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Survivors have way too many perks the killer must respect

There's only one way to shake up the meta of this game, and that's to finally look at the survivor perks that have been meta for literal years, some of which are from the first 4 survivors. I'm not gonna be able to cover all of the ones I want, because then this would be insanely long, but I'll try to focus on the main offenders. I'm gonna be talking about perks that the killer pretty much has to respect or else he could lose the game. Hear me out.

Adrenaline: It is trivially easy to complete all the gens as survivor. Without gen defence, the killer's losing all those gens in minutes. With gen defence, a few more minutes MAYBE. You are lucky these days to kill 1 or 2 survivors before the gens get done. If you instead tried to injure everyone so that you could maybe get a big slug comeback at the end, this perk ruins it. You can't let the gens get done or else they might have this perk to use, and yet the gens will certainly get done. If 1 survivor has Adrenaline, you might still be able to get another kill at that point. If 2 or more have it, it becomes a near impossibility that you get another kill. Whether they're on the ground, injured, healthy, or about to be unhooked, as long as the survivors are alive they're going to get value out of this perk. I realize it's 1-use, but still. It gives a health state and a sprint burst even when exhausted. Coupled with an easy prerequisite of doing 5 gens collectively, this perk just has too much going for it.

Decisive Strike: I know it's been nerfed already, and yet I see it everyday. Sometimes all 4 survivors are running it, sometimes none are. But the 5-second stun is far too punishing, and will lose the killer the game. For that reason, the killer must respect it every time. If they don't, they could get an early 2nd hook or a kill because the survivor by pure chance did not have it equipped, but mostly what happens is you "get rid of" their DS early and lose the game because of it. It's a high risk, high reward perk... for the killer. The survivors who have DS'd the killer will not show their face until the end when they're in the exit area and are invulnerable, unless the killer takes all 4's DS in which case they lose anyway. You can avoid all of this by just not tunneling, but you've got to understand: killers must tunnel sometimes to play catch-up. And in a game where the killer's on the back foot and playing catch-up from the very start, it's a necessity. And despite the nerf, survivors can still abuse it. They can jump in a locker, body block, flashlight save, or open an exit and still have it. It's effect is so powerful that you can still bluff to the killer that you have it, and they'll most likely respect it.

Dead Hard: Other exhaustion perks like Balanced and Sprint Burst are usually used to delay the real start of a chase, but Dead Hard extends the chase at the end when the killer most needs the down. No other perk gives i-frames, and that's an unnecessarily huge advantage obviously. Even when the killer's planning/pathing/aiming/tile knowledge was perfect, Dead Hard could still allow the survivor to escape unscathed. And when used for distance, there's nothing the killer can do. No waiting it out. And assuming the survivor has a good connection, or bad depending on how you see it, they can simply react to the killer's swing. The only prerequisite this perk has is being injured, which encourages survivors to be insanely efficient by pushing gens while injured, simply because this perk offers so much protection at the press of a button. If the killer doesn't respect it, he misses and the survivor gets to the next tile, and if he does respect it a good survivor will use it to the fullest anyway.

Unbreakable: This perk, like Adrenaline, stops the killer from slugging. Except it can be used at any point in the game. And even when a survivor "uses it up" to pick themselves up, they still get the 20% increased recovery speed, which is still a huge blow against sluggers. And just like with tunneling, sometimes killers must slug to generate enough pressure to have a chance of winning. If 1 survivor has it, that's manageable. But if multiple have it, any chance of a mass slug is gone. Slugging has to be done quickly, because once the survivors figure out that's what the killer's doing, they'll focus just on staying healed so that the killer can't slug them again. It's 1-use, yes, but that's all it takes for the killer to lose, plus they still get the recovery speed increase. It's got too much going for it.

A lot of these perks are 1-use, and they're practically uncounterable. The killer may be able to deal with each survivor having maybe one of these, but more often than not the survivors will have all of these equipped at the same time. Survivors will guilt trip killers about using strong perks, but they refuse to accept the strength of their own perks. The killer should not have this much to worry about from each individual survivor. They're the 1, and the survivors are the 4. Why then do the survivors have the tools to 1v1 the killer? Why have they barely been touched when it seems like every update, killers are being given a crumb of a buff or are straight-up nerfed? The killer role can't go on with these circumstances, or everybody including myself is just gonna throw in the towel.



  • SnowbawlzzzSnowbawlzzz Member Posts: 1,077

    There is nothing wrong with adrenaline and you're overplaying how much it hurts the killer

    Other than that I agree

  • OldHunterLightOldHunterLight Member Posts: 2,879

    I didn't read the post, but why is your name familiar? Are you a dark souls youtuber or something like that? I swear I have seen your name somewhere before.

  • landromatlandromat Member Posts: 2,011

    Also deliverance is always possible so you must think about that too, as well as soul guard. Im afraid of new any means necessary too

  • Aven_FallenAven_Fallen Member Posts: 10,689

    You mean the Perk which is still mediocre? BHVR can even remove the Cooldown and it will not be that good. When do you have mutliple Pallets lying around? And in the end, every Killer can do something against thrown Pallets (and they already do, at least the strong ones...AMN most likely can replace unsafe Pallets, at best).

    And nah, you dont need to think about Deliverance. What do you want to do? Camp everyone who might have unhooked someone before? This is not really an option, except if you want to lose the game if the other 3 Survivors are mildly competent.

  • JasixJasix Member Posts: 1,187

    Meh - as killer I don't care what perks a survivor uses - nor do I care as survivor what perks a killer uses. A lot of perks - killer/survivor alike are "un-counterable" - but that doesn't cause me apprehension when playing either role. That would be like saying Tinkerer is counterable by simply never getting a gen to 70%. Bitter Murmur - don't finish gens! I realize the forums LOVE to pit one side against another with vitriol and hyperbole, but "un-counterable" perks are on each side.

