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Surge Opinions?

BossBoss Member, Trusted Posts: 13,578

Having used this bad boy again all day, i came to the same conclusion as i've done before. (Mind you that this conclusions is solely based on Wraith being the user.)


I really really really like this Perk.

Seeing 2-3 DAMAGE GENERATOR score events pop up with just 1 down feels good, especially knowing that regression also starts.

I mean i don't love the Perk, y'know? I'm not surprise-hitting with M1s, completely stopping chases, y'know?

And okay, maybe it's not on PGTW's level, but i kinda don't mind: I like not having to go out of my way to kick Generators.


That said, the cooldown really really really feels like an unnecessary hindrance to it, and without it, i think i might even replace PGTW in my main build with Surge.

It feels so terrible to down someone in the last 5 seconds of its cooldown, which happened i think 7 times today.

The immediate regression is 3x smaller than PGTW, which still sounds good when combined with my earlier-mentioned 2-3 DAMAGE GENERATOR score events, while in reality it's way more often just 1 or 0, since 100% & 0% Generators obviously don't count. (Also: Generator deadzones exist.)


You could have a really good slowdown Perk here that could be a competitor with PGTW & Hex: Ruin.

But i guess that's the problem here, right? That combining these 3 would then lead to massive slowdowns?

In that case: Why even have other slowdown Perks? Why add a new one with The Twins?

No, i'll always feel like Surge would be close to perfectly fine without its cooldown.


Probably could've worded things better, but i don't care at the moment, if you point out stuff then i'll edit.

What's your thoughts on Surge?

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Comments

  • KebekKebek Member Posts: 3,676

    I've been using surge for ages and as long as you play killer who downs with M1 it's imao equally good as pop as long as you play into it, applying pressure around gens you've surged. Even better, paired together they synergise quite well either full active time of pop in gen regression if survivors don't touch gens you surged and if they do you get pop on top.

    CD is warranted as it's actually pretty strong, only buff I would give it is to trigger from all downs (like infectious fright), not just M1 so that killers with dowing power can use it as well.

    It's not meta worthy perk but it does what it does really well and that's consitently applying gen regression so that you can focus on chases without wasting time kicking gens, kind of like mini-ruin.

  • BattleCastBattleCast Member Posts: 698

    I like Surge. I just wish I could use it on Killers who down mostly with their power. It’s definitely better than PGTW if your looking to keep your tempo as a killer as you won’t have to do chores such as kicking generators as often.

  • Warcrafter4Warcrafter4 Member Posts: 2,906

    Surge has always been a perk with 2 too many conditions out of its 5 conditions.

    Surge's conditions:

    Down a survivor.

    With a basic attack.

    With generators in range.

    While off of cooldown.

    If the generators within range aren't already regressing (removed in the mid chapter patch so it now works with ruin).

    So it still needs one more condition to be removed for it to be a meta competitive(Not a meta perk but a contender for it) perk(Most likely the basic attack one).

  • NegiNegi Member Posts: 310
    edited November 2020

    Downing someone just out of range of a generator happens too often. Plus we got ruin + undying for hands off regression that isn't tied to only basic attacks. Surge needs a bit more range or a bit more regression, right now it's just a perk with conditions that doesn't even give much payoff.

    I do like the idea of the perk but I always felt it came up short.

    Edit: I completely forgot it had a cooldown, that's even worse.

  • VolfawottVolfawott Member Posts: 3,876

    Honestly the only thing that surge needs is to have the basic attack restriction removed.

  • GhostwithafaceGhostwithaface Member Posts: 594

    Surge as a perk has the same weakness as low mobility killers. On a map like the game, it can work great due to the small size of it and how close gens are often put together. On a map like red forest, it suffers greatly due to how often gens are spread out far and wide. For surge another issue with it, is you can down a survivor just slightly out of range of a gen. Leading to it lacking consistency all the time. The cool down on it, stops it from being useful if you are snowballing. Since you don't get much of out of it, if you down two or three people with in a short time. It only works on basic attacks, making it only useful on a handful of killers. Which unless a survivor messes up their pathing, they can get a fair bit of distance away from a gen on a hit, unless the killer is running save the best for last, than maybe they can down them with in gen of a range, should a survivor just go, time to get out of dodge.


