In my opinion, while moris needed to change, they overdid it, since yes, moris are basicly useless, outside of maybe avoiding a ds of flashlight save.
But before the nerf, whenever someone asked for one, the response was "but what about keys", and thus people though it might be an adequate compatision, which i hopefully showed why its not.
One problem with the mori change was never adressed though, the fact that some killers needed them to keep up with swf.
But then, in this regards, keys are a little similar, because between Dcs, suicides and tunneling killers, solo survivors need a reason to keep going when the first survivor is out due to one of that reasons, and to me, hatch and keys are that reason.
We should get a totem counter since swfs get one as base kit. If killers are to be buffed then the gap between swf and solo survior needs to be bridged
"often before more than one or maybe two gens were done"
I disagree, the first chase usually results in 3 gens done unless you got potatoes.
"Now look at the 2 extreme cases of a key"
Lets look at a middle example since that's more realistic than extremes. Lets say you want a 3 man key escape, you just need to do 1 more. Hell you could 3 gen yourself and get out with your 2 teammates. 3 man escape is a win.
"keys dont have the power to turn a lost game into a win"
Again, 3 people out is a win, when it could have otherwise not been. So I disagree with this as well. Even if it doesn't force a win it can force a tie at 3 gens done, which are pretty much guaranteed to the survivors. Again, unless they're potatoes.
"the game is further progessed normaly than it would be when an old mori was involved."
Involved maybe, but the problem isn't necessarily when the item/offering started effecting the game, its the "ok I'm doing well, I killed a survivor, I got a 3 gen, 2 of the others are on death hook -screen fades to black, results screen pops up- annnnd I lost." the same way before it was "ok we're doing well, thats just second hook, aaaaaand there's a mori."
"the key doesnt shape these games, because gens still need to be done"
And chases still need to be won by the killer twice for each mori, one to hook, one to mori. Keys can definitely shape the game, your priority becomes to kill the key holder, not just go after any survivor because if you let the key holder live they'll just get 3 man win early before the killer gets much use out of their main power point of 1-2 gens. Even then it doesn't do much because someone else can just pick it up.
"you could basicly skip doing gens and derailing it the same way."
Yeah like skipping the last 1-2 gens to force a win or tie, like a key does.
"while keys only do something in the end when most of the game is already done."
In any game with competent survivors, most of the game takes place around 1-2 gens. When can you use a key to force an outcome that's not the killer winning when they could have? At 1-2 gens. Again, the problem is it can just change what could have easily been a win into a loss or a tie.
Keys don't really have any counter the same way mori's didn't. Except now Mori's are trash and keys are still strong as ever, scratch that, stronger with the Franklins and Mori nerf as there's nothing to do about them. Was a mori nerf needed? Yes! But we also needed a key nerf that we never got.
I have that feeling about Blight or Wraith. Every third game it's a killer loaded with a tremendous advantage in slowdown perks. It's so bad, there's even POP used as a backup to Ruin.
Totally agree. Generators are impossible to complete when killers run Ruin/Undying with Pop as a backup. Keys level the playing field against an opponent with busted power.
I still think keys are far weaker. You still have to complete most of the objective and still try to find hatch, and someone has to die. Most of the time the killer wins before it gets that far because those slowgen perks are so oppressive.
Lobby dodge and find survivors who actually want to play a full game...as a killer main in the evening you get to choose the terms not them...most I ever have to lobby dodge is a couple of games and then fun time😎
Last minute switches where the killer cant do anything is cheating...I would DC from the game as well and load back in...guarantee I find a match quicker as killer than the survivor playing lobby simulator for trying to cheat the system.
Reminds me of the time when they straight up told us 2 months in advance they were gonna nerf instaheals, those matches were miserable as every survivor would bring them to the game.
Sometimes the survivors put themselves into a terrible 3-gen situation, that you would have easily won by picking people off, and instead they don't repair and all escape with the key after one person has died. It's very frustrating.
Also, why ARE there so many keys recently? There's been one every other match for me and I see no challenge in the current tome for it.
