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RUIN + GEN SPEED // Adressing the elephant in the room



  • silverwolf4455silverwolf4455 Member Posts: 494

    The quickest solution to gen speeds is pressure. The devs obviously want killers to exert more pressure because they changed ruin from free pressure to earned pressure.

    Problem is most maps are way to big and have to many super safe loops, including god windows. Until they shrink maps to a reasonable size and work on some of these loops, the game will be extremely survivor sided.

    They keep balancing for newer players, because they just want to increase their player base. But balance should always be done for the top players in a game (red ranks). Otherwose just throw ranks out the window, why have them?

  • AtchooAtchoo Member Posts: 325

    Thank you for your input.

    Thats why I mentioned map pressure as an issue aswell. I totally agree with your statement, most killers do not have the tools to put pressure on (all) survivors. I hope they find another solution, I kinda like the map size, I do not want to play on very small maps, this would kill stealth gameplay.

  • ad19970ad19970 Member Posts: 3,831

    Looks like a really good analysis honestly. This game does have many problems that affect each other.

    I am convinced that a second objective, as long as maps don't get reworked fast enough, would be a good alternative solution for this game, but it can't come without a nerf to camping and tunneling, as well as buffs to solo survivors.

    Just a shame many people on these forums seem to be too immature to try and see the game and it's balancing from both sides and to argue about balance changes without becoming offensive.

  • silverwolf4455silverwolf4455 Member Posts: 494

    The maps dont have to he super small. The new springwood maps are around 140m, and you can definitely stealth on them. But there are several maps like rotten fields and mothers dwelling that are almost 180m.

    If we could shrink them all to springwood size, they would be much more manageable without being to small.

    Currently some of the big maps can take almost 40 seconds to walk across, which is half a gen just to patrol. Add in god windows and tons of super unmindgameable loops like those on Thompson house and Fractured Cowshed and the killer doesn't have a chance.

    When you can see the killer during the whole loop there is no mindgame so its just looping mindlessly. The fun part of the game is either moonwalking the survivor or joking the killer and sneaking away, which are taken away on these loops.

    You can have a couple but these maps have multiple of these loops plus strong tiles like the shack and cow tree. By the time killer is done being dizzy gens are done.

    I'm not saying these maps are unwinnable, but they need some changes. Size is a good start and could really make the game more intense and fun again. Let's face it, sitting on gens is boring, we all play the game for the interaction. Either losing the killer or stealthing and not being seen.

  • AtchooAtchoo Member Posts: 325

    I also think there is not enough interaction and variety, good points!

  • metteemettee Member Posts: 190

    Ruin is too strong if the totem is hiding in good place.

    And On Platform "Switch", it is too strong because of unstable framerate.

    But without ruin, gen speed is too fast.

    most killers have to rely on ruin that has risk to be cleansed instantly.

    I think ruin should change into perk without hex totem, and become week comparing present strength when the hex totem is not cleansed, and gen speed should become slow.

    Dead by daylight is good game, but game balance and rank system is bad.

    I suggest the following improvements


  • EZ5kEZ5k Member Posts: 233

    As I mentioned in another post. One of the biggest contributors to killer frustration is perk balance. It's simply insane how many times you have to rewin your same match because survivors are running BT+DS+Deliverance+DH. That loadout alone can win someone a game without even factoring the map into the equation, which more often than not, will cause a chase to be insanely long and frustrating, especially when there isn't a counter for anything in that loadout other than just swinging and hoping you don't get rewarded with an I frame.

  • Apple2oApple2o Member Posts: 624

    Of course there is. Deliverance requires you to unhook someone before it can be used, so even if everyone has it, not everyone will be able to use it. It is also relatively worthless if you get hooked early, even if it is up. It is mainly for being able to escape the basement, do an endgame trade, or save yourself when there's only 2 survivors left.

    The times I am able to make a crazy endgame deliverance play and the killer eats all of those perks at once is because they have not even hooked me the entire game.

    Dead hard is relatively easy to counter unless they are dead harding for distance, just assume everyone has it unless you see them with another exhaustion perk and play around that.

    You will only get hit with BT if you are camping. DS is overpowered though, I will agree on that. 60 seconds is way too long in a game that can last 4-5 minutes.

    That build also brings no situational awareness or stealth, so you will be very reliant on your team to survive, and will also be practically unable to lose the killer during a chase.

  • EZ5kEZ5k Member Posts: 233

    Deliverance requires a SINGLE unhook to proc, you get 8 chances, there's no reason you shouldn't be getting it to proc unless you're slugged.

    I already assume people have DH, the problem is that it can literally take a chase, and extend it by easily another 30-60 seconds if they use it to get to a god loop.

