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Playing killer with MMR has to be the most unenjoyable experience in the past 6 months

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  • onemindonemind Member Posts: 3,089

    And yet the only time I got even slightly agitated was when I was playing my main but even then they were good so its not like it was impossible just difficult

  • BloodshadeBloodshade Member Posts: 2,302

    yeah i don't like it. either you get babies that run into walls because you're playing a killer you haven't played in awhile (or in the case of billy apparently, MMR being bugged) or you get survivors that all have a similar MMR, meaning a sweat fest with no weak links.

    plus i don't see how high MMR isn't just going to be SWFs? like this system is so fundamentally dumb that they should just drop it like they dropped the idea of having an early game collapse.

    also they need to have a QoL update for controller. i'm at my wits' end with how bad it is.

  • BloodshadeBloodshade Member Posts: 2,302
    edited March 2021

    what they SHOULD do is just revert rank reset back to -2 colors per reset. that way rank actually matters a little more at the beginning and middle of the season. then make it so people who have reached red ranks, if reset to brown/grey, face at least purple when they come back, preventing people from stomping brand new players. expand the matchmaking for new players to face green ranks so their queue times are decreased (the skill difference between green and brown/grey isn't that great).

    but they won't because that's too simple, they're too prideful, and their decision makers are just questionable.

  • crowbarmancrowbarman Member Posts: 462
    edited March 2021

    The killer may wait longer, but then the survivor will wait even longer than they are already.

  • ZamblotZamblot Member Posts: 270

    With a good team is the keyword I'm afraid. When you aren't with a 4 man SWF some solos can be nightmares and MMR doesn't help that

  • chadbeastofpreychadbeastofprey Member Posts: 433

    if you can't take an L and only have fun when you get 4k's that's your problem. soon you'll lose enough that it will adjust your mmr into lower ranks and you can have fun again.

  • rglarson13rglarson13 Member Posts: 197

    A lot of people keep pointing to the 2k as the gold standard of fairness in a match, but logically it doesn't make much sense.

    Because it's an symmetrical have, at some point the match either is or will become unbalanced.

    It's either balanced for 4v1, meaning as soon as the killer gets a kill it tilts in his favor. Meaning once there's one kill there are likely to be more. This increases until there are no survivors left in the match.

    Or maybe the game is balanced for 3v1. When the match starts with 4 survivors the killer is at a disadvantage, and has an uphill battle to overcome that issue. If he can't get a lucky break somewhere then the game will end with 0k. If he can kill 2 survivors then it's now in his favor and that last one is easier to get.

    And the same story for if the game is balanced for 2v1.

    I don't think anyone could make any argument for why the game is balanced for 1v1.

    The point is that matches should be more likely to end with either a 0k or a 4k than anything in between.

    Sure, maybe while you're chasing someone the other survivor us doing a gen, but that's not really balance -- the idea there is that the game proceeds in a predictable, linear fashion, with the killer requiring, e.g., 90 seconds to find, down, and hook a single survivor, while finding and completing a gen takes each survivor 100 seconds.

    If that's the case (which really does seem to be how the devs view "BaLaNcE") then winning or losing a match hinges on RNG placement of generators at least as much as it does on a killer's ability to extend the time required to complete a gen of survivors who are outside of the chase or the survivors' ability to increase the killer's time between hooks.

    But if that's the case, then there's no "balance" and we shouldn't expect a 2k to indicate an even match, because the distance between gens and a specific killer characters's mobility have much more to do with that time than the skill of the killer player.

    Also, while the killer's ability to reduce time between hooks is limited, the survivors can fairly easily force the killer to spend extra time between hooks by quickly getting to multiple generators that are far apart, and maximize the overlap of time required for each gen completion, because while a killer can only hook one survivor at a time, survivors can complete up to 4 gens at once.

  • MunqaxusMunqaxus Member Posts: 2,568

    You do understand what "Average" is? If one match is a 4k and the next is a 0k, then you have a 2k average.

  • rglarson13rglarson13 Member Posts: 197

    Yes, but my point is that we shouldn't expect a 2k, let alone take it as a sign that the match was fair.

    Look at it this way: we should expect everyone we meet to have an average of 1.95 eyes, or whatever, because some people have fewer than 2 and bring the average down. But I bet you don't meet someone with 1.95 eyes very often.

  • RumaRuma Member Posts: 1,936

    With wins do you mean 4k? Or 3k + hatch like otz did?