    While surge when it works, does save you time from having to hook a survivor [unless you count hooking a survivor as something you were already going to do anyone, since to kill off a survivor you have to hook them or slug them out.] and from kicking a gen, it might even possibly stop a gen from being done in your face in rare cases. However it does lack consistency. Where if you look at something like pop. You down a survivor and hook them, bang. Do that and long as one gen or more is remaining, you get to use pop. Which pop doesn't relay as heavily on rng as surge, when it comes to gens being close together. Gens can be so far spread out that no such thing as a three gen exists and you can still make some use out of pop. While it would be way harder to do so with surge. While the idea of surge being able to hit more than one gen sounds nice, in reality is more often than not, one or zero gens. Rarely will you get two or three gens. That and oh hey a survivor is working on a gen, it got hit with surge. Still going have to kick it, if you want it to regress. If surge hit the three closest gens or three random gens, the regress you would get from it, would only be 24%, slightly less than pop.


    You can win games with only surge as your single slow down perk but odds are it will be alot harder to do so. With how many things that get in your way of using the perk. Surge has to be one of the few killer perks that is not a hex perk, that relays on rng of the gen spread and everything going just right to make use out of it.

  • ZaytexZaytex Member Posts: 836

    If it made the generators regress faster than normal, I'd probably run it.

  • TAGTAG Member Posts: 12,010

    I've been using it for my meme build for a while now. I don't think it's particularly good, but in my specific case, it is probably the best option for a slow-down perk that I have. Drop the cooldown and the requirement for basic hits only, and we'd be in business.

  • Wooliest_MammothWooliest_Mammoth Member Posts: 20

    I'd love to use it on Killers like Blight where you're very aggressive and not spending time kicking generators, but there's way too many restrictions.

    I'd like to see the cooldown be removed and that it no longer effects generators that are already regressing. This maintains consistency with other gen slowing perks and you can't stack Surges in one area.

    The most frustrating thing about the perk is that you have no control over the cooldown. It doesn't matter whether you're playing really well or poorly, it depends on the perk's cooldown.

  • DeadeyeDeadeye Member Posts: 3,464

    I don't even think that PGTW + Ruin + Surge would be such a great build. Surge works with Ruin, but PGTW kinda gets countered by both perks

  • GrimReaperJr1232GrimReaperJr1232 Member Posts: 890

    Surge is a decent perk but is very... underwhelming.

    There are 3 main regression perks: Ruin, Pop, and Surge. Of those 3, Surge is the weakest—It has the smallest effect but also a ton of conditions.

    Pop - Hook a survivor, and then kick a gen within 45 sec for 25% regression immediately.

    Ruin - Just get them off a gen and watch it regress at 200% the normal rate.

    Surge - 1) Down a survivor. 2) Be within 32m of a gen. 3) down a survivor with a basic attack. 4) Have the perk be off its 40 sec cooldown. What do you get? 8% regression.

    Now, Surge did get a noticable buff that it's the only one of the 3 regression perks that can damage gens that are currently regressing, giving it more synergy with Ruin/Pop. That said, there are far too many conditions for such a small effect. It doesn't need much; just a few tweaks

    1) Have it trigger on any downs

    2) Reduce the cooldown to 20 secs (i would say remove, but if you're a Bubba with a chainsaw, you can get an insane amount on regression on potentially multiple gens

    3) Either increase the range to 40m or increase the regression from 8% to 12% (this one is just my personal opinion; I know some might disagree with this one)

  • DeadeyeDeadeye Member Posts: 3,464

    I think removing cooldown AND basic attack requirement would indeed be too strong. And just thought about an alternative and think that the 1/2/3 closest gens (depending on tier level) should explode. That would remove the distance requirement and would be really strong on tier 3, therefore maybe justifying the cooldown. That might at least be an alternative to removing the cooldown

  • gatsbygatsby Member Posts: 2,339

    Surge is extremely good on Killers that down with basic attacks. It synergizes beautifully with Ruin and Undying.

