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Man, it is getting seriously annoying being practically forced to use the same build.

Getting constantly tunneled, camped, slugged, and gen rushed is even more unfun. Seriously what has this game come to? I don't wanna use DS, UB, and some other second chance perk but when I'm constantly getting left on the ground for minutes on end or getting tunneled out within minutes of the game it leaves me with no choice. I don't wanna have to use multiple gen slowdown perks but when I'm playing a Killer with no map mobility I'm forced to. Seriously, these issues were all present before SBMM but ever since it's been enabled it has really ramped up.


  • th3th3 Member Posts: 1,711

    I mean I've been shaking up my builds and still do fine.

  • wxnickxwwxnickxw Member Posts: 742

    I don't really know if Unbreakable should be considered 2nd chance. If the killer can't be bothered to get you on the hook after you've been down that long it stops feeling like a second chance perk.

    Any more than getting unhooked or having someone heal you from the dieing state normally is second chance anyway

  • HeartboundHeartbound Member Posts: 3,256

    I'd recommend just playing perkless and go for the Power Moves achievement. It's time to break your reliance on perks.

    Be free.

  • Gamedozer7Gamedozer7 Member Posts: 1,956

    The problem is for a average killer or like me one thats not that good gen speeds are to fast without slow down. One mistake can lead to 3 gens been done. I find when I play survivor I'm less reliant on perks but I also suck at survivor so I still use meta.

  • FrostySealFrostySeal Member Posts: 506

    I play fine without perks, but the issue is being tunneled out by a Killer or slugged on the ground for minutes leading to the whole teams loss, especially when it's a killer like Nurse. Witnessing a teammate being camped and not being able to do anything bc no borrowed isn't fun for them or me. Having multiple gens popped not because your playing bad but because you have nothing to stop those gens is unfun.

  • MigrantTheGreatMigrantTheGreat Member Posts: 1,291

    As a survivor you really don't have to run the same build. When I stopped running meta perks my game play improved significantly.

    As a killer your forced to run slow down simply because without them, the match will go by too quickly and.

    All in all, it's the games core issue that is the problem imo. I would love to see the meta shake up a bit, but the game design is preventing that

  • Buily09Buily09 Member Posts: 2,737

    As Survivor I understand it because you don't want to get tunneled, slugged, etc. Killer can try to "ruin your fun".

    As a Killer I don't feel forced at all. I just play usualy non-meta perks all the time and play many killers left and right. I simply don't care about gens or wins or kills that much.

  • NicholasNicholas Member Posts: 1,797

    I understand the pain, but your post suggests those perks are even effective at providing relief. Especially DS, a one-time limited perk that doesn't quite do much against tunneling. And you're OOL on the second rescue, where The Killer is more likely to tunnel harder now that you're DS-free. UB is also one-time; just hope the time you chose to redeem your full recovery was worth it.

  • SchardonSchardon Member Posts: 177

    Yeah, it can feel that way but Unbreakable sometimes really has a huge power.

    In higher MMR you'll sometimes see killers snowballing by capitalizing on survivors mistakes by slugging. Having downed one survivor and having two other survivors hovering around that downed guy (to flashy save him or to pick him up) can be incredibly useful to the killer. If those two guys mess up, the killer has the opportunity to down both of them, resulting in only one survivor being alive.

    If he's really going for the 4k he'll hook one survivor and slug the other two while going for the fourth guy. If one of the slugged survivors has Unbreakable he can completely kill the momentum of the killer and ######### the power role back to the survivors.

    This example also works with just having 1 survivor hooked and 1 slugged but the aforementioned situation is even more impactful of course so I went with that one.

    That being said - I've ran Unbreakable too quite an amount of times and I gotta admit that it most of the time feels rather underwhelming.

