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Dead Hard is overpowered...



  • pwncxkespwncxkes Member Posts: 235
    edited August 2020

    The place where you use Dead Hard is important. If you Dead Hard in a open space you have just played yourself, and most of the time that’s what happens because that’s when not good survivors use Dead Hard.

    Not all the time the survivor is going to get to a pallet because of Dead Hard, so that isn’t a second chance for them.

    Also it’s not always 3 times they get another chance because if you remember they have Dead Hard then use that info to your advantage. If they make it don’t swing, now that you have gotten rid of that persons Dead Hard just chase them normally. But if they continue looping you because they know how to loop leave him. Your wasting your time, go find someone else and apply pressure to the other 3 survivors. If you find that person again you know know that person has Dead Hard, and you can capitalize on that.

    But in the end of the day Dead Hard can be effective in very certain instances, but when it works it works well.

    The perks effectiveness is relied on the survivors surroundings, but if there isn’t anything then cool it’s a nice down, but if is isn’t then keep chasing a make decisions accordingly. It’s either they waste the Dead Hard or the chase keeps on going.

    Most survivor perks are situational, perks like Iron Will, Dead Hard, Adrenaline, DS, Sprint Burst, Balanced Landing, Unbreakable, etc. Those perks I just listed are good perks, Why? because they excel in the things they are needed in. If a perk is good we shouldn’t just bash it to the ground, it’s just super useful in what it is supposed to do. Those perks are not useful in other areas but does really well in the important areas, that’s why it is used. For a good perk in survivor it needs to meet atleast 1 of the 4 requirements

    1) Needs to help in chase

    2) Needs to help for working on objectives

    3) Helps you evade the killer/ being stealthy

    4) Helps you stay alive

    Not one survivor perk in the game meets all 4 of those requirements.

    Thats why perks like Dead Hard are used because of its effectiveness in chase. It doesn’t help you be stealthy, it doesn’t help you get gens done.

    Dead Hard isn’t the problem, it’s just the players play style to be in you face and trying live and outsmart you or outplay you.

    Dead Hard is used by aggressive survivors that want to get chased that’s why most of them are experienced enough to know when to use Dead Hard, most of time good survivors will give you a good run with Dead hard. They are just using it to the maximum, The reward is wasting more time.

    I kinda went a little off topic but you get the idea, maybe. But if you don’t then that’s awkward.

    Post edited by pwncxkes on
  • JokersmileJokersmile Member Posts: 76
    edited August 2020

    Dead Hard is fine its my favorite exhaustion perk when i play survivor if you use it to only dodge killer M1 then you are using it wrong

  • pwncxkespwncxkes Member Posts: 235
    edited August 2020

    Nerfing Dead Hard isn’t necessary either. For example, if we made it a one time use the pick rate would fall ALOT because it doesn’t have a big of a impact. If a perk is a 1 time use it should be very impactful. Like Adrenaline, it really can change the tides of the game. If every exhaustion perks is just used once than they would just die out and barely be used. If you use the perk early than you just have a empty perk slot for the rest of the game.

    Nerfing good perks isn’t healthy for the game. You can’t just blame the perk just because someone actually used it nicely, if it took no skill to use Dead Hard then it wouldn’t be a problem at all and this thread probably wouldn’t even exist. If it were no skill people would just be dead Harding into walls and corners and dead zones, which I do very often. 😂😭

    Post edited by pwncxkes on
  • OpexOpex Member Posts: 264

    I never said they should nerf HO, I only said that HO is the only other add-ons than DH that gives you no sprint burst.

    I would actually say HO needs a buff. It is okay for things like getting out of the basement and so on. But usually it is just a funny perk for fun plays but not really good. I think they should remove the exhaustion from HO. It should instead get a 20 second cooldown. The cooldown is only there because of the fact that survivor could trap killer in a stun animation. 2 Survivors could just keep stunning him infront of a locker for the rest of the game and he cant move while the others do gens. On Silent Hill there are a lot of lockers just standing infront of each other and the killer would always be scared in hallways to get trapped with HO.