    Because it stacks with Ruin, I think the cooldown is fine. It just wish Surge was like Infectious Fright and worked on Killers that down with their power and on locker grabs

  • WillApolloWillApollo Member Posts: 20

    If they threw in some extra bps for every gen you get with it, I think it would become more popular just for BP farming alone

  • Saltjar34Saltjar34 Member Posts: 766

    It makes Surveillance viable so it's a good perk

  • KoloniteKolonite Member Posts: 1,346

    Ruin is a better perk and combos better with Surveillance. Unless they changed how the two interact with one another.

  • DurkaDurkaDurkaDurka Member Posts: 28

    Which killers is it worth it to you? Only one I ever run it on is ghostface

  • Saltjar34Saltjar34 Member Posts: 766

    Fair enough. It's just that every time I remember Surge I remember that one Otz video where he runs Surge and Surveillance on Ghostface and he occasionally talks about how great it is that you don't have to kick the generators.

  • HollowsGriefHollowsGrief Member Posts: 1,497

    It needs a bit of love if you ask me. buffed to 12% and make the CD like 20s and work on any kind of downs not just basic attacks.

  • PulsarPulsar Member Posts: 12,556

    I want to like Surge, but I feel it suffers from something that most non-meta perks suffer from. Why should I take Surge over PGTW or Ruin/Undying?

    It's map dependent and arguably less reliable as a result, plus the cooldown is annoying.

    It's by FAR Demogorgon's best perk, and I want to like it, but unless it gets something else to make it competitive, I can't see using it.

  • gatsbygatsby Member Posts: 2,339

    @Pulsar Demo‘s best perk is actually Mindbreaker. It got an extensive buff and severely hurts exhaustion perk users. It’s lowkey overpowered when combo’d with some Killers and Add-Ons

  • XpljesusXpljesus Member Posts: 392

    Remove the basic attack cooldown (most important) and perhaps lower/remove the cooldown (would be nice) and I'd use it perhaps (I don't use ruin/pop though, usually nothing or corrupt). Basic attack limitations are frustrating though and unnecessary on some perks, like they actually managed to nerf Knock Out because they thought this was necessary for some reason. This perk is clearly not as good as PGTW/Ruin, it needs some love to make it more useable.

  • PulsarPulsar Member Posts: 12,556

    I, respectfully, disagree.

    While it certainly hurts Sprint Burst users, the counter is to simply run away sooner. Additionally, since it is only 5 seconds, it isn't unreasonable to say that a Survivor could get their Exhaustion back by sitting at a pallet.

  • TAGTAG Member Posts: 12,010
    edited November 2020

    I don't really agree that it would be OP, personally. If it gets to a point where a Killer would be able to make gens pop in super quick succession because of their power, they're kinda already in a winning position as-is. I actually think effectively removing the distance requirement is more likely to break Surge than removing the cooldown.

  • AChaoticKillerAChaoticKiller Member Posts: 3,104

    cooldown plus it's low regression on a generator is what makes me pick other perks than it. Even if it activates on multiple gens there is usually only one gen you care about and the regression it provides isn't enough to defend it.

    i really only use this perk on hag since it saves me time to set up traps and because i usually have gens close to each other but on any other killer i would rather use pop goes the weasel.

  • gibblywibblywoogibblywibblywoo Member Posts: 3,773

    I started using it on Demo recently and its ok. The main problem is the basic attack restriction. M1 killers tend to take a little longer to down so there's much better regression perks for them. Surge would be a lot better if that restriction were removed and the cooldown were slightly lowered.

  • AChaoticKillerAChaoticKiller Member Posts: 3,104
    edited November 2020

    the perk is really only good on high mobility or ambush killers, doesn't suit demo imo. As a perk i do think its demo's best perk again because it is just really good on those types of killers who can get close and land a hit.

    edit: there are better regression perks than surge, imo you can get a lot more use out of pop simply because it doesn't rely on basic attacks and it provides more regression at practically the same amount of times it activates.

  • gibblywibblywoogibblywibblywoo Member Posts: 3,773

    I think it'd be great on Demo without the basic attack part as Shred is so useful for him. I think it works pretty decently if you play Demo as a defensive killer where you control one side of the map. It's just you have to hope they aren't a good looper or you catch them off guard (which is tough for stompy boi) or in a dead zone.

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