Is "Surge" a bad perk?
tippy2k2
Member Posts: 3,019
I just got the Demogorgon and barring a few ######### messaging me about how I'm a high ranked killer but I suck so therefore I must boost or some #########, it's been an interesting few games.
What I want to talk about though is his power, The Surge. For those that don't know...
"Putting a survivor in a dying state with a basic attack causes all generators within a 32 meter radius to instantly explode and regress 8%"
This perk seems super awesome but no one ever seems to use it or even really talk about it and I'm curious why. I've only played the handful of games with Demo so maybe it's one of those perks that seem good until you've used it a few times or maybe there are similar but better perks (I've only been playing a few month so a lot of perks I just don't have unlocked) or maybe just no one likes poor Demo because he's not a Top Tier Killer so everyone has ignored his perks.
What are your thoughts on Surge?
Comments
It is only good on a select few killers, it is generally a pretty garbage perk with M&A or 24m killers. Demos perks are Perry garbage overall, which is sad
Surge isn't based on TR.
Oops, I forgot, shows how garbage of a perk I think it is 🤣
This perk would be much much better if it didn't had that basic attack requirement.
It's an ok perk.
For awhile, Tru3 was using Ruin/Surveillance/Surge/and Corrupt(maybe it was Discordance?)on Pyramid Head.
Demo's perks could be good if they weren't so restricted.
Any killer who uses basic attacks to down survivors, it's a very good perk. It regresses the base ten percent and then eight percent, so 18% and that's PRETTY good.
As far as on killers like Billy, Huntress, and sometimes LF, it doesn't proc nearly as often and you won't wanna run it.
Surge is entirely character dependent.
Legion is a good killer for it sense you almost always down survivors with a basic attack that it will always cause generators to pop and due to the map mobility if you have Pop it works with it.
As well due to surging one side of the map frenzing to the other by chaining hits then popping one more gen.
Deathslinger it's ok on sense you can pull survivors into a basic attack(His power's hit counts as a basic attack for some reason) so you can force it to cause generators in a specific areas to explode.
That being said surge SHOULDN'T HAVE A COOL-DOWN AS ITS EFFECT CAN'T STACK.
If a generator is still regressing from surge then its immune to being surged again.
It is... mediocre. Unfortunately, there just isn't a strong case to run Surge over other gen-stall perks like Ruin, Pop Goes the Weasel, or Corrupt Intervention.
Surge is a fun concept for a perk that is let down by a few factors:
-It has a long cooldown. 40 Seconds is a lot of time for a situational perk like this to be on the backburner. I don't think most players like the killer-cooldown perks very much either; almost none of them see regular use (at least in my experience).
-Survivors must be downed with a BASIC attack. This means killers who more heavily rely on using special attacks get little utility from Surge (Huntress, Billy, LF, and Oni, as well as Pig, Plague, Demogorgan, and Pyramid Head to a lesser extent). That's almost half of the killer cast right there.
-It only effects gens within 32m of the downed survivor. This is the situational part that kills Surge in conjunction with its cooldown. If survivors are playing smart, they will be trying to lead the killer away from gens that still need to be completed (newer players often panic-dash to the corners of the map). Downing these players may activate regression on one gen, if you're lucky. Even then, if you're only consistently hitting one gen with Surge, you may as well run PGtW to apply 25% insta-regression instead of 8%.
-It has an underwhelming ability. Being able to instantly regress several gens without needing to kick them is pretty awesome, but that 8% regression doesn't mean much. That requires a single survivor to repair an affected gen for about 6-7 more seconds (probably the time you need to hook your fresh prey). PGtW takes up to 20 seconds off of a single gen (for one survivor), which is often just more useful and consistent as a gen-stall tool.
Personally, I'm hoping that they might cut Surge's cooldown in half (or maybe even quarter it), remove the "basic attack" requirement, and allow it to apply Ruin-regression speeds to any generator it affects. DG is a fun killer, shame that its personal perks really don't feel up to par.
Surge is a niche perk balanced like a versatile one, which is to say it's given conditions appropriate for a medium high payoff, but the payoff is low by comparison.