  • Mak0Mak0 Member Posts: 250

    Then to after someone else its not the survivors fault you won’t stop chasing that nea giving them free time to go gens

  • FreakPrinceFreakPrince Member Posts: 466

    Then DH should get a cooldown aswell and not be a exaustion perk since both DH and HO don’t give a sprint burst according to your logic.

  • OpexOpex Member Posts: 264

    Do you even understand what I'm saying? I'm just saying that other exhaustion perks don't need a nerf because they just give you distance and no second chances for just pressing a button, HO is the only perk that doesn't give you a Sprintburst with DH. But that doesn't mean that booth perks are too weak. DH gives you 3 second chances per game for just pressing a button and counters most killer abilitys with no counterplay to it. Only way to counter DH is respect it which you just cant do most of the time. HO just stuns the killer after jumping in a locker and waiting 4 seconds to jump in his face. I mean its a funny troll perk but does need a buff because its not good at all.

    Can this just be a normal discussion without you even reading what I'm typing, please stop acting like a 5 year old or just stop typing some ######### in the forums.

  • FreakPrinceFreakPrince Member Posts: 466

    ALL exaustion perks are second chances by the press of a button. I’m saying your logic doesn’t make any sense.

    Complain all you want, it’s never gonna be changed.

  • azameazame Member Posts: 2,870

    The perk hardly works most of the time. Killers respect it if not used for distance. How else is it supposed it be used? You cant even be mad.

  • azameazame Member Posts: 2,870

    He dont know about that dont mention it most of these knew killer mains dont know I respect the ogs who know whatever op.

  • azameazame Member Posts: 2,870

    That would kill the perk completely, you admitted ot spirit carrying you that's a problem in itself tha tf needs to be changed.

  • OpexOpex Member Posts: 264

    How is HO a second chance perk?

    How is Lithe a second chance perk? You get the sprintburst AFTER you vaulted the window, and AFTER you vaulted it the killer cant hit you anyways.

    Balanced can be a second chance perks but it is just really unconsistent, on some maps the only place where you can get a balanced landing are the basement stairs.

    Sprintburst is a second chance perk when you 99% it, usually if you just use it normally its also not a second chance perk. You cant stop sprinting while having it 99%, and while you got sprintburst you cant run otherwise you will just use it and get a exhaustion even tho you are just walking around to a gen.

    DH is a second chance perk. There is the risk of being exhausted on the floor but that's just a issue with their servers and not a perk issue. They will fix it and than that wont happen anymore. Only way to counter DH is by respecting it which most of the time is not possible. Most of the time survivors are just gonna DH to a pallet or a window where they wouldn't make it to without DH. It counters 50% of all killer abilitys and you cant counter that (only deathslinger can). Imagine playing trapper and the survivor is just using DH to go through your trap and you just have to pick it up to go through there lol.

    Yes the devs are not gonna do anything, biggest playerbase of the game are survivor mains. DH is one of the most used survivor perks and you see it literally every game, by nerfing it they would just make their playerbase angry, those players that they get the most money from. But I'm still allowed to say my opinion about it, even tho nothing is gonna change by me complaining.

  • MigrantTheGreatMigrantTheGreat Member Posts: 1,258
    1. That was an example
    2. At least Spirit forces survivor's to use the perk as intended to avoid taking a hit instead using it to gain distance
    3. Your right! I did admit to being to being a Spirit main, but just because I main her doesn't mean she's the only killer I play. If you re-read my comment your replying to you can see that I said "Ever since I stopped playing Spirit religiously and improved my gameplay with other killers and got better at mindgaming" So you can stop attacking me for being a Spirit main now
  • OpexOpex Member Posts: 264

    You cant use it as an argument that DH doesnt work most of the time, devs said they are gonna fix the problem with their servers so survivors dont get hit from 10 miles away. That will also fix DH and it will be even stronger.

