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The killer should play how he wants without being shamed for it, but the shaming seems incentivized

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  • BartlausBartlaus Member Posts: 776

    No person is above the survivor's rulebook for killers. Even not the devs and mods of BHVR. Shame on you. How dare you?

    To be fair. I am equally insulted for my playstyle (survivor and killer). But I don't really take it seriously.

  • TiufalTiufal Member Posts: 1,252

    It has absolutely nothing to do with a strong killer or a killer being better.

  • Ginger_ninja493Ginger_ninja493 Member Posts: 62

    At the end of the day it's the players own enjoyment. Both sides get called toxic for using a certain gameplay style that the other side doesn't like or bringing in perks that they think are op or broken cough cough circle of healing and noed.

    It's not a mandatory rule that you have to put the other sides enjoyment first, yes it's nice if it's a match where the killers doesn't camp, or survivors don't farm, again all valid ways to play and can be fun for some people.

    This mentality that you have to play a certain way and not camp or tunnel is just out dated. If you have fun with it go ahead because there will always be another match at the end of the day.

  • Marc_123Marc_123 Member Posts: 2,475

    Got a few annoying killers today in my games.

    Got tunneled and soft camped. It is not nice. Be angry for a moment and go on.

    Also my MMR needs its balance - that is kinda annoying. If i got like 4 games where i escaped i can be sure i get some god killers next and lose some.

  • StarrseedStarrseed Member Posts: 972

    I try to avoid camping and tunneling as much as I can. I mean I don't ignore the unhooked sitting there like a duck healing and if I happen to just follow scratch marks and fate wanted me to find you instead of the unhooker well I'm not gonna turn around wasting time. The thing that bugs me. The most is in every game there comes the moment where leaving the hook is just the worst thing you can do. That's mostly in endgame but I get screamed at in t post chat like hell.

    The moment I stopped caring about all this was when I bought the gunslinger not so long befor his nerv and was playing my very first game two lvl 2 perks and not a single clue about him. I got the most classic bully squat ever my first one at that time. Two tool boxes two flashlights and two sabotage perks and you bet your cheeks every time I got a down three people where there to make sure that this isn't going to be a hook. They took there time with the last gen at 99 and had as much fun as they could have and when they finally decide to leave I got my first nice shot and noed got him down and I somehow got him on a hook and I fought for that hook like hell. I got the kill and the post chat was the worst I've ever seen in any game. It doesn't freaking matter how good the game goes for them or what perks you use or what you do most survs will scream bloody murder when they don't get out even tho they had the best game ever and just died cause they where cocky af

  • scorpioscorpio Member Posts: 331
    edited February 21

    It isn’t toxic to play to win. Some survivors seem to think the killer owes them a fun game/it’s the killer’s job to ensure the survivors have fun. Yet, survivors have no problem ruining the killer’s fun. Sure, the killer can still play, but if the fun is sucked out, does it matter? It is not the killer’s job to make the game fun for you, that’s on you and your teammates. Some killers actively try to make the game more fun and that’s great, but they don’t have to and it isn’t toxic if they decide to play optimally instead. It‘s just such an entitled mindset. You are not owed free escapes, loops, gens, etc. The idea that playing optimally is toxic is just ridiculous imo and completely misunderstands what toxicity actually is. Optimal play can be annoying and unfun, but it isn’t toxic.

  • MadjuraMadjura Member Posts: 2,254

    That's not what they are trying to imply with that post I don't think. If something is super unfun then the solution is to fix it by changing the game.

    A good example of this how the RPD library had hooks added due to Boil Over (I know you are talking about Killers playing in a way that is unfun for Survivors but the argument holds for both roles). There were 3 options:

    • do nothing
    • change the rules / add an exception to the rules and make going to that spot with Boil Over bannable
    • fix the map so this is no longer possible

    Doing nothing when something is super unfun for some players is obviously a bad choice. Changing the rules or adding exceptions / making certain actions bannable creates an administrative nightmare eventually.

    The problem is really that there are a lot of issues that haven't been fixed for years, but that doesn't necessarily mean that these things are fine.

  • NOEDENJOYERNOEDENJOYER Member Posts: 237

    Has anyone legitimately seen a killer have a sense of entitlement and expect the survivors to just roll over and die for them?

