can win a game without ruin, doesn't mean that he will win them all.

    The question I'd ask is: If you were put in a dead by daylight tournament, with money on the line would you run ruin? A lot of people probably would.

  • DocOctoberDocOctober Member Posts: 2,230

    Not any news to me, I haven't run Ruin since 2016, when I got the Hag's Achievements.

    I disliked Hex Perks' unreliability due to being destructible from the very beginning. I just do not run them.

  • MarcurieMarcurie Member Posts: 74

    Ruin in and of itself isn't the real issue. It's a scapegoat issue.

    If one isn't using Ruin, they're using something else. The very videos OP used are examples without Ruin only because Tru3 was testing viability of Dying Light and whether it could perform as well as Ruin.

    That, in a way, contradicts the very concept OP he or herself was trying to make from the very start.

  • Mister_xDMister_xD Member Posts: 3,042

    PGTW > Ruin

  • WateryWatery Member Posts: 900

    Ruin? I don’t know her.

    In all seriousness ruin isn’t really a big deal. You’re better off working through it.

  • MarcurieMarcurie Member Posts: 74

    One works better w/ the other. Not really a which is better kind of topic here.

  • twistedmonkeytwistedmonkey Member, Trusted Posts: 2,181
    edited September 25

    The videos show perks aren't needed they can just help in certain situations.

    No perk is "needed" they just help put you slightly above your normal skill level.

    Good players on either side can do well without any perks which is where someones true (no pun intended) skill lies.

  • oxygenoxygen Member Posts: 495

    Ruin is somehow overrated and underrated at the same time. It's not going to magically freeze the game if people know how to work through it, but it's not useless either even if it blows up 30 seconds in. Even a short-lived Ruin can make a noticable early game difference.

    Video "proof" is sorta pointless, and it's not about Tru3 whatsoever. Depending on people's opinions they can just discount it by saying "lol those survivors were boosted xD" or "lol those survivors were mega optimal and he lost before the game even started xD" to support their own point of view, no matter who the video comes from.

  • brokedownpalacebrokedownpalace Member Posts: 3,083

    Bingo!

    No perk in this game should ever be considered mandatory. If you get to that point, it's only because you've allowed it to happen.

  • GrootDudeGrootDude Member, Trusted Posts: 10,739
  • LCGasterLCGaster Member Posts: 3,154
    edited September 25

    Well, if you really want me to beat this dead horse then fine

    First off, videos don't prove your point, of course, everyone knows that

    Back to Ruin

    Is it necessary? In my opinion, no.

    But

    Does it help? Yes, if you're facing low rank survivors

    Why, you might ask.

    Well, low rankers often don't know totems spots, and some may still suck at skill checks

    Higher rank survivors will, for once, know where totems spawn, most can easily hit great skillchecks and, if they're smart, they'll stay on the gen instead of wasting time looking for ruin


    Now, Carpe, you may be wondering, why didn't I decide to weigh in on this topic sooner? Because I saw no point in doing so, that's why

  • stonecoldstonecold Member Posts: 29

    Tru3 himself said ruin is important because gens go on so quick.. He knows there's no balance in the game.

  • CarpemortumCarpemortum Member Posts: 2,669

    Then why feel the need to post about someone else not weighing in?

    If we all know videos arent proof and all....

  • MarcurieMarcurie Member Posts: 74

    Wrong. The point of the videos was to test out Dying Light as a substitue for Hex: Ruin. In particular, a perk that couldn't really be countered which is the issue with Hex: Ruin. You can hear the broadcaster talk about this if you pay attention and/or know what he's doing (i.e. have enough experience to understand some of his high level play).

    For example, he states it isn't as strong right away, but still accomplishes what needs to be done (slowing the game down). You'll also notice he uses Pop Goes the Weasel, but states that he's often unable to utilize it in some games making it near useless until end-game when there are only a few gens left to focus (and thusly usually in-range).

  • MarcurieMarcurie Member Posts: 74
    edited September 25

    There's so much pettiness in this thread...I'm done with it. The topic has greatly devolved into "you don't need perks [at all]."

