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I don't have a problem with boons

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  • The_KrapperThe_Krapper Member Posts: 2,382

    But a good survivor won't waste time by looking for a totem, blessing , then healing that all together will actually take you longer than self care , once a boon is up sure it can save time for bad survivors who always reset anyway but for a good survivor it's pretty useless unless you've got a endgame camping situation and need to reset fast, the gens can be done in less than five minutes and before someone says "but that's not fun!" And holding the exact same button in a different situation is? At least the gens get you out alive and don't drag out the match longer , it's literally impossible to use COH and have faster games than survivors who genrush without worrying about healing.

  • lauraalauraa Member Posts: 2,737

    If we could delete Shadowstep I'd probably be fine.

  • YankusYankus Member Posts: 576

    This thread makes it so easy to see the survivors who have never played killer

  • The_KrapperThe_Krapper Member Posts: 2,382

    Why just because someone disagrees with you? I have played killer since day one on this game and I don't agree that circle of healing is broken, I personally as a killer feel like gen speeds and survivors splitting on gens is way more broken than a perk that stalls the game every time you use it , you literally can't put it into play even without stalling, the whole reason they created circle of healing was to make survivors feel safe to heal because all the top tier players were genrushing with adrenaline and until they fix gen speeds or add a real objective gen speeds are always gonna be the most OP thing a survivor has in their favor

  • RyuhiRyuhi Member Posts: 1,941

    Boons create free map pressure for survivors, especially CoH. If a boon is placed nowhere near any active gens, they have created a zone of map that is both fortified in their favor, AND has zero objective for you to pressure. They basically create the killer side equivalent of what a dead zone is to survivor. If the killer continues chasing them there or finds and puts out the boon, they have wasted map pressure that most of them desperately need.

    Technically you don't even need boons in place to create this scenario: If someone is on hook and other survivors are injured, you could get into a chase on purpose and lead the killer away from the hook long enough for both the save and healing. Boons let survivors create that lose/lose scenario for zero risk though, either they go to the boon and lose pressure on objectives, or they ignore the boon and lose injury pressure while everyone self cares for free without even needing the perk.

    Its crazy how much people underestimate map pressure, especially on the survivor side. Understanding it and being able to erode a killer's pressure feels like the strongest way to climb right now, and tools like CoH make it easier than ever.

  • BardonBardon Member Posts: 676

    In particular this applies to the "territorial" killers like Trapper & Hag who set up a protected zone but then have to trudge halfway across the map to snuff a boon then trudge back...

  • RyuhiRyuhi Member Posts: 1,941

    Honestly, any killer that doesn't have very good full map pressure, or an instadown. Even killers like Billy are affected by it now that he has overheat on his power. At least with Plague it feels like they wasted a perk slot.

  • MaTtRoSiTyMaTtRoSiTy Member Posts: 298

    You seem to be ignoring the fact that using a COH boon gives your 3 other team mates a free 5th perk of being able to heal themselves infinitely. They can also group heal at lightning speeds so injuring has no pressure at all as they can just undo your work in seconds.

    Of course if someone wastes a lot of time re-blessing totems over and over then it is a detriment but there are plenty of other locations that are not convenient for the killer to deal with it (please see post with map example)

  • MaTtRoSiTyMaTtRoSiTy Member Posts: 298

    You have added a 3 gen to strawman my argument - if you have a 3 gen you have already forced your opponent into a match losing error in many cases.

    However what COH provides in reality is usually a dead zone for killer that you simply cannot afford to continue pursuit into. You lose all pressure either way as your injure is undone and you no longer have a survivor pressured. As I already stated, the only boon worth stomping is one right next to someone you just downed (or hooked) or even if you are just patrolling gens. But going out of your way to get one is usually just a big waste of your time.

  • throwaway79465468797throwaway79465468797 Member Posts: 682
    edited January 18

    I told you why it's not a lose/lose situation because you cant afford to waste time chasing survivors in dead zones. Agreeing with you and trying to explain that it's not a loss if you do give up the chase. Reason being survivors have one primary objective in this game -- generators. You are better off patrolling unfinished gens which deserve more of your time and will often give better results. Again...agreeing with you that hunting totems and survivors in dead zones is a moot point. But reiterating to some degree that you are not at a loss because you have to drop a chase like that.