    Because I haven't seen someone who's seriously had this thought, in 2500 hours. Yet, it's not uncommon to see a bunch of survivors every once in a while tell me that I'm a piece of crap for killing them.

    Survivors are more entitled, let's be real.

  • CleviteClevite Member Posts: 4,335

    I say, play how you would like to verse.

    If you really have no problems facing some unfun tactics, then by all means use them.

    But, if you dislike when something is done to you, then why do it to someone else? 🤔

  • dictepdictep Member Posts: 1,333

    Camping the first surv or tunneling him it’s the same as if the hatch appears open at the begging and only 1 surv could escape when he wants. You ensure 1 escape but you let 3 other survs alone to do the 5 gens and probably lose (same as the killer letting the survs do gens while camping and tunneling). Buts killers here think it’s ok

  • Thusly_BonedThusly_Boned Member Posts: 1,709


    Absolutely.

    One thing you'll find that is that many times the "losing" side will often engineer a reason to justify their annoyance, often engaging in impressive feats of mental gymnastics to do so, but the heart of the annoyance is that they can't accept the notion that the other side just played better. They didn't get their validation and want to make that someone else's fault.

    It's human nature to try to make excuses and displace blame when we lose, feel humiliated, etc., but be self-aware. Getting owned feels bad, man. But that doesn't make the person who owned you somehow wrong.

  • Thusly_BonedThusly_Boned Member Posts: 1,709

    "Do unto others" may be the optimal way to approach life (it's the way I try to play), but expecting everyone else to do so is setting yourself up for feeling anger and disappointment.

  • NotionlessNotionless Member Posts: 216

    I'd say both get #[email protected]& on about the same, habe you seen how much hate tunneling camping or noed and devour get? Then again the second a survivor uses ds ub its a irreparable sin so i get where ure coming from

  • DamarusDamarus Member Posts: 599
    edited February 21

    I agree, I am not entitled to free escapes or hatches. But I am entitled to HAVING THE CHANCE TO PLAY. Which is why camping shouldn't be allowed. Because, you know, the game is bought, not given for free. Unless, of course, you'd find it fair if survivors would have the ability of completely denying the killer any movement and hits. Not to mention that why does a killer camp? Because he thinks he is entitled to get kills, otherwise he wouldn't really need to resort to cheap stuff. Oh, by the way, playing to win isn't related to being a noob and doing noob things. Even those who use macros/cronus on online shooter games are doing it to win, yet it doesn't mean they aren't being toxic or unfair. Words have precise meanings, and you can only try to fool people who don't actually know said meanings.

  • Thusly_BonedThusly_Boned Member Posts: 1,709
    edited February 21

    I see where you are coming from, but play enough and the law of averages will take hold; for every time you are face camped, there will be a time one of your teammates is camped and you're essentially ignored by the killer for a good portion of the match. And full on camping doesn't happen every match, or even close to.

    I am no fan of face camping, to say the least, but if we can take a step back from these single experiences and view them in context, it isn't so bad.

    That said, the one part of the current meta that makes it harder to swallow are the often insane surv queue times. No one wants to spend 10 minutes in queue and then be bounced from the match in 3. But that isn't the killer's fault.

  • drsoontmdrsoontm Member Posts: 2,678

    Well, to be fair there are several gameplay styles for the survivor side that makes the match annoying for everyone else too.

    Yet these are the most efficient ways to go out as fast as possible.

    The issue here is to mitigate fast gens and the considerable advantage tunneling and camping are.

    The number of hooks, the number of chases, the proximity to the killer, ... all this should be promoted against kills and getting out.

    At the moment I'm playing various killers with experiments in mind. I'm often pitted against survivors who are clearly too green for me and only do one or two hooks and smack them so they can be healed and get out. Since I can push them without much trouble, the game lasts and I'm getting almost as much points as if I killed them all. They get a lot of points too. This is way more fun than when I'm against rushers who end the game in about 5 minutes with scores around the 10K for everyone.

