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What's the point of the Nurse?

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  • ValikValik Member Posts: 1,242

    No other killer can cross an open field, hit a survivor, then re-acquire them with a final hit within the span of 5-6 seconds.

    Even other high mobility killers such as Blight or spirit cannot boast this. Trap based killers such as Trapper or Hag can only in very specific circumstances where their traps are triggered.

    Getting hit by a killer in the open gives you a speed boost - which gives you distance. Even if the killer closes it, you can make it to a jungle gym. But not if they teleport behind you and unsheathe katana while whispering 'Nothing personnel, Entity."


    The point is not at all about positioning - but also, in truth, she can reliably accomplish this with minor assistance.

    Hit someone by the stairs in Midwich, hear them go upstairs - see their aura perhaps. Nothing they can do. Normal killers would need significant foresight, luck, preparation, or blind coincidence to have them run into a trap or next to a generator you're teleporting to as Demo-dog or Freddy.

    Nurse, you just look up and press the button for 1.5 seconds to be on top of them again.


    You accuse me of straw manning, but you're intentionally ignoring the raw power of the Nurse's skill to try and prove a point.

  • syainsyain Member Posts: 379

    People refuse to learn how to play against her because they have this notion they get from others (mostly influencers such as youtubers and streamers) that she's broken. She's not. People need to stop treating her like every other killer, I've lost count of how many times people tried to LOOP me as Nurse. Of course it's gonna be frustrating if you don't know what you're doing. I'd say people need to adapt if she was a new killer but she's been around since year 1, at this point they're just being stubborn.

  • IlliterateGenocideIlliterateGenocide Member Posts: 3,729

    The whole purpose of nurse is to screw over further balance and make it so bhvr wont give killers stronger perks.

  • Alphasoul05Alphasoul05 Member Posts: 520
    edited April 6

    This game has far more players than it used to and most people simply never learned how to play against a Nurse. They don't want to learn, they want to yell she's unbeatable, even though every "god tier Nurse" out there is just as mediocre as they are at survivor. It's hard if they're good and you're not SWF, but can be hard in general. People don't want to learn how to waste enough of a Nurse's time that they'll lose if you spread out on gens and each run her just long enough. Harder still if they tunnel and you've no BT/DS.

    While survivors were still potatoes 4-5 years ago, a pool of 10k players and a small playerbase that often ran into the same players at R1 had far more quality, and skill, of survivors who knew how to play against a Nurse as much as the Nurse could play that killer. Granted, there were things like vacuum pallets

  • MigrantTheGreatMigrantTheGreat Member Posts: 1,271

    Here's your number 1 problem. You said "CONSISTENTLY" or in other words "How can I always have the 51% advantage no matter what the killer does?"

    It's called "PvP" where your suppose to gamble your tactics to outplay your player opponent until they adjust and so on.

    A lot of people like to back juke nurse to force her to over blink and it does work.., until she starts doing shorter blinks so you can back juke into her bonesaw.

    She just wasted her first blink and I'm in the middle of the shack and she can't see me. Since I'm closer to the window I should vault the window. Hold on wait! If I'm closer to the window she'll be expecting me to vault, I should just go for the pallet exit.., or I can stand here walking away from the window and pallet because ik she isn't going to be able to blink this far.

    You see what I'm getting at? It's called using your brain, or as I like to say "PvP". But of course I'm a retired nurse main, so ik and understand how a Nurse thinks.

  • MigrantTheGreatMigrantTheGreat Member Posts: 1,271

    For starters: I'm a retired nurse main

    Secondly: I don't play DBD anymore

    Third: Only reason why I defend is because she's one of the last killers that

    1. Makes the game feel like PvP

    2. Keeps the killer community alive and rewards her players for playing well and not winning because she has to entirely depend on survivors mistakes

    Fourth: You say you blame BHVR for nurse being in her broken state (which is false imo), but who are you going to point a finger at when all killers get nerfed to where it's no longer satisfying to play as them?

  • AsherFrostAsherFrost Member Posts: 2,340
    edited April 6

    I can do it with 2 hatchets on Huntress, just gotta lead the target a bit with the 2nd one. In fact I've done that several times, hell even on my main shocky boi, if I catch you in the open, you're toast. Yeah, you may just make a pallet, meanwhile I'm right behind you building bloodlust, and unless you used DH to get there, am about to get the first speed boost from it.

    Blight can as well, while there is a speed boost, it's not so significant that a ranged or high mobility killer can't allow for it. And aura reading isn't something that is only available on nurse.

    I Will agree though, trapper and hag are both virtually useless unless their traps are triggered, but again I hardly see that as evidence of an issue with the nurse.