This isn't true. Just because there are good survivors and second chance perks doesn't mean survivors haven't been nerfed, A LOT over the course of this game.
I was with you until you said "keys are not broken" - in most cases, they absolutely are. The franklin's revert, however, is a welcome one imo, regardless of how lazily it was implemented. Something still needs to be done about keys. Hopefully BHVR is actually working on it and it will be released soon.
This is certainly not the case for most people I assume. I have seen 1 key on my team in the past few weeks if I remember and I believe 1 was found in a match that we were able to use. Other than that keys feel like a rare use occasion for me. I'm probably going to go ahead and use up the keys I have while they're still worth using because I feel like with all the complaining about keys I see lately (which again I believe is not very substantive and just some killers getting super offended that a key was used against them) that the keys are going to get nerfed into dust and not even worth collecting from the blood web anymore. Hey lets not stop here. Lets remove all survivor perks and remove our ability to run too. Also lets just remove the escape capability for survivors and let the killers get 4k every game. I mean it is DEAD by Daylight right? ... :(
Keys should spawn in every match. Killers should never bellyache about keys when endgame collapse exists, a completely killer sided mechanic. A killer should never ever be able to hook a 3rd person, stand on the hatch and guarantee their 4K. That's a lose lose situation for the survivor and it happens every time in this situation.
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I’m not a new player bud
In my opinion, while moris needed to change, they overdid it, since yes, moris are basicly useless, outside of maybe avoiding a ds of flashlight save.
But before the nerf, whenever someone asked for one, the response was "but what about keys", and thus people though it might be an adequate compatision, which i hopefully showed why its not.
One problem with the mori change was never adressed though, the fact that some killers needed them to keep up with swf.
But then, in this regards, keys are a little similar, because between Dcs, suicides and tunneling killers, solo survivors need a reason to keep going when the first survivor is out due to one of that reasons, and to me, hatch and keys are that reason.
We should get a totem counter since swfs get one as base kit. If killers are to be buffed then the gap between swf and solo survior needs to be bridged
"often before more than one or maybe two gens were done"
I disagree, the first chase usually results in 3 gens done unless you got potatoes.
"Now look at the 2 extreme cases of a key"
Lets look at a middle example since that's more realistic than extremes. Lets say you want a 3 man key escape, you just need to do 1 more. Hell you could 3 gen yourself and get out with your 2 teammates. 3 man escape is a win.
"keys dont have the power to turn a lost game into a win"
Again, 3 people out is a win, when it could have otherwise not been. So I disagree with this as well. Even if it doesn't force a win it can force a tie at 3 gens done, which are pretty much guaranteed to the survivors. Again, unless they're potatoes.
"the game is further progessed normaly than it would be when an old mori was involved."
Involved maybe, but the problem isn't necessarily when the item/offering started effecting the game, its the "ok I'm doing well, I killed a survivor, I got a 3 gen, 2 of the others are on death hook -screen fades to black, results screen pops up- annnnd I lost." the same way before it was "ok we're doing well, thats just second hook, aaaaaand there's a mori."
"the key doesnt shape these games, because gens still need to be done"
And chases still need to be won by the killer twice for each mori, one to hook, one to mori. Keys can definitely shape the game, your priority becomes to kill the key holder, not just go after any survivor because if you let the key holder live they'll just get 3 man win early before the killer gets much use out of their main power point of 1-2 gens. Even then it doesn't do much because someone else can just pick it up.
"you could basicly skip doing gens and derailing it the same way."
Yeah like skipping the last 1-2 gens to force a win or tie, like a key does.
"while keys only do something in the end when most of the game is already done."
In any game with competent survivors, most of the game takes place around 1-2 gens. When can you use a key to force an outcome that's not the killer winning when they could have? At 1-2 gens. Again, the problem is it can just change what could have easily been a win into a loss or a tie.