  • DamarusDamarus Member Posts: 599

    Well, no, queue times are another wholly different thing, but still one of the things that plague this game. And sure, I agree with you, even other players will be facecamped, sometimes before me. But I am no hypocrite, and I don't like that even when it happens to others. Plus, even when that is happening to others and not me, there is still at least one part of the game that is being denied to me, which is the chase and (maybe) an escape from said chase. It sadly doesn't work either way. And the worst part is that, at the current state, it's hard to fix the game in a way that makes it fair for both sides.

  • CleviteClevite Member Posts: 4,335

    No, you are right.

    You can't expect it from others. And I respect everyone's right to play as they like.

    It's just how I approach the game.

  • StarrseedStarrseed Member Posts: 972

    I hate tunneling to but survivors are able to stop you playing to. Since the blessing of mmr it happens more and more you get players that are way over your skill level and they love to 99 the last gen and then play with you preventing every hook. Sure I can still move but at that point it wouldn't make a difference if I go afk or hang from an hook

  • Lochnload_exeLochnload_exe Member Posts: 1,340

    Honestly both sides get called toxic twats if they play to win. The forums are a perfect example of it, I feel bad for survivor mains on here lol. If you want to win, just play to win and ignore what people say lol the objective of the game is to win, it is up to the player to decide if they want to play more casually or not.

  • VirghoulVirghoul Member Posts: 63

    This. My enjoyment of the game when up very much when I turned off end game chat.

  • Bennett_They1ThemBennett_They1Them Member Posts: 2,513

    I really think DBD needs a casual Q and a competitive Q.

    no extra coding needed, really. they'd still be the same game.

    the only difference in either Q would be player expectations.

    in comp, you'd expect everyone to bring their A-game.

    whereas in casual, people wouldn't need to sweat as much.

  • prion11prion11 Member Posts: 342

    There are so many different ways to play both killer and survivor. You have insidious campers, and then perks like devour hope and make your choice which encourage NOT camping. Survivors similarly have ENDLESS variety in their preferred playstyle. No one should be attacked for how they play, because at the end of the day while this is a horror game, it's a fun party game meant to be enjoyed with other people. Not the next worldwide esports title.

  • AkumakajiAkumakaji Member Posts: 2,878

    They don't want to do this, because it would fracture their player base even more; they said so on multiple streams and occasions.

    But I think that you are right and that it could work if you just give a big enougn incentive to play comp Q. Like now with the grade system a lot of people will want to get that juicy 2 million BP at the 13th, thats already something. And you could throw in some shards, like something really minor like 3 shards every game, because some people would want to farm shards. And lastly, some cosmetics would also go a long way to get people interested. If the rift only leveled with comp Q and there were a few more colors of the normal costumes in it, yeah, I could see a lot more people playing it, but STILL getting the option to chillax with the casual Q if they feel like it.

  • CleviteClevite Member Posts: 4,335

    I agree, but how do you keep the sweats from queuing up in the casual mode, for easier games.

  • Bennett_They1ThemBennett_They1Them Member Posts: 2,513

    what? I was just thinking of having two queues with different names and mindsets.

    no special incentives, just a different outlook.

    in comp, nothing would be "toxic" (unless it was cheating), and in casual slugging/camping/BMing/T-bagging (I guess, the point is, generally playing in an intentionally irritating way) would be frowned upon.

  • Bennett_They1ThemBennett_They1Them Member Posts: 2,513

    I mean, you don't. If they want to queue for an easy game, they can do that.

    Maybe SWF can't queue for casual? I don't know, but that would certainly lessen the impact if someone wanted to troll a bunch of players just trying to have a good time without having to really sweat. Maybe certain perks could be disallowed in casual? (ruin, coh, ds, noed, etc)


    However, on that note, I do think that DBD's pretty high learning curve could be lessened by having a "New player Queue" that you can only access for your first 100-ish games of DBD and only pairs you with new players (since MMR doesn't really do that well).

  • DamarusDamarus Member Posts: 599

    Well, I'm not saying that, as a killer, you have all of the freedom in the world, but it still is different from what you won't be able to do as a survivor. If you look it from a point scoring perspective, the killer is still free to earn them with a variety of actions that can also touch various categories. The camped survivor, on the other hand? He's just done with every single thing. His game experience just turned into a "mash buttons to give your teammates time, unless you don't want to. You're going to die anyway".

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