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COH would be OP even without healing speed bonus

landromatlandromat Member Posts: 2,193

Because it's self care for whole team with cost of one perk slot, which allows 3 more perks for the team

Infinite resources is the problem of this perk, not healing speed.


  • buzzamanbuzzaman Member Posts: 104

    If it was selfcare speed for everyone I´d be OK with it.

  • ad19970ad19970 Member Posts: 3,978
    edited January 24

    Lmao what? People already complain about people using self care and wasting too much time healing.

    And yes, that's only when people misuse the perk, in general self care is fine. But one survivor having to look for a totem, bless it, just so that survivors can then run across the map to the area where it's located, and heal up themselves within 32 seconds?

    Why on earth wouldn't they just look for another team mate to heal them? The situations where you would need a limited area in a map, where you can heal yourself with self care speed, would be very few.

    This would make the perk just bad. There is no reason to throw this perk into the garbage can. People just don't want it to be broken anymore. it should still be a strong perk however. It would just be replaced by a different meta perk again otherwise, so one less option in that case.

  • jesterkindjesterkind Member Posts: 2,956

    Hard disagree. It would be an extra perk for the team, at the cost of a limited range, time to set up, and the ability to be snuffed by the killer.

    Though, if it's actually the default healing speed (IE, 16 seconds) instead of the Self Care penalty to self-healing speeds, that would be a lot more justifiable. There should be some reason to run CoH and spend time setting it up, it just shouldn't be broken.

  • Vyne456Vyne456 Member Posts: 760

    I think these people don't understand the logic of heal speeds.

  • BloodshadeBloodshade Member Posts: 2,294
    edited January 24

    all they needed to do was nerf its synergy with medkits & maybe other heal speed related perks. a simple 16 second self-heal for the team restricted to an area. literally mclean's suggestion (he also suggested nerfing the radius but idk) BTW. but now it's just gonna be bad & inefficient in solo queue and still strong in 4 medkit SWFs.

    i don't understand the thought process. it doesn't seem like much thought was put into the nerf TBH.

  • SonzaishinaiSonzaishinai Member Posts: 6,173

    Probably because there wasn't much thought on it.

    If this nerf was planned it would have been in the ptb. My theory is that they wanted to monitor it longer and this slight nerf is just a way to shush us a bit for the moment

  • OiryOiry Member Posts: 170

    If it was self-care speed, it would be a completely okay perk. Not only you need to find a totem + set it up, but also every time someone needs a heal it takes a long time and the person has to run to the totem. Would it be a perk with potential? Absolutely! You give an option for your team to heal, if you waste time setting it up.

    I would argue if it was a 16-second self-heal, it may still be extremely strong, but I think I'd be okay with it because again, they have to run to it first. The main problems with CoH are actually central totem spawns that are hard to snuff, and the fact that snuffing is extremely inefficient.

    Then again, my main problem with it, is that it motivates tunneling and nerfs hit n' run, a playstyle I really like to play against and play as. :(

  • C3ToothC3Tooth Member Posts: 4,319

    If removing an effect, I would pick removing Self care and keep We will make it.

    They still have to find other survivors to heal, but if they're in the Boon range, they get the bonus.

  • GwintyGwinty Member Posts: 806

    Just wait for the nerf to hit the servers and then let us talk about this again. I am willing to give a reduced healing-speed a run even thou I do not think that this is the main problem. Honestly a safety-zone where two survivors can heal each other like this is fine. The problem comes from the strong self-healing that can be stacked with other perks.

    If survivors coordinate themself to heal that is fine. The boons "lighthouse" aspect makes it strong here and that is also fine. Survivors on coms could already do this but soloQ benefits greatly from this effect for their heals and I like it as a side effect. SoloSurvivors are always too uncoordinated and giving them this is pretty good.

  • zarrzarr Member Posts: 431
    edited January 24

    COH would frankly be garbage if it only enabled people to heal themselves at Self-Care speed.