  • PlaysByShadyPlaysByShady Member Posts: 568

    In an open field, survivors are very, very easy to blink to.

    Yeah... and chase down with every other killer.

    How many open fields are on The Game, Midwich, Lerys, etc?

    It's simple. If you're playing Nurse, don't go into the field. Same as if you're playing against a Trapper, you check windows etc for traps.

    But going from healthy to downed just because you happen to be in the open and don't have 'easy outs' like Dead Hard is never satisfying.

    But surely you know you're playing Nurse? And there's cover around. You can literally hide. Also, short loops are particularly effective against Nurse because (a) you can run around them faster than she can, and (b) it forces her to blink correctly, at the risk of under-blinking and going nowhere, or over-blinking and being further away, both of which are exceptionally punishing.

    Again, sounds to me like bad survivor play. It's not a foregone conclusion that just because a survivor is in the open that they're down, and even if they are, some killers get that because of their power. If a Legion catches you all together, chances are that's 4 injures, and now possibly even a down for free. You're just describing their power whilst making no attempt to counter-play against it.

  • ValikValik Member Posts: 1,242

    Reliably.

    And no, I'm sorry, but especially in the midwich example, you cannot do this with another killer.


    Again, you are literally trying to make-believe away that the Nurse has, quantifiably, the most powerful ability in the game - which circumvents the conventional utilities of a trial.

  • AsherFrostAsherFrost Member Posts: 2,340
    edited April 6

    As reliably as I can aim, which after playing a lot more 1st person shooters on console, is pretty reliable... Certainly much better than the times I've tried to play nurse and consistently over or under blinked, letting the survivor get away scot free.

    Midwitch has a large open field now? Are we talking the same Midwitch? The one that's literally just hallways, small rooms full of broken furniture and a small courtyard full of shrubs and garden walls?

    Yes. Nurse has a very unique power that lets her handle loops more efficiently and even go through walls... I've never denied that. That doesn't make your terrible examples any less terrible. Nurse is strong, but even with practiced nurse mains, she's not unbeatable, we've literally thousands of hours worth of footage showing that. Her steep learning curve, added to the mind game that is required to use her power effectively, have kept her on the bottom of the kill rankings for a reason (even with the many, many survivors who have stated they DC/suicide on hook immediately against her, which would raise that percentage).

    Perhaps if you spent some time playing as nurse, you would better understand the built in limitations of her power, and just how easy it is for survivors to get her to slip, even with aura reading perks. If you're just running away in a straight line and dropping pallets like she's trapper, then yeah, you're going to have a bad time. However if you pay attention to your surroundings, work the jukes and double back on yourself at the right time (comes with practice) she becomes the most fun killer to face. (Seriously one of my favorite things in this game is the rush you get after making a nurse blink past you)

  • woundcowboywoundcowboy Member Posts: 1,173

    Your example is completely incorrect and shows that you don’t understand how she works. In that situation (which i’ve been in numerous times) Nurse has no way of knowing what you will do. You can choose one of multiple directions to run in once you’re up, or you can double back down the stairs. If you double back and nurse thought you would keep running, she is now massively out positioned.

  • AsherFrostAsherFrost Member Posts: 2,340
    edited April 6

    "You accuse me of straw manning, but you're intentionally ignoring the raw power of the Nurse's skill to try and prove a point."

    Just to note, I went back and read my replies to you, and at no point did I ever accuse you of making a straw man argument... In fact until you said that I had made that accusation, the thought hadn't even crossed my mind. I do find myself wondering now if you are intentionally making bad faith arguments though, since you seem so overly eager to defend against the (nonexistent) accusations of the same.

  • SumnoxSumnox Member Posts: 310

    She's absolutely pointless and boring to play against. 90% of my matches are nurses. Putting aside how boring she is, if you're somewhat competent as her (and it's really not that hard), she has virtually no counterplay. And that's extremely boring.

  • sushiwooshi123sushiwooshi123 Member Posts: 10

    For real, ever since nurse was re-enable I've been getting nurses in 70% of my games. She's different yea, but it gets boring seeing god nurses 6 games in a row. And that's aside from survivors dcing/suiciding in other games. Makes me not wanna play sometimes. ;-;

  • SuzuKRSuzuKR Member Posts: 2,062

    I don't know why people keep bringing up good or god Nurse players as if that matters in the slightest bit. There are good and god survivors, and all data proves they perform evenly against each other when actually matched up that way. Matchmaking putting good or god players against worse players does not mean something is overpowered.

  • JeanCharpentierJeanCharpentier Member Posts: 358

    If the player knows how to play the nurse, you cannot do anything. Also, some build are really broken with her.