The only Killer that I can think of that can make the perk truly good is Ghostface, because he can get the most out of the perk: His downs are staggered, sudden, near gens and are via-basic attacks. Too many conditions for the disproportionately weak effect, ghostface consistently meets every condition almost every time, but no other Killer does.
Killers that are slower at downing won't get value out of this perk because the Survivor will get away from the gen in time
Killers that are faster at downing will be heavily bottle-necked by the cooldown
And Killers that down with M2 can't use the perk at all regardless of downing speed
I want to see the cooldown and M1 requirements removed. Killers that are slow at downing still won't get value at the perk, making the perk a specialized snowball perk, which it kinda already is except it's conditions explicitly prevent use for snowballing.
What base 10%?
Its not bad. I like it a lot on Michael and Legion, I just think it shouldn't have a cool down because of how restrictive it is.
I use it a lot on killers that always down with a basic attack, and even some that don't depending on circumstances.
Generally i'll use it on:
Nurse
Clown
Legion
Wraith
Myers
Ghostface
Deathslinger
I'll also throw it on pig even though she sometimes downs with her power. Generally i only use the power to get the first hit, or to hit the obsession to save STBFL stacks.
On most killers i have been running a build of BBQ + Pop + Surge + Surveillance. Generally you down someone, surge goes off, and if it stays white, you know nobody is there. If it goes yellow, you know someone is there repairing. So you can get a good pop on it. If not BBQ shows you where to take your pop too and now you know exactly when that gen is being worked on.
Surge is good for applying surveillance without kicks. It's definitely the perks primary purpose atm and as an alarm while ruin is up that someone is working on a gen within the range. Wouldn't recommend it outside of synergy builds and def not on demo as it won't apply to shred.
...so Surge and Surveillance work together? Because that makes me a LOT more intrigued in Surge as Surveillance is my jam on basically every killer I use.
The GF insight was pretty good. Nice.
Oh yeah, on specifically Ghostface in particular the perk is unironically good. Not having to kick gens is extremely useful for keeping momentum and you almost always get the perk to proc after each down. I'll frequently end up using the perk immediately off cooldown without even trying.
Yes ruin exists, but if it gets cleansed you lose far too much momentum. Surge lets you keep that momentum more reliably.
The person you responded to is confused. They thought the explosion from surge was the same as a failed skill check (which sets a gen back 10%), but they're incorrect. It's not 10% + 8%. Surge only regresses affected gens by 8%, full stop.
When a survivor misses a skillcheck it regresses 10% by default.
Surge + Ruin (if Ruin survives) is pretty good.
What's that got to do with surge?
Surge isn't a missed skillcheck.
I have seen builds with it, however i think POP does a better job for it.
People do say this game doesn't provide enough scares...
😈
Surge acts like a missed skillcheck. Therefore applying the 10% on top of the 8%.
It's meh. Only being triggered by basic attacks and its cooldown are really holding it back.
No it doesn't. It just creates an explosion.
Explosions have nothing to do with regression as per the perk technician which negates the explosion but does nothing to the regression.
The 10% regression is exclusively tied to the actual act of a Survivor missing a skill check
I’ve just started trying it recently. If you’re one of those people that likes to take Ruin and Surveillance then its probably decent as it will work with Surveillance after Ruin is gone.
Its not a bad little perk I dont think so far. Its good against solo as it makes gens regress, but obviously a 3-4 man swf will be able to communicate to stop any gens from regressing too far.
Also sometimes it comes in clutch. Like when you down a survivor and another is trying to rush a nearby gen, Pop is stronger but you need to pick up and hook first. Because that 8% kicks in as soon as the survivor is hit Ive had it stop survivors from finishing a gen in front of my face when Pop couldn’t.
If you say so.
Would be good if it worked with PGTW. Unfortunately, slowing down gens is illegal.
That actually happened to me in my last match, which was kind of the inspiration for the thread. That gen had to have been seconds away as she kept working the gen as I smacked her down. Lost the percentage, other survivor couldn't pop it before I circled back after the hook.
If the perk didn't have a basic attack requirement and didn't have a cooldown it might become a viable alternative to Pop. I have no idea why they make these perks and then slap a cooldown on them, punishing you for doing well.