    Post edited by throwaway79465468797 on
  • The_KrapperThe_Krapper Member Posts: 2,382

    Yea but you're missing the whole point, why would you spend all that time resetting? It's literally there just to make you feel safe resetting when you should be focused on escaping in no scenario is healing gonna help you survive faster than rushing gens, you're trading health states for map safety at that point because while you're healing someone is occupying the killer , and the only scenario where two survivors are gonna heal you at once is in endgame or if you're swf telling them to come heal you in which they have to sacrifice gens in order to make it happen it's ok if we disagree you're entitled to your opinion COH isn't a bad perk but in my opinion only bad survivors use it because they aren't good enough at chases to stay injured while focusing gens.

  • foxsansboxfoxsansbox Member Posts: 1,859

    I have no clue what you're going for here. I didn't write my comment directed at anything you said in particular. I was setting the record straight for people who didn't have a finer grasp of the cost/benefits of COH.

  • pseudechispseudechis Member Posts: 2,538

    Its not really that big of a time sink though to bless a totem.

    Boons overall aren't that bad an idea its just they were implemented in a ham-fisted way.

    Basically hexes are strong, they are high risk high reward and once they are gone... they are gone.

    Boons are high reward relatively little to no risk because you can just keep relighting them indefinitely. They also benefit the entire team so you basically give a 5th/6th perk effect to your team mates by running them.

    CoH is the main problem because it means you either continually commit to even bad chases or drop chase and lose all pressure in seconds because everyone has self healing. Its kind of a lose/lose.

    I mean hex undying and ruin combo was nerfed into the ground because of its great synergy when first released and it didn't take that long for it to be changed. Boons require no synergy at all and should probably get the same treatment, either a long cooldown or limited use via tokens.

    Time is often a much bigger crunch for the killer so the time to bless totems isn't really equivalent to the time to snuff them, especially when you add in the janky collision that can often take 1-2 goes to line yourself up properly and get the prompt.

    All this kind of reeks of poorly thought out design in need of at least some changes.

  • throwaway79465468797throwaway79465468797 Member Posts: 682

    Sorry I meant to quote someone else. I fixed it now... not even sure how that happened 😄

  • pseudechispseudechis Member Posts: 2,538

    This is kinda true, but COH now creates the scenario where everyone still runs their chase extending adrenalin builds but one person has COH, so if the game does start to snowball its really easy, and quick, to reset and have 4x fully healed survivors at 1-2 gens left.

    Unless you are a high mobility killer or have an insta down its an uphill battle at that point.

    I don't think the time sink is enough to really benefit the killer unless they are already applying great pressure on the survivors in which case CoH probably isn't going to do much anyway. The moment for any reason you take your foot off the gas as killer though it has a really big impact disproportionate to the cost of bringing it.

  • RagingCalmRagingCalm Member Posts: 407

    I know that this discuss is tending towards CoH right now, but I would like to add my small little piece: This may turn out to be something I stop doing eventually, but for now I enjoy using Bloodhound if I see a Mikaela join the lobby. They don't always run Shadow Step or even a Boon at all, but it is nice to not have to focus so hard on blood and the survivors' movements if there is a Shadow Step in play.

  • RyuhiRyuhi Member Posts: 1,941

    I actually just had a match on Lery's last night that basically enforced my argument. We had a Wraith who was dominating people in chase, had great map pressure, knew when to break off and when to keep chases going, my teammates usually going down after only getting 1-2 windows or pallets. He even secured a 3 gen.

    He lost badly because we had two CoH boons in opposite corners of the map, away from the gens. He couldn't afford to go to the totems to put them out, and he couldn't afford to chase any of us away from where the gens were.

    He got a 1k because he facecamped after the gates opened. Meanwhile the 3 of us that survived had over 30k BP scores. It was a fun game, but the killer absolutely deserved the win and was kinda robbed.

  • fblurbgfblurbg Member Posts: 78

    When Circle of Healing is up, the other three Survivors effectively have 6 perks: The four they decided to bring, We'll Make It, and Self Care.

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