  • rglarson13rglarson13 Member Posts: 197

    It's not mechanical balance, though. In what way is it?

    People arbitrarily decided that 2 was half of the survivors, so that must be balanced.

    But given the nature of the game a 2k should be rare. Being symmetrical means the match should tilt one way or the other, and once it does you're more likely to end with either a 0k or a 4k.

    For a 2k to be a likely outcome, what's being "balanced" is the time to achieve advantage vs the time a match takes to complete.

    If the idea is that a 2k is balanced, then the killer must start with the advantage -- given enough time he'll kill everybody (which is what we see, generally). Meaning the only thing being balanced is how long gens take to complete.

    Except that like I said, map size, gen placement, and killer mobility vary too much for that to be dialed in and achieve any sort of balance.

  • ProfeziaProfezia Member Posts: 673

    I mean, you finally got a worthy opponent and it just so happens the game is survivor sided on high levels of play.

    I really hope new MMR system that will match good with good and bad with bad instead of sorting people by played time will show everyone how actually things are in the game.

  • GoodBoyKaruGoodBoyKaru Member Posts: 18,647

    3k + hatch because I don't enjoy slugging in general, slugging for the 4k being included. I feel like I won with 3k+h so I won with 3k+h

  • KilmeranKilmeran Member Posts: 3,116
    edited March 2021

    The reason the forum is pointing out the 2k as the gold standard for fairness is because in the past, the Devs have stated several times that they design around the goal of 2k-2e.

    We see how that has worked out so far, but that standard came from the Devs, themselves.

  • NVerdeNVerde Member Posts: 264

    I don't understand why killers complain that survivors use every advantage they can and use meta perks...like, what do you expect them to do? Just sit around and let you kill them?

    Very puzzled with why there's always so much hate for DS too considering it's a one and done, it usually only comes in handy if you're being tunnelled, and if you don't like it, it's easily avoided.

  • MadLordJackMadLordJack Member Posts: 8,815

    I was hoping that MMR would get me out of the ######### hellscape that is the ultra-skilled W-holding, but no. I guess I can just go ######### myself. No fun allowed.

    I think I'm going to main Spirit if the MMR goes live. Screw caring about my opponents fun when they clearly don't care about mine.

    I wish this stupid game had a better Bloodlust system so that I could actually play any killer bar Blight, Nurse and Spirit.

  • ilovedbd123ilovedbd123 Member Posts: 1,941

    That's the thing.

    People have been pushing for working MMR for years .

    People blame them for ######### teammates

    Now they get butthurt because whilst their teammates are good, they are getting placed against appropriate killers with this aswell (good killer players) who tend to gravitate towards good killers (nurse, spirit, hag).

    No because there is a lack of killers. So they need to push killers onto the people who need it. This works both ways, it can both make a game easier for killer, or harder.

    Since killers have instant queues this means that they will just get slotted in. And survivors have a longer queue time because up to a point the MMR will try and match a killer with the correct MMR. This means that it'll get you a match, just will take longer and there's a chance for it to be as bad as it used to be.

    1) that's true to an extent, killers lack power (except nurse and spirit) against good survivors. And survivors are already complaining about going against these two a lot. Soon there will only be these two.

    2) it's an unchallenged fact that you need 1 weak link to secure at least a 2k, otherwise you cannot do anything at higher levels of play. So yeah, killer has only been bareable with this.

    Yeah, but I don't think they could balance it enough to the point where high rank survivors can be stopped, and low rank survivors have a chance. They are trying to do both, which is near impossible. My advice would be balance around high rank but also add in some safety wheels.

  • BotizBotiz Member Posts: 386

    I feel pretty confident in my skills with Blight.

    If I do have a high MMR with Blight, and MMR is working correctly then i'm also going against high MMR survivors.

    Against high MMR survivors where there are likely to be more occurrences of SWFs, only Nurse and Spirit can compete.

  • BotizBotiz Member Posts: 386

    I can take a loss if it also meant I had fun that match.

    The issue is, if i'm not having fun, it means I have to constantly keep losing again and again whilst not having fun at all until i'm at a lower MMR where I can have fun.

    Not everyone is going to want to play to lose to not have fun just to lower their MMR.

  • BotizBotiz Member Posts: 386
    edited March 2021

    As someone who plays both sides pretty equally, the verbal abuse i've received over my playstyle or perks as killer has been 100x more than what i've received as survivor (which is like, nothing at all) and i've been playing September 2018.