    Ah yes the ole, you must be camping. How about the fact that people straight up rush the hook and intentionally wedge themselves into it or loop you nearby just so BT procs?

    I can't count the number of times someone's been BT'd out the gate because the gates are open and instead of leaving, they just get a free victory card. There's no counter to that.

    While the build may rely on teammates, it can definitely cost a killer an entire match if one person brings it, let alone 4.

  • Apple2oApple2o Member Posts: 624

    If someone if trying to hook tech you, you can just stand there until the guy on the hook dies. They can't unhook if you don't swing; you don't need any more pressure because that's half the team doing nothing already. I have people try it on me all the time, and it usually costs them the game.

    And what do you think you are doing at the endgame when you get hit with the BT? Desperately camping for your kill, which is what BT is meant to counter. You can still camp out a kill even if they have deliverance unless they are literally hooked right next to the exit gate, which you should try to avoid.

  • EZ5kEZ5k Member Posts: 233

    Ye, lemme just avoid that when they get downed close to it, whew, what a big brain play. Also 2 people on gens is more than enough to crank it out within a single person's hook time, meaning you will actively depip and lose rank, making it, by default, a bad play.

  • Apple2oApple2o Member Posts: 624

    That's really your own fault for letting it get to late game in the first place. You can run powerful perks like NOED that will let you secure endgame kills almost always, if you find yourself getting there a lot of the time.

    Also rank means nothing in this game, and I will take a 4k safety pip over a 2-3k pip.

  • WaffleyumboyWaffleyumboy Member Posts: 7,318

    Could you link the debunk? I'm pretty sure Peanits himself agrees that gen times are not the problem.

  • Apple2oApple2o Member Posts: 624

    I don't even use ruin on half of the killers anymore, corrupt intervention is the way better perk in most cases.

    Watch someone like this guy.

    He has almost a 98% 3-4k rate with no ruin ever. Git gud.

  • EZ5kEZ5k Member Posts: 233

    I also use CI, however if you actually read what I linked, you'd have a better mechanical understanding of the game, something you clearly sorely lack out of willful ignorance

  • Eye66Eye66 Member Posts: 782

    This is the "It was cold today lol" response to climate change but for Dead by Daylight of arguments

  • Apple2oApple2o Member Posts: 624

    And I play at rank 1 on both sides, and 4k the overwhelming majority of my killer games. You can probably 3-4k 95% of the time if you know what you are doing in this game. I have just linked you the proof.

    A good killer can jump into a game and 4k with no perks, at rank 1. I've done it, I've seen it done. Ruin is just a crutch, and heavily reliant on RNG. It's as simple as that.

  • EZ5kEZ5k Member Posts: 233

    And that's a result not of your personal skill, but largely of the fact that even a potato can make it to rank 1 on the current survivor ranking system, meaning chances are you aren't getting paired with actual red rankers

  • Apple2oApple2o Member Posts: 624

    Yet I have killed almost every single popular streamer that exists in the game. I probably have tombstoned monto like 15 times now, though I never see him anymore. I go up against the sweatiest 4 man SWFs that exist, and they block me because I stomp on them.

    It's not because I know every single loop in the game, how to run them, have thousands of hours, know how to build a killer well, etc etc. It's just the ranking system.

  • EZ5kEZ5k Member Posts: 233

    I somehow doubt you go against the sweatiest, as if you did, you'd likely consistently depip from how fast the games go. However since you're such an all start then, why do you refuse to acknowledge the fact there's entire maps that can lose you the game if you don't play the top 28% of killers? Sounds like you're trying to toot your horn in avoidance of acknowledging there's an actual issue.

  • AtchooAtchoo Member Posts: 325

    I have 7k hours in Dead by Daylight, I mainly play killer and I totally agree with you. If you verse efficient survivors, you wont have a chance as killer without map pressure. Its neither the fault of the survivors nor the fault of the killer - its a mixture of all the problems I mentioned in the beginning. If you get one or two not optimal survivors, the killer has a big advantage. Right now many killers have to wait for mistakes of survivors.

  • terumisanterumisan Member Posts: 1,263

    What bothers me about the ruin changes is that it really only benefits the high mobile killers and when their pickrates increase because of it they'll get nerfs

  • AtchooAtchoo Member Posts: 325

    Interesting view on this situation. Never thought about it this way but it makes sense. It might change the pick rate of killers as well.

  • terumisanterumisan Member Posts: 1,263

    With how fast they nerf killers but how they are slow to buff or rework killers we'll probably end up in a situation where the high mobility killers are bad and the low mobility killers are still bad with gens speed and maps being the same

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