Yeah, I'm unsurprised at anything you're saying here. This is the standard spiel - it's your own fault for being bothered that I'm rude to you, it's your fault your skin isn't thick enough to put up with online games and you should get off the internet for a while to get over it, it's your fault for not liking that my idea of playing Dead By Daylight is to annoy you and I have the right to treat you however I want as long as I'm not calling you slurs you so you're the one who's wrong for expecting anything else when you bought the game.
Using the guise of 'it's a party game' to justify any behavior is ridiculous. That's like claiming I could join in a game of Twister and spend the game 'accidentally' knocking everyone else over, because it's technically within the gameplay, it's a game, and I am having fun screwing over and hurting the other players. A game is not a game when all the players involved don't agree to the same standards.
But the worst thing is, your kind of player is so comfortable in the environment you've created that you don't even care how many people are driven away by it. Once everything boils away, you're the dominant strain that remains in the petri dish.
At least you didn't try to defend exit gate shenanigans. I can't win this argument because you don't care about the consequences of your actions, but if nothing else, you aren't pretending anymore that it's anything other than what it is.
This is one of the reasons I make it a point to always play nice.
I don't want the survivors to leave the game thinking I treated them unfairly.
I even avoid doing particularly powerful plays because I know that they're completely unfun and cheap for the survivors. I've only ever intentionally slugged once (I wanted their friend to pick them up so I could get my Mori daily), I've ran NOED one time (I had no other perks that had any actual value to fill my last slot), I only camp if there is virtually no chance of me getting another hook, and I only tunnel if I see a key or an Object (you are literally asking for it if you run OoO).
I want to feel powerful, but I know that that is absolutely not an excuse to ruin someone's day.
To be fair, based just off the themes and concept of this game.... It's a scummy game. Killers torture people and sacrifice them to an entity in endless loops. Can't really be surprised when the worst of people come out. Looking for love in all the wrong places.
I'm not condoning it, just not glossing over the obvious.
Yea, I have run into quite a few people who tried to be comp in fishing against me or had something to say to me. When I use fishing as an outlet to escape from society as a whole, because I just don't wanna deal with it lol. I've been playing games since I was 4. Started MMO's at 5 years old, so I have had a lot of time on MP games since then. So I can only speak from experience of how the industry has changed since then. Yea a lot of people my age still act like they are in middle school, but then again it's just an increasing number of people in general of all ages that seem to cause drama/toxicity everywhere including dbd. I try to be as nice as I can, but I don't take it if someone dishes it out towards me that's for sure.
Players like you are a credit to the game. Always love running into people after a match with your kind of attitude.
My favorite way to play killer is to get everyone or most on death hook, then either ignore the players who are already on death hook in favor of the ones who aren't, or leave the death hook players slugged so that someone else can pick them up. I'll keep whacking them around past the point where I'm hooking anybody, and I'll make them work for the last gens, but I won't kill anyone and I'll goof around if survivors get the idea to approach me. Everyone gets to play the game. Nets me a lot of positive messages after chat - and I'll admit, I feel the same way. I don't want survivors to leave unhappy over something I did. Same thing as a survivor - I'll often offer myself up if there's a 4-man escape and I didn't need the escape for something or other. But that's my brand of feeling powerful and feeling nice, anyway. Never used NOED, though I've been having a lot of fun with Devour Hope lately.
I only tunnel if I'm going for an adept/4k rift challenge and someone unhooked before I had a chance to leave - or if the player really made a point to BM me, because at that point, you get what you give.
I actually DONT play like that but its nice to assume things on the internet. just because someone gives you a counter doesnt mean they are that. I was quoting you with the party game line either way. i never said anything that you are saying. If the survivor is doing things that gets them BP then your arguement is not valid. So it wasnt fun that you got looped to the extreme, IT HAPPENS TO EVERYONE.
If we are being honest if a simple teabag gets you so tilted you need to go on the forums to rant about it being bullying, dude you probably should take a break.
You should not assume things about someone who doesnt agree with you. THAT IS RUDE. Good-day Sir
Good for you. Same here. I try to treat people the way that they treat me.
I've also been gaming since I was 4 (1982). Man, has the industry changed. The internet has made gaming both amazingly deeper and profoundly worse. I guess the same can be said about what the internet has done for society as a whole.
You and Laluzi seem like really decent people, the kind that I'd be happy to be in a game with. Should you ever like to add me feel free, same name as the one I use here.
Have you been interviewed by @WishIcouldmain yet?
You certainly qualify, and judging by this post it would be super interesting.
You're the one who came in here to rant about how bully behavior isn't bullying and it's everyone else's fault for being oversensitive on a thread complaining about how new players are being driven away by highly experienced players being dicks, and then proceeded to drop the laundry list of the usual reasons why it's their own fault for not enjoying other people being rude to them and wanting to be able to play the game without being subjected to it.