    So when you try actually switching up your build and then you see survivors constantly using the same DS + Unbreakable combo and want to go back to your regular meta build as killer, you've gotta be prepared for verbal abuse in either post-game chat or DMs.

  • RumaRuma Member Posts: 1,936

    Alright congratz for the winstreak.


    I never counted my wins, i should start it too soon.

  • aEONoHMaEONoHM Member Posts: 208

    Sounds like you were just smashing solo queue potatoes and now you’re getting actual skilled survivors due to your SBM ranking being inflated on Blight. I don’t know what your definition of “tons of wins” is but if it’s 4ks then you should know the game isn’t balanced that way and you’re going to be in for one hell of a rough time if you don’t adapt.

    I love this sbm test and I hope to God it goes live.

  • realflashbossrealflashboss Member Posts: 244

    I think the matchmaking was better. Ignoring the ranks I've been and played against yellow ranks were good and reds who were potatos! It just shows the system is matching on skill.

    You need to give MMR time to put you against hard matches til you find your skill level. If you keep losing eventually you'll go up against fairer matches.

    What's the point in playing as killer if you're just going to constantly get potato teams every 8/10 games and vice versa for survivor.


    Unfortunately with the old rank system you go against people you think are fairly matched cuz they're red rank and they're actually not good, so yes I've had some games which are a lot more sweaty but for the most part I think it's been better and closer games as both killer and survivor!

  • AncilleAncille Member Posts: 37

    Something even better I found out, I have so few games as Oni it physically wouldn't place me in a lobby. Lasted over half an hour. To test, I switched to my main (hag), almost instant lobby. Switched back to Oni? Another question minute wait before I said eff it and didn't bother.

  • Dizzy1096Dizzy1096 Member Posts: 918

    My experience was the same. Since they started recording MMR I've probably played PH the most and put more effort into him. It showed, the games were sweaty but the worst part is literally every survivor held W as much as possible, along with swf splitting across the map on gens.

    There really needs to be more of a discussion about high level play in this game because for all the hate spirit, freddy, PH get by survivors who say they're OP and take no skill, you're literally just holding forwards in your games to waste as much time as possible. I don't care if these games are balanced they must be the most boring games I've ever had since I started playing DBD and I've gone against forever legion builds before. Every single chase just hold W as much as possible, if that's how DBD will be then I might as well quit now because that's boring as hell.

    Competitive games are fun at a high level because the mechanics are fun. This does not apply to DBD, the mechanics and strategies of the game are not fun at a high level.

    I've seen others play and once again we're seeing a reflection of tournaments where most of the killers just fall flat and you need to sweat your butt off to get any kills. This just pushes people to slugging Nurse and then it's the surviors who have no fun. DBD is really not ready for MMR.

  • APoppAPopp Member Posts: 22

    I disagree. The point of testing the MMR, in my opinion, was to try playing multiple characters. I played characters that I normally play and I got matchmade with decent Survivors because I can secure a 4k a decent amount of the time. Then I switched to a killer that I haven't played in probably over 6 months and got easy survivors. The situation is that if you are good at a specific killer and can 4k a great majority of the time, you will get really challenging survivors as that killer.

  • BaldursGate2BaldursGate2 Member Posts: 994

    It's still easier to rank up as killer than as solo survivor. 2-pips are much more common.

    A competetive player from overwatch i believe said: You win 1/3 of all games regardless how bad you play and you lose 1/3 of all games, regardless how good you play. The other 1/3 is where your playstyle decides the outcome.

    But that's only on teambased games and i don't think you can have that on the survivor side.

    If you want to win, play certain Killers or Killers with Addons, like Trapper with Iri stone / Purple bag, you will win most of your games.

  • HectorBrandoHectorBrando Member Posts: 2,032
    edited March 2021

    Myself I didnt really noticed THAT much of a change as my main Myers I do reckon I saw less grossly absurd mistakes which translates in less wasting time but I also saw more people doing Dull Totems and Chests which also translates in more wasting time. Didnt play Jigsaw for I wanted to test the MMR with one of my two mains but I suppose it would be the same.

    I tried it with Oni (who I bought 3 days ago) and have zero experience and while the Survivors were far worse they werent as bad as they were when they first put the MMR online, at least these were ranks 10-14 instead of ranks 19-20, they still werent good enough to pose any threat of escaping, but at least they did manage to fix 4 gens, I guess the system still needs some work on neutral MMR for Killers.

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