    That's the dumbest thing I've heard yet since they exist for a reason. Who isn't going to add perks of any kind to play anything remotely "serious" rather than a joke or experimental "build" that isn't even built of anything?

    I dunno about you guys, but the DBD I know has a perk system and we use it. I think the original topic was basically about folks saying you needed Hex: Ruin to win. Honestly, this is what others on the outside looking in would say or think.

    At higher level play, no...you don't need Ruin to win. However, there becomes apparent issues with which perks similar to Ruin are indeed almost essential because of the imbalance of the game (bringing the real underlying issue of balance among gen repair speed).

    So if this thread had devolved or evolved either way, it should really have been about gen repair speeds at this point, not "you don't need perks at all!!11"

    I give up on this thread. ((You know nothing, Jon Snow.))

  • SnakeSound222SnakeSound222 Member Posts: 1,643
    edited September 25

    You really don't. However, it is harder to win without it and mistakes can be more damaging. I mainly play Doctor, Freddy, and Demogorgon.

    I don't run Ruin on Doctor and I can still get a 4k and double pip at red/purple ranks (it is much harder for me though, and I often get super paranoid that one of the gens is going to somehow reach at least 70% while I'm in a chase even though I recently checked them).

    I run it on Freddy, but I've only had one game where it was the main reason I won. Every other time it was because of my skill, Survivor mistakes, and/or the rest of my perks and add-ons. It does help out though, just not as much as some players like to think. I don't get super paranoid all the time with Freddy for some reason. Maybe it's because I'm running PGTW and Surveillance on him?

    I have Ruin on my Demogorgon, but haven't had time to play as it since I got the Adept. I think my results will be very similar to Freddy's.

  • MarcurieMarcurie Member Posts: 74

    @SnakeSound222 A: Because he has good map travel and control. I understand completely what you mean and honestly, am able to choose perks other than Hex: Ruin simply because I know I'll a) have more time to kick gens (PGTW, Overcharge, Brutal Strength sometimes) and b) I can run off to one gen and port back to the other, usually when I know survivors are waiting for the heartbeat to fall off to come out of hiding.

    Many things we do we don't necessarily realize because we do them out of habit.

  • twistedmonkeytwistedmonkey Member, Trusted Posts: 2,181

    My point was to those people that have been saying ruin is mandatory. A perk doesn't make a player better and if you have to heavily rely on any perk you haven't truly reached the peak of high level play.

    People who know the game inside out can win with no perks most of the time. Tru3 is one to have done this on occasion on stream of getting to rank 1 using no perks.

  • MarcurieMarcurie Member Posts: 74

    That's great for him, but most of us aren't ever going to put in as much time as that 1% of folks who earn off of playing and/or streaming.

    Just because he can do it, doesn't mean there's not a problem. I would argue that if majority of folks who play killer feel the need for a slowdown perk 99.9% of the time (always exceptions, btw)...then perhaps there's something off about the killer role and how it works (game balance).

    If everyone pretty much uses it and feels like it's way too much work without it, then it should honestly, more than likely, be a mechanic "built-in" by default. In this case, not necessarily that Hex: Ruin, etc. need to be given freely, but the process leading players to believe en masse that slowdown is needed, might be onto something...

    I say this because it affects the kinds of builds we are able to use and customize. For example, if gen speeds were slightly slower, then perhaps killers wouldn't feel the need to use 1-2 slowdown perks to have any real "optimal" build for certain killers (again, there are exceptions to killers and playstyles). If you want to be competitive, you're more than likely going to learn how to utilize these perks...and when to utilize them. This isn't always, but will be for a large amount of the games played.

    So, we basically cripple ourselves to achieve what, arguably, should already be present by default. If we could have that perk slot for something else I'm quite sure most of us with experience would gladly take something different. This would then place Hex: Ruin into the unspoken, unwritten category of "novice/helper perk." One that you grow out of--like Feng Min's Technician or Kate Denson's Windows of Opportunity.

    There comes a point where one becomes aware and knowledgeable enough through experience, trial and error, and practice that these perks aren't needed. Hex: Ruin would follow that kind of path if a slowdown perk (or even two, sometimes) were not basically required in order to prevent extreme gen rushes.

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