  • justbecausejustbecause Member Posts: 1,521

    Overreacting with how much it hurts killer big time

  • NekoTorvicNekoTorvic Member Posts: 714

    I think the problem is we have a plethora of things in the game designed to correct your mistakes or prevent/delete you being outplayed by the opposing team without much effort on your part at all.

    DS, is a necessary evil, but it's basically that. You get a chance to escape the killer, even though you got chased, downed, hooked, chased and downed again.

    UB: undo the fact you were downed by holding M1

    DH: undo the fact you were outplayed or made a mistake in positioning by pressing E at the low cost of being injured

    SB: never worry about positioning anymore, you can just run and have the killer waste 20 seconds before the chase even starts

    Lucky Break: Get a chance to escape a chase for free, at the low low cost of being outplayed and hit.

    NOED: Get a boost at the low cost of letting survivors do their objective and failing to stop them.

    Spirit Fury: Get pallet stunned? Who cares.

    And the devs are showcasing that they don't care about this when they design the game, since a bunch of the addons they reworked for spirit now give her her full charges back when either stunned by a pallet (meaning the survivor outplayed her), or breaking a pallet (a minuscule investment to get your power back).

    Now, there's nothing wrong with having some safeguards here and there. I think Enduring is probably the best example of a safeguard that is useful but doesn't break the game the way Dead Hard does. The problem is that the game is riddled with safeguards or "mistake undoers" that are massively impactful and require no effort, no investment, absolutely nothing other than: you equipped a jpeg. It's very annoying to me.

  • danielmaster87danielmaster87 Member Posts: 4,806

    Resetting pallets is really strong. Yes, the killer will instantly break a god pallet if he's smart, but the "weaker" pallets that can be played around without breaking them are also stronger again once reset. The killer can't afford waste time kicking every pallet on the map or they lose.

  • RenRenRenRen Member Posts: 943

    Adrenaline I think is fine. It's more game balance is the issue.

    DS: A neccessary evil I don't like it but it has to stay.

    Dead Hard: Being exhausted should have a draw back.

    UB: Remove the ability to get up and increase the speed to get up or keep the get up but make getting up a lot slower.

  • XayrlenXayrlen Member Posts: 330
    edited October 2021

    Oh, I sure do love bleeding out on the ground, with almost no ability to do anything about it unless I have a specific perk. It's SO MUCH FUN.

    I'd rather get hooked so I could try and gamble on it for a kobe. Now that's much more fun.

  • MilesMiles Member Posts: 447

    thats because for some reason people stopped running DS. seriously, even the stats of it showed how the people who used it still escaped the same amount of times.

  • FirelliusFirellius Member Posts: 1,617

    A 4K slug intentionally bypasses the multiple hookstates that survivors have. And for the person who got slugged first, it's just several minutes of waiting for the killer to end the match, while you're unable to participate, but also not allowed to leave. And you can't even spectate, either.

    And that last part is in contrast with hooks. If you're on the hook, you still have some options, provided you're not getting facecamped.

    I also think that 'bypassing survivor hookstates' is the big issue people have with DS/BT/UB. You're supposed to hunt and down a survivor three times, but sometimes it feels like people are allergic to that concept here, with how upset they get over 'second chance' perks.

    I just fail to see the problem with second chance perks when the game is designed to give survivors three chances.

  • MrCalac123MrCalac123 Member Posts: 938

    "You're supposed to hunt and down a survivor three times" And there it is, the problem. Play a game of non top tier Killer at the absolute highest MMR - I would LOVE to see you try this. It's not feasible, and it's not balanced. Slugging and tunneling exist because playing "fair and nice" gets the Killer 4 teabags at exit gate and Survivors telling them they suck and hope the Killers family gets cancer.

  • SlothGirlySlothGirly Member Posts: 1,146

    wdym not Otz, he is Otz according to a recent survey D:<

  • CleviteClevite Member Posts: 3,930

    I think it is still a great perk that does what it is supposed to do. Those that stopped using it where probably the ones that abused it.

  • NicholasNicholas Member Posts: 1,501

    lol even going against elite tier killers has the same results: tunneling and sometimes camping. Don't pretend tunneling is limited to weaker killers, it's widespread. It has never been a smart tactic to use for certain situations, it's the go-to for almost every situation including those where The Killer is winning.

  • MrCalac123MrCalac123 Member Posts: 938

    Getting a Survivor out of the game ASAP before too many gens get done is by far the most effective method of victory for Killer. That or snowballing via slugging.

    Killer strength among the 2-3 that actually have a sense of power over the Survivors doesn't change that it's an effective strategy. It's not fun for that Survivor, but who cares what the other side thinks? You gain nothing but insults.

  • MrCalac123MrCalac123 Member Posts: 938

    Every suggestion you have is awful. ANY competent Survivor team will slams gens if you camp, this is a non issue. It may not be fun but it is NEVER a good play, until end game in which it's basically all the Killer can do. As for Tunneling and Slugging, I can't even imagine how you'd remove these. It'd require an entire game rework which is not ever happening, so I say just nerf the crutch second chance perks and be done with it.

  • NicholasNicholas Member Posts: 1,501

    I never said any of that, but with that said, I have no problem being effective and securing "victory" while also refraining from tunneling. My point was that these tactics aren't limited to weaker killers or situations where the Trial is going bad, as is often their justification. Many killer players love to camp, tunnel, and slug, independent of whether or not you need to do so. It's appealing to them, so it doesn't matter how viable or fantastic a killer, add-on, or perk becomes.

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