You can't get all surprised Pikachu when people assume that you're a part of the behavior you're very explicitly condoning. People generally don't defend bad things unless they identify with them.
And for the record, since one of your posts came in delayed - how is it not sadistic to derive enjoyment from making someone else feel bad? That's douchey no matter how you slice it. Forget the themes of the game. They're window dressing, and an excuse. 'It's a game about killers so you should expect me to be nasty' is as dumb as 'it's a game about killers so you should expect me to actually be violent and kill you.' It's a game. People play games about racing cars and slaying dragons. Games do not fundamentally change who we are as people and the only people that genuinely believe that are the middle-aged busybodies who think Pac-Man is corrupting the youths.
My idea of a good time involves not having random people go out of their way to be asses to me for the express purpose of provoking me into an angry reaction. I don't expect other people to go out of their way to make things fun for me, I expect them to not go out of their way to not make things fun for me, because that's not playing a game, that's just trolling someone. This extremely discerning standard applies to most people, so I'm not exactly the one demanding something unusual - it's the people who want to rain on everyone else's parade and think they have the god-given right to do that that are the aberrations and the ones who generally mess things up for the majority. I'm not talking about players who get tilted and play nasty in response, or the players who use unfun tactics because it's the best way to win and they like winning. I'm talking about the ones who start up a session of DBD to see how many ragequits they can cause in one day, or how many angry comments they can fish out.
I'm gonna be honest, the whole 'you're the entitled one if you think people don't have the right to treat you like crap for their own amusement - think of their amusement' is... pretty damn entitled. Why would I owe any consideration to the kinds of people whose bread and butter is giving no consideration to anyone else? It's obvious BHVR wants to cut down on the nastiness present in the community - the fact that they run surveys about this and then implemented a filter that (very badly) tries to prevent people from discussing heated topics, rather than just blocking slurs and calling it a day, makes this evident.
The bullying can be a little bad sometimes but I don't think its that much of an issue
Please enlighten me when I said it was ok to bully people? PLEASE DO. I said if it is getting them BP then no it is not. Its not the players fault they are trying to maximize the points they can get. Anything after that, ok. Until your BP is maxed youre not bullying. I have ran around looking for totems after the gate was opened to get more points. If I knew I was a much better player and can loop to get more bold points, I am gonna do it. I am not doing it to "bully" I am trying to get BP.
You tried comparing gameplay in DBD to playing twister and physically hitting someone. The whole topic ended there as you reached so far and dropped the straws. Bullying and talking nonsense has no place in the game but that doesnt make everything toxic because you have a bad game. That idea is absolute nonsense. Teabagging at an exit game celebrating the fact you won is now bullying? Really? Taking the entire time is another deal, that shouldnt happen.
I will teabag at pallets mid-chase and click my flashlight to tilt the killer and make them keep chase. Its not bullying, some of what youre saying is but not all. Youre blanketing everything into 1 and thats not how this works. Its like expecting the killer to be nice and let you get away. Its an entitled state of mind. Oh no I am not having fun or I dont think this is fun so its automatically bullying.
It used to be worse. Doesn't mean it's okay, just that it used to be way worse.
You'll see a lot of threads in the next few days about this sort of stuff due to the Rank Reset bug.
I haven't yet, but I would accept the offer if it was there.
Well, you haven't, because you and I have pretty different definitions of bullying. I can't cite that because your entire argument is that none of this behavior is actually bad to do. But I could cite any of your posts on how survivors being rude or dragging out the game isn't bad because they get points out of it, and all the ones telling me it's my own fault for not wanting to deal with people being unsportsmanlike at me.
If this is all for BP, then explain to me all the bloodpoints people get from spam-vaulting the killer over so they can open the hatch in their face, or waiting at the gates until the killer shows up so they can tbag before they leave. You don't need maxed BP to bully people... I'd also ask you to explain why it's so hard to show some basic empathy for fellow players, but that might be overreaching. Like, for example, for a red rank squad to show a bit of compassion for the rank 15 killer that's plainly given up and just wants to ######### move on to the next game, and isn't even trying to chase them anymore, but they won't let them because it's too funny watching them flail and because they can still extract some bloodpoints by running around just out of reach, but apparently this is all okay and you don't have to act like there's a human being behind the screen as long as there is a material benefit to screwing with some poor sod that's trying to play a game, and I know when to pick my battles. I will however call bullshit on the material gain being the impetus for this kind of behavior, because no. It might be a factor, but I call bullshit on it being the reason. Occasionally, yes. Some people are just mercenary with no psychological strings attached. Maybe that's you. But if most people were in it for the bloodpoints, they wouldn't be tbagging after every whiffed hit and they wouldn't be laughing in the endgame chat calling the killer names and telling them to play Civ 5 because they're ######### at the game. (Or screaming about crutch perks and undeserved kills when it turns out the killer as NOED and he actually takes some of them out when they finally stop screwing around.)