    1. As opposed to Self-Care, COH is tied to a Boon totem. That means it has to be set up, at a significant time investment, and at the risk of getting taken away again.
    2. As opposed to Self-Care, COH's effect is tied to a limited area. That means survivors have to traverse the map in order to be able to heal, which takes time, and additional time to then again get to wherever they need to be. The killer can also capitalize upon this, catching survivors that are healing in as well as moving to and from the area, another liability Self-Care doesn't come with.
    3. The perk slot argument only matters if all survivors are actually coordinating their loadouts, which the majority of players do not, and regularly cannot. COH can in fact even result in wasted slots and time if other survivors bring means of healing, including if they themselves also bring COH.

    Furthermore, even Self-Care itself is not a meta perk in many regions. And COH is not ubiquitous. I still have games as killer and survivor in which not a single COH is present, which is remarkable given that it means 4 individuals combined for a total 16 times of deciding not to equip the perk. Ever since the Self-Care nerfs years ago, there was a meta shift in most regions toward a "no-heal" paradigm, where people refrained from bringing means of healing altogether and regularly just remained injured to keep working on gens instead, often even forgoing healing each other. COH shifting the meta more toward people spending time on healing again is desirable, because it prolongs games due to reducing both the time spent on gens and the snowball potential of killers. While it is certainly a strong perk and that continual healing will often have a notable impact on matches, the time spent setting it up and healing at all as well as the fact that it leads to survivors moving around the map more can absolutely benefit killers.

    While the perk is not as overpowered as some people make it out to be, it is overtuned. For one thing, it absolutely shouldn't apply to med-kit heals, those healing interactions are just too fast. For another, since it also applies to altruistic heals and can therefore benefit survivors in ways that go beyond time efficiency (e. g. healing up a survivor from the dying state before a killer can get there), I think reducing the healing speed boost is a sensible nerf. The planned healing speed boost reduction to 75% could already be enough, although personally I think 60% might be a sweeter value, coming out to 20-second self-heals and 10-second altruistic heals.

    I do think some adjustments for the Boon mechanic in general are also in order. For one thing, players should not be able to bless a totem if they already have a Boon standing, until the killer snuffs it. That way players have to make more of a committment to an area and cannot relocate as they please. It would also force them to cleanse any Hexes they may encounter and want to get rid of, if they have a Boon still up.

    For another, snuffing totems should be a little more impactful. Snuffing could destroy totems, put the respective player's Boon perk(s) on a cooldown before they are able to bless again, or it could render the respective player unable to bless that respective totem again for the remainder of the match. Alternatively, Boon perks could continually lose strength with every snuffing and reblessing, seeing reductions in effective range or in their specific effects (e. g. -6m per blessing, or -20% healing speed on COH per blessing). A reduction in blessing speed could also be interesting, such that every consecutive blessing takes longer.

    Either way, any potential nerf beyond the one BHVR is already shipping should have to be reasonable. If one were to actually ship the ridiculous nerfs people here often suggest (32s healing time, no self-healing at all, disabled completely if snuffed), the perk would just stop seeing any use whatsoever, and too many perks already barely see use (including the other Boons). The survivor pool of meta-viable perks in particular has been stale for years, and COH (as opposed to original Mettle Of Man) is actually a desirable addition to that pool.

  • hikenhiken Member Posts: 830
    edited January 24

    nobody would use cause would be trash tier, it doesnt need to be beaten down to the point nobody uses it would make much more sense to bring the killer perk, self care wich only helps killer not survivors... 32 seconds and sloppy would be meta again so 40 seconds, half a gen of progress + almost a full health state on hook. people wouldnt use it again cause u need to traverse the map and waste 1 minute to get a heal, u would just force way more medkits into a game than usual.

  • YankusYankus Member Posts: 508

    I've always thought that they should remove the self care part but make injured survivors in the radius show their aura. If you see an aura you can run to them and heal with "we'll make it" speed.

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