Keys don't really have any counter the same way mori's didn't. Except now Mori's are trash and keys are still strong as ever, scratch that, stronger with the Franklins and Mori nerf as there's nothing to do about them. Was a mori nerf needed? Yes! But we also needed a key nerf that we never got.
Found the rank 12 survivor main
I have that feeling about Blight or Wraith. Every third game it's a killer loaded with a tremendous advantage in slowdown perks. It's so bad, there's even POP used as a backup to Ruin.
Keys are really fine.
Totally agree. Generators are impossible to complete when killers run Ruin/Undying with Pop as a backup. Keys level the playing field against an opponent with busted power.
it can't be that bad
I still think keys are far weaker. You still have to complete most of the objective and still try to find hatch, and someone has to die. Most of the time the killer wins before it gets that far because those slowgen perks are so oppressive.
I also use keys now thanks to Franklins nerf. And thanks to that nerf I don't play killer atm.
wdym killers usually have to tunnel if they dont get a decent early game i rarely see killers camping or tunneling
and the post is exaggerating every second or third game but fr i see more keys than noed users in red ranks
noed is really only used in green ranks and below
I literally said i'm seeing one to two keys every other game, but there have been games with three and in one case four.
Please tell me you dodge it. These people don't deserve a game.
Run stbfl, noed, starstruck and sloppy butcher. Hard face camp, hard tunnel them out of the game.
Even weirder, they dodged me, in lobby, 3 separate times that screenshot is of the 3rd time I found them, they left shortly after
Huh that's new. Unless they have a way to know who you are or what killer you're using?
If they are scared to face a blight while they have 3 keys and a map idk what they wouldn't be scared of
Lobby dodge and find survivors who actually want to play a full game...as a killer main in the evening you get to choose the terms not them...most I ever have to lobby dodge is a couple of games and then fun time😎
Its funny that baby survivor mains are crying about spirit having no counterplay, but when something from their side has no counterplay it is fine 🤔.
Last minute switches where the killer cant do anything is cheating...I would DC from the game as well and load back in...guarantee I find a match quicker as killer than the survivor playing lobby simulator for trying to cheat the system.
Reminds me of the time when they straight up told us 2 months in advance they were gonna nerf instaheals, those matches were miserable as every survivor would bring them to the game.
Sometimes the survivors put themselves into a terrible 3-gen situation, that you would have easily won by picking people off, and instead they don't repair and all escape with the key after one person has died. It's very frustrating.
Also, why ARE there so many keys recently? There's been one every other match for me and I see no challenge in the current tome for it.
This isn't true. Just because there are good survivors and second chance perks doesn't mean survivors haven't been nerfed, A LOT over the course of this game.
I was with you until you said "keys are not broken" - in most cases, they absolutely are. The franklin's revert, however, is a welcome one imo, regardless of how lazily it was implemented. Something still needs to be done about keys. Hopefully BHVR is actually working on it and it will be released soon.
This is certainly not the case for most people I assume. I have seen 1 key on my team in the past few weeks if I remember and I believe 1 was found in a match that we were able to use. Other than that keys feel like a rare use occasion for me. I'm probably going to go ahead and use up the keys I have while they're still worth using because I feel like with all the complaining about keys I see lately (which again I believe is not very substantive and just some killers getting super offended that a key was used against them) that the keys are going to get nerfed into dust and not even worth collecting from the blood web anymore. Hey lets not stop here. Lets remove all survivor perks and remove our ability to run too. Also lets just remove the escape capability for survivors and let the killers get 4k every game. I mean it is DEAD by Daylight right? ... :(
There is a tome challenge where you need to escape with an ultra rare object and I ly keys and maps have those, so it might be just that.
Typical response from another entitled killer main, when someone dont agree with him. XD
Well I saw six last night alone out of ten games. So.
Yeah.
Keys should spawn in every match. Killers should never bellyache about keys when endgame collapse exists, a completely killer sided mechanic. A killer should never ever be able to hook a 3rd person, stand on the hatch and guarantee their 4K. That's a lose lose situation for the survivor and it happens every time in this situation.