  • CaulDrohnCaulDrohn Member Posts: 1,022

    Just switch to an end game build. Seriously. It allows you to just NOT CARE about gens. With your usual gen regression build, once the survs finish the last gen, you have nothing to help you anymore. So just revert it, play with nothing (except BBQ bc BP) while they do the gens, and then hit them HARD with all your end game might (Noed, Bloodwarden, No way out). You need not be afraid of the survivors doing all bones to prevent Noed, they practically never do this when they can rush gens instead.

    Will you get heavy salt for that? OF COURSE, thats the extra bonus! If they attack you for your Noed 'crutch', point out why they did not do bones when it was so obvious you would have some end game perks (having no gen regression whatsoever)? That's where they usually fall silent and leave the after game chat.

    Really, free yourself from the mantra that you need slowdown perks to do good as a killer. The game is not over until the survivors get out of a gate (or hatch). If it does not work to prevent them doing gens, prevent them from opening a gate and escaping.

  • GwintyGwinty Member Posts: 837

    The problem is that Killers with slowdown that is build in can stack even more slowdown.

    Remember "Forever Freddy" who just stacked slowdown add-ons on slow-down perks and fun stuff like that. Giving a Killer a direct mean of slowdown makes that killer significantly better and harder to balance. They can no just nerf "Hex: Ruin" because that would kill the small number of Myers, Clown and Legion players on higher level. Even thou Ruin is by far the most annoying and unfun slowdown that exists.

    For survivor I think it is easier to run a non-meta build than for certain Killers. You can get away with many things as long as you just run 1 exhaustion perk.

    This sums it up quit well.

    However while camping and slugging is a choice you as a Killer can make, genrushing is a problem. This comes down to a little game theory (no, not the chanel, the academic study): The good old prisoners dilema.

    If you play a killer you have to choose running Ruin/Undying and if you camp or do not camp befor you know what the survivor side will do. Now there are some scenarios:

    1. You run Ruin/Undying, the survivors run off-meta for fun = You stomp them, maybe you feel bad
    2. You run Ruin/Undying, the survivors run meta = Equal match, both sides bring their best
    3. You do not run Ruin/Undying, the survivors run meta = You get stomped, you feel bad
    4. You do not run Ruin/Undying, the survivors run off-meta = Everything is fine

    Now if you look at this, by running the more efficient set (or strategy, because you can replace Ruin/Undying with a scummy tactic and the survivor side with "genrushin") you get a good chance in 2 out of 3 scenarios and avoid a very bad one completly. Over all it is just better to run the scumback taktic here, because you get no reward for not doing it.

    The original prisoners dilema is about their scentence by the way...look it up, it explains this problem here quit well...

    By the way, everything I told from the Killers perspective is also true for the survivor side. You can open the same scenario for survivor with meta-build and genrushing. By not playing to the meta you risc getting a bad experience.

    There is only one solution...

    This...stop caring about how many kills or escapes you get and just play for some good moments. Or set up some win condition for yourself (4 stack BBQ before hook 5, alway porting as Pinhead, Pallet Freddy Fun Time and so on). This changes the scenario.

    Because in the current scenario you can not "win" unless you play a certain way. As such you need to change the scenario to bring a different wincondition to the table.

  • ThiccBudhhaThiccBudhha Member Posts: 6,441

    It is like 20 seconds. If you have a whole team down and the first guy you put into dying state gets up and revives the person you aren't putting on hook, that is about as second chance as it gets. Way more so than most of the perks people allude to as second chances.

  • MadLordJackMadLordJack Member Posts: 8,815

    Do what I did and lose.

    Maybe people should start listening to the person going on about how much she loves the new matchmaking.

  • Gamedozer7Gamedozer7 Member Posts: 1,956

    See the problem is I'm still in the grind I'm not even close to having all the perks on everyone. Its all about BP gain for me honestly I just want to earn enough to actually make a difference trying to level up my killer. Alot of non slow down matches I end with 10-12k so 4 thing at best in the BW.

  • AstrianAstrian Member Posts: 296
    edited September 2021

    I have never run Decisive Strike or Unbreakable since the DS nerf and have had 0 problems.

    Nobody is forcing you to use the same builds, you're just not good

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