    Killers can respect DH yes but most of the time thats not possible. Survivors are most of the time gonna DH to a pallet or window and you have no counter to that.

    DH also counters 10 killer abilitys exactly half of all killers and the killer have no counterplay to that. How are you gonna bait DH as nurse? As huntress while throwing a hatchet. As Trapper when they DH through your trap. You just gain 3 second chances per game for no skill at all, its just pressing E. It is really strong but I mean it could have stayed. But since the ruin nerf most of the time you are not gonna win against survivors if many of them have DH and just waste so much more time every chase by just pressing E. I'm a nurse main and I don't notice that while playing because usually I win no matter how many times DH saves their lifes. But when I play other killers like a normal M1 killer like Legion, Trapper, Gorgon and so on.

  • OpexOpex Member Posts: 264

    I'm not sure if you want to say that spirit needs nerf, but if so yes that is true she needs changes. But that doesn't mean that DH doesn't need changes.

    Yes if you could use DH only once per game no one would use it anymore and they should not do that with DH.

    A good idea would be in my opinion that you can only use DH while being chased for 30 seconds or longer. It would still do the exact same and give you a lot of value. But it would also take more skill because you have to hold the killer for a certain amount of time before using it. That would also make it harder to use, if it takes more skill it can also be strong. If the killer plays really well and kills you fast he will get his deserved kill and you wont get a second chance just like that even tho the killer played better than you.

    That idea is also just my opinion and there might be even better ways to change DH. (I know DH wont get changed, survivors love DH, survivors spend money, devs love money.)

  • FreakPrinceFreakPrince Member Posts: 466

    Because it gives you an advantage where you wouldn’t have in normal gameplay. It’s very simple.

    Of course you have every right to give your opinion, but like I said, while DH keeps not working properly, you’re only making fun of yourself.

  • NursesBootieNursesBootie Member Posts: 2,159

    Exactly. People use it for distance aka as a second chance in form of a exhaustion perk.

  • azameazame Member Posts: 2,870

    1. Understandable but still not a well thought out one.

    2.9/10 if you use it to avoid taking a hit you get downed and exhausted it's too many inconsistent to not use it for distance. You know that so you cant truly complain.

    3. I already seen your comment rhat said you stopped. But you said you stopped to get better at mindgames which means you werent good at them before we which also means spirit carried you. Not attacking you for maiming spirit just saying its proof that spirit needs to be reworked.

  • azameazame Member Posts: 2,870

    I'm gonna start with we dont know if the devs are gonna fix window hits so DH still might not be broken. The devs have a track record of messing things up.

    DH is also just an exhaustion perk sure it corrects mistakes but I'm suprised you arent speaking about sprint burst when in the hands of a good looper you can instantly correct your positioning and loop optimally. You also have to remember all the things you mentioned are what dead hard is supposed to do make you avoid damage so you are complaining about a perk that when working does its job.

    Having that 30 second wont do much as you can just waste a pallet to insure use do it's just a waste making that change. All in all DH is fine and when used for distance you cant complain when it doesnt work half the time.

  • azameazame Member Posts: 2,870

    Nah its definitely second chance but I use sprint burst because my looping is good. That being said the way its used is because you cant bait hits because a)killers respect it and b) you get downed and exhausted.

  • DetailedDetrimentDetailedDetriment Member Posts: 2,632

    Butchered by Dedicated Servers. OP

  • OpexOpex Member Posts: 264

    The devs said in a QA livestream that they are gonna fix dedication with their servers, survivors wont get hit through windows anymore. They wont get hit from 10 miles away and wont be exhausted on the floor.

    It is good that DH does its job yea, but the problem is not that its doing its job the problem is what its job is. I mean it really doesn't take any skill and gives you so much value from it. Sometimes it ######### up and you are exhausted on the floor yes but thats gonna be fixed soon, you cant use an bug as an argument.