    Scourge + agittion

    Starstruck + agitation

    Starstruck + make your choice

    etc...

  • SuzuKRSuzuKR Member Posts: 2,062

    Fun fact, there are players that also know how to play against the Nurse on an equal level. And actual evidence proves that said even match ups lead to ~2K average for the Nurse.

  • AsherFrostAsherFrost Member Posts: 2,340
    edited April 6

    Come on now I escaped at least half the time against nurses and I only play Survivor drunk as #########, and without any meta perks aside from Kindred. Even when I do die to one I never feel like I had no chance, in fact generally I can point to exactly what I did wrong, and again, while drunk as #########.

    Also starstruck only works if you're stupid enough to hang around the killer while they're carrying somebody.

    If all of my time playing solo Survivor has taught me any one lesson, it's that people really like trying to make survivor sound a lot more difficult than it actually is. I'm not amazing. I don't study or practice. I pour myself a whiskey, pick survivor, and have a wonderful night. Frankly the biggest threat to solo survivors in this game is other survivors. I've lost far more games due to having teammates that don't know how to work as a team unless they're on a headset than I have to Killers who are so good that the outcome was inevitable.

  • AngyKillerAngyKiller Member Posts: 1,838

    I doubt it. People are throwing because they don't like the challenge.

    Look at ANY complaint thread; the 'unfun' killers are always the ones who have a higher than 50% win rate. They are basing their fun on winning, not on enjoying the game itself.

    So losing = unfun = nerf them.

  • lauraalauraa Member Posts: 2,436

    I see more DCs aga8nst Pinhead and Legion than I do Nurse.

  • ValikValik Member Posts: 1,242

    I got two people trying to argue with me - i apologize for saying that you accused me of straw-manning, it was PlaysByShady that did this, not you. An honest mistake.


    I think we got off on the wrong foot and are having two different discussions about different things. Miscommunication.

    II think we can all agree that - regardless of hypothetical, paper, or practice - The Nurse has the greatest POTENTIAL to down survivors if her power is used flawlessly.

    This is the point I'm going towards, and it's the crux of what I was saying in correlation to satisfactory play.


    There is no killer in the game, as of yet, who can reliably begin and punctuate 4 chases - 8 hits - on survivors in different locations within the course of 80 seconds.

    And accomplishing these feats as the Nurse is a simple point and click. Binary. Get the hit or not.


    Killers such as Blight, Demogorgon, Huntress, Cannibal, Hag, these killers CAN accomplish this. But in these circumstances, they are using their powers, there's anticipation and skill, and - moreover- there's time between abilities.


    Nurse is, by far, the killer with the greatest mobility and pressure against survivors. I think we can all agree on that. She is capable of extremely lethal blinks and circumvents many aspects of gameplay that survivors otherwise could use to their advantage. This is not a debate, it's just the truth of her power.


    I am not saying that she is outright more viable than other killers. I am not saying that other killers cannot get downs in such circumstances, nor am I saying that she is easy - or impossible to play against.

    I am, however, saying that she is very strong - and the feast or famine nature of her playstyle mixed with the binary nature of her ability makes it less than an accomplishment to use than other killers in contrast.

    Getting 5 back-to-back Huntress Hatchets takes skill and is a grand feat. Landing that long distance hatchet to predict a dead-hard is euphoric.

    Perfectly timing a doctor blast to pacify a survivor to prevent them from dropping a pallet and securing a short chase is incredibly satisfying.

    Using the Cannibal's chainsaw to catch up to a sprint-burst, and hitting them with the very tip of the final swing as they approach a vault - that is satisfying.

    Getting a flick with the Oni's demon charge on an unsuspecting survivor, satisfying as hell.

    Bouncing around and using glides and flicks to outwit a survivor as Blight is satisfying.

    Tricking a survivor into a trap as the Trapper is satisfying.

    Timing your chainsaw turn perfectly to instantly down a survivor in a tight loop as Hillbilly is incredibly rewarding.

    Outwitting an opponent with Night Shroud as Ghostface is satisfying

    Deducing a survivor's location from the environment and sounds to exit your phase with a deadly lunge as the Spirit is satisfying.


    Pointing at the survivor and blinking on top of them. Eh.


    Some people say FPS games are boring because it's 'just clicking on heads' . Nurse is similar in that way.

    Sure, it may require skill to do reliably, there is a bit of anticipation.

    But if you land on top of a survivor that doesn't have dead hard, you get the hit/grab. It's just that simple.


    Nemesis requires timing and positioning, Blight needs to be deliberate with rushes, but blinking with the nurse is... cheap.