Because doing that is nasty. It doesn't matter if you're getting something out of it or not. It's being a dick at someone else's expense and there's no moral high ground to be had here.
You're cherrypicking my posts and grabbing whatever points are convenient to you, and you're making just as many assumptions about me as I have about you. Me not having fun does not equate to bullying. I play many perfectly by-the-book games where I don't have fun due to misplays, bad luck, map offerings, et cetera. Players that follow me around clicking, I ignore, because they're just trying to get me to chase them and that means I probably shouldn't spend time on them unless I have no idea where anyone else is. But I do understand their intent, while annoying, is purposeful. But players behaving in ways that have zero benefit to them, or would require a taxing routine of mental gymnastics to pretend were done for any other reason than to piss me off, is... bullying isn't typically the word I'd use for anything other than dragging a game out when the other side clearly cannot keep up with you, or doing crap like slugging people and refusing to hook them for four minutes, but definitely rude and pretty draining to encounter.
The whole post this took off on involved me conceding that certain things have functions beyond griefing the killer, but saying I didn't encounter them as much as I encountered players being rude for the hell of it, when there was no other reasonable explanation for their behavior - and that they were still frustrating to encounter. Which you did too, but you've been acting like that's all I'm talking about and ignoring everything else. My last few posts have been centered around that area, purely spiteful gestures with no gain attached, and you keep dodging the point. I don't see a reason to continue debating this with you as long as you continue to fixate on analogies instead of actually addressing the meat of the argument.
Also, thank you for confirming my belief that yes, you do take part in this behavior after all, you just don't think anyone has the right to have a problem with it because you achieve a result from it and therefore there's nothing wrong with trying to piss someone off as a strategy. Like I said, people don't defend these things unless they identify with them. I'm going to be extremely generous and take you at face value - as in, you don't actually find these things fun to do and you'd be just as happy playing DBD without an in-game language to piss people off with. It's just useful to you, nothing more.
I'm curious. What are your thoughts when the killer facecamps you or tunnels you out of the game in response to the tactical BMing? Is that fair turnabout, or are they at fault for taking your very logical strategy personally? And is it the killer's fault for thinking you were a nasty person who was making fun of them when you were trying to make them mad, but strategically?
Because I'm pretty sure if the target can't tell the difference, it's still functionally bully behavior. Just because you got something from it doesn't make it not mean.
I pick the parts out that I dont agree with, everything else I do.
When I get facecamped after looping the killer for a long time, I laugh. Their facecamp is my champagne. Even if I die I still won because I wasted the killers time that much during chase and after. When I get the basement bubba treatment I laugh because its a game. They are most likely just trolling to get me mad.
If you dont allow them to troll you with the teabags at the gates 9/10 they leave. When Im playing killer and people click at me and teabag I know whats happening. I DONT ENGAGE.
As for SWFs showing compassion, PEOPLE MEME. They will literally play like a noob all game until the last gen is done and then slaughter them. It goes the same for both sides. I dont play a game and expect people to show compassion. I play to have MY fun. I dont play to make others feel warm inside.
Im also a killer main BTW. L OH L
I truly think some are enjoying this rank reset problem for all the wrong reasons. Many are using it as an excuse to bully other players they know are less experienced just to "fw". I have actually seen this! This will cause those new to the game to flat out quit. I have talked to several friends who I introduced to the game and they are done after a few matches the last two days.
I agree with everything @Laluzi is saying. I also think online games are a weird, emerging category and some of the bad behaviour we see is because a) this is a new space that we don't know how to regulate yet and b) capitalists got here first, so the whole thing is framed around profit rather than creating a healthy environment.
I think gaming will look very different in 30 years. Right now, we're in the wild west stage where people can get away with doing really antisocial stuff because it's hard to stop them.
And the sad thing is with less and less killers the newer killers are going to be lobbied against higher ranks and possibly get driven from the game which will make lobbies worse for survivors...a friend of mine refuses to play killer anymore and will only play survivor after dealing with back to back clicky click squads using haddonfield and swamp offerings
And what do they say?
Just thinking out loud and agreeing that pallet jumping near the hatch or exit gates makes me ignore them even more or stare at the wall while I check stuff on my phone
You can say that indeed. I write it on the end game chat it if my team-mates are t-bagging or complaining with no reason.
I don´t like these type of behavoiurs, independently if they are on my team or not.
I think this is not a specially toxic game or community. But game experience would be much better if every player had consideration and respect towards the other players.