    For example Spirit needs a nerf and Nurse doesn't, but nurse is stronger than spirit. Thats because Nurse is the hardest killer in the entire game to play, she takes a lot of skill and practice and the only thing this killer does is rewarding skill with a really strong killer. Spirit just needs a good headset and that's it, you need MAX 5 GAMES and you can play her. It doesn't take much skill and is just really strong, TOO STRONG.

    If you think about it like that with DH and SB. DH just gives you 3 second chances for the press of a button. It counters 50% of all killer abilitys with no counterplay (exeption deathslinger). The only counter against DH is respecting it which is really situational and survivors are just not getting punished for making a mistake because they can just DH and get a second chance. Takes no skill at all.

    SB is a perk that just gives you distance, its not a second chance perk if you look at it like that its just a little bit of time waste or from getting away from an open area. But its not as strong as DH while used like that. You can 99% SB and I don't think the devs planed people to do that but I mean okay its a strat found by survivors. If you look at it like that yes it is a second chance perk, but first it doesn't counter 50% of all killer abilitys. You have downsides like as soon as you stop sprinting your 99% is gone. While not being in a chase you cant sprint otherwise you will just waste your SB. Yes SB is really strong but it got downsides and got more counterplay to it, and most of the time survivors are not gonna 99% it and instead use it for distance. That's why SB shouldn't get changed in my opinion, only DH.

  • ZozzyZozzy Member Posts: 4,479

    DH turns nurse into a 3 hits to down killer :(

  • azameazame Member Posts: 2,870

    Ok once again the devs aren known to mess simple things up like auras I have alot of hope for them to fix it. So I dont understand why you repeated that.

    You can use the bug as an argument because it has been buggy since patch 2.0 the animation made it worse then dedicated servers killed it. If you played in 2017-2018 pre 2.0 the perk was amazing and better than sprint burst every 40 seconds whipe running or walking you had that marvelous perk you never got hit through it and you could still use it for distance.

    Sprint burst is fine as a perk but still better than dead hard because you can instantly reposition yourself idk if you play alot of survivor but you dont know how much that means. You say deadhead counters 50% Of powers I mean the perk says avoid damage during the dash so isnt it supposed to do that so once again complaining about a perk doing its job and besides it is a one use. Per 40 seconds.

    You should use sprintburst more you it has a skill cap not a big one but a skill cap it's too much to type into words but using the perk will teach you how to be efficient with it. DH doesn't need to be changed because if you complain about you losing hits it's doing its job if you complain about distance it's still doing its job it's a dash.

  • NursesBootieNursesBootie Member Posts: 2,159

    I'm just braindead af i know. How do i just NOT know how to counter DH for distance as trapper, so cringe honestly. /s

  • OpexOpex Member Posts: 264

    I mean you are right many times the devs mess up simply things. 9 Months ago they said they are gonna fix matchmaking and now they just add MMR because they couldn't fix it. They messed up the auras first time and they might mess up the DH / Dedicated server fix too or not even do it.

    I started playing in 2017 (about summer), but you shouldn't say a perk is better or worse because of a bug. The bugs are suppost to get fixed and its not the perks fault. I mean I just think you shouldn't use that as an argument.

    Sprintburst is fine and might be better than DH but it got downsides (which are not bugs), it takes more skill than DH and doesn't just give you a second chance by pressing one button, you have to 99% it first and as soon as you have to stop sprinting and so on you wont have it 99% anymore. Its not about DH doing its job, its about what its job is. I mean its good that it does its job but its job is just giving you a second chance by the press of one button multiple times per game.

  • azameazame Member Posts: 2,870
    edited August 2020

    This perks been bugged for 2years so what can you really say? The devs dont care enough to change it just like they dont care enough to enable server side hit validation. If you call its job a second chance so be it.

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