    It always feels like I didn't earn it. I didn't need to predict the arc and velocity of a hatchet, i didn't skewer and reel a survivor, i didn't time my Hillbilly dash or cleverly cut off survivors with a Cenobite chain. I just... clicked myself over to them. Sometimes I don't do it right. But that's it.


    it's almost as if the Huntress had hatchets with no parabolic arc or change in velocity - always straight all the time, and the hatchets went through walls. The time held determines the distance traveled. The skill becomes binary. Cover doesn't matter, location doesn't really matter. All that matters is if the Ghost Huntress misses or not. It's completely binary. If she is aware of your location, she can place a ghost hatchet where you are and injure you from a considerable distance away. In this silly example, hopefully you can understand when I mean there is a lack of satisfaction from a 'cheap' aspect. if Huntress hatchets worked this way - going through walls, floors, roofs, and all terrain - being perfectly accurate to the pointed location. Huntress would have an ability that was binary. it would be skill based, because you'd have to slightly lead targets.; But so long as you know where people are, you can hit them. The power - in this case - is a perfect power, but it is up to the user to miss and mess up. Huntress would be a LOT less satisfying to play like this, because in this case there is no legitimate skill to knowing her arcs and charge times - hitboxes - and having precision to thread obstacles with her power. You just point towards an enemy and let it go. It hits - or it misses. Binary.


    Highly potent, extremely dangerous, circumvents the conventional style of play, and is nearly inescapable if executed in all of is beautiful simplicity.

    But it's a human power. And humans are flawed, humans make mistakes, humans misjudge things.

    She is not held back from her ability, she is held back from her humanity - and the ability to make critical mistakes.


    This is the point I'm making.

    NOT that she's unstoppable. NOT that she's broken. NOT that she can get hits in the open when other killers cannot. NOT that I hate her oooh I hate her or anything like that.

    Her power is SIMPLE and it is almost PERFECT. It basically cannot, by its own merit, fail.

    It is a binary power. You either used it right, or you didn't use it right.

    If you used it right, they are dead. If you didn't use it right, enjoy the fatigue.


    Her ability isn't a complex mechanic or countered effect. It doesn't require anticipation or setup, it cannot be stopped by conventional means. It is a button.


    It brings me no pleasure knowing that pressing a button correctly alone wins me the game. That there are no mind-games and only 'the button' - nothing else matters - and this is boring. And Ii believe there are many others on both sides who feel the same way.


    We can disagree on many things. But Ii hope we do not have to disagree on the viability of the Nurse or the simplicity of her ability.

  • AngyKillerAngyKiller Member Posts: 1,838
    edited April 6

    'The Nurse has the greatest POTENTIAL to down survivors if her power is used flawlessly.'

    I mean...That's how all Killer powers should work? They should require Killer skill over Survivor mistakes, because if a Killer power set requires Survivors to make mistakes instead; That Killer literally cannot win against skilled players who make little to no mistakes.

  • AsherFrostAsherFrost Member Posts: 2,340

    I agree with all of that except where you are taking survivor agency out of the equation. What you are in effect stating is that every time I got away from a nurse blink, it's completely because they messed up, and I just don't buy that for a second. I could be reading that wrong, I've had a very long day

  • ValikValik Member Posts: 1,242

    Yes.

    . . .

    This was a declarative statement. I'm glad you agree!

    You are misunderstanding my friend. I'm sorry about your long day

    This is not a discussion on how easy or viable her ability is.

    A survivor can outsmart a nurse. A survivor can juke, spin, and duck a nurse - giving them the slip. Yes.

    My point is not her perfection, it is not how strong she is, it is of how BORING she is within the context of her power's eloquence.


    If I was the nurse playing against you, and you gave me the slip - I feel bad.

    If I was the nurse playing against you, and I hit you - I feel bored.

    If you were the nurse playing against me, and I gave you the slip - I feel bad.

    If you were the nurse playing against me, and you hit me - I feel bored.


    That is my point.

    Not that getting hits is easy, not that survivors cannot outplay a Nurse, nor that there isn't an exchange between the killer and the survivor. Simply that she is unsatisfying.

    That the simplicity of her ability and the perfection of its design makes her, fundamentally, completely boring when used correctly - and completely frustrating when used incorrectly.

  • AsherFrostAsherFrost Member Posts: 2,340
    edited April 6

    Ok, that just sounds like you aren't enjoying the game as much, that sucks.

  • MrPebblesMrPebbles Member Posts: 143

    Thats a fact, people who don't acknowledge that and think its "all about positioning" are just facing bad nurses.

  • ValikValik Member Posts: 1,242

    Just not the Nurse.

    I find her to be poorly designed. But this is only my opinion.

    Regardless of how I feel and what experiences I may have, I am glad that you can find joy where I, sadly, cannot.

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