Home Dead by Daylight Forums Discussions General Discussions
Reminder for Forum Users, please do not share codes here. This is something that is expressly against the rules of this forum.

You hide MMR because you have something to hide

DBDVultureDBDVulture Member Posts: 730

Please give us honesty. Show us MMR if we want to see MMR values. Let us see the MMR of everyone in the game after the game is over.


For what purpose do you hide MMR?

- Is it so you can pull hidden strings? If so then this is exactly what we suspect. My guess is that MMR is not displayed because people would be upset if they saw the types of games the matchmaker gives them.

-Is it to protect feelings? If so then let players hide MMR so they can remain ignorant.

«13

Comments

  • Nathan13Nathan13 Member Posts: 6,141

    Could those numbers that we saw yesterday in the prestige teaser be the MMR levels?? Idk if you saw that.

  • AkumakajiAkumakaji Member Posts: 2,318

    I always advocate for giving us a weekend WITHOUT MMR. If the system leads to better games, people can finally see how aweful it would be without MMR. And thats what you want to advocate. If it only were the other way around I could understand, why you would not wanna do this.

  • MrJack20252MrJack20252 Member Posts: 334

    i have the feeling that showing it has no purpose. people will only get more elitist and mad at the people that decide to not show it.

  • ZozzyZozzy Member Posts: 4,759

    Explain how my day one opinion on balance should be taken seriously then? Do we need to nerf wraith again?

  • HuntarHuntar Member Posts: 848

    I mean, yeah, obviously. They were tired of people complaining about their rank matchmaking not working, so they hide the matchmaking metrics now. Like, that was pretty much their stated reason for doing it, rather than actually fixing the matchmaking.

  • StarLostStarLost Member Posts: 6,346

    And...?

    I've heard Otz say a few times that he wouldn't mind seeing it.

    We essentially had this during the SBMM tests, for two days (it was GBMM).

    Complete and utter chaos, that saw me as a survivor with maybe 100 hours of experience thrown into a game with a 500 hour player and two players with 3000+ hours a piece, against a 2500 hour Nurse.

  • ZozzyZozzy Member Posts: 4,759

    MMR caps at 1700 and starts to mix people. If you could see your mmr then people probably would be on here complaining because they would get a backfilled 3200 mmr SWF against their newly reached 1700 mmr killer.

  • StarLostStarLost Member Posts: 6,346

    SBMM is way better than RBMM.

    They hid grades because people got confused.

    I'm not exactly sure what people would get out of seeing their MMR aside from bragging rights - MMR isn't a reward, it's a system to help you get more even games. And while you definitely still get the occasional stinker, it's a substantial improvement over how ranks worked.

  • edgarpoopedgarpoop Member Posts: 5,618
    edited June 21

    I'd like a way to see it that doesn't break ToS. I understand their reasoning for hiding it, but I disagree with some of it.

    Showing exact ratings would lead to a lot of confusion. The playerbase is not going to understand a matchmaking algorithm. They're already on record stating multiple times that a very small percentage of players are above the cap, and most players on these forums seem to think they're above the cap. That's statistically improbable to say the least.

    It could lead to elitism relative to MMR, but we already have that with everyone's imagined numbers. Many people pull the "high MMR" card in any discussion. So on one hand it could lead to elitism, but it could show people the light on the other hand.

    Overall though, it's not a priority because the devs aren't balancing solely relative to MMR. Nothing about their map design gives any indication that they consider soft cap survivor play when balancing maps. They get to a certain point and stop tuning them, but a lot of tiles still need to be rotated 90 degrees and whatnot to prevent chaining. We still have long wall jungle gyms with the windows facing L/T walls and pallets next to shack window.

  • TriplehooTriplehoo Member Posts: 365
    edited June 21

    I don't mind seeing it during the endgame screen after the match. But before the match? No. And I would like to see my own MMR level when I'm in the menus.

    Game is already doing that. But if we could see our MMR's during the endgame screen, that would give us the idea WHY we lost/won so easily. And the fact is, BHVR doesn't want us to see it, because then players would have a solid proof to call them out on it, that it doesn't work.

  • DBDVultureDBDVulture Member Posts: 730

    "New peoples opinions on balance factually do not matter." - This attitude is "correct" but out of line. The way you present the argument is as if we should dismiss the experiences of new players. Game balance MUST consider high/medium/low MMR. Imagine if all killers had a high floor skill ceiling required to play like nurse. Would anyone bother?


    The MMR sucks. Almost everyone hates it. But there is a part of it we can't "touch" exactly because the numbers are hidden to us. Why do they hide the numbers? Because they don't want to give us transparency. In my experience refusing to give transparency means you have something to hide. Overall the DBD devs are kind of "light and fluffy"; mind you I mean this in a positive way and I don't mean this as an insult.

    I want to point out that the statistics we get for DBD are awful. Bad statistic analysis gives bad data that leads to false conclusions. Look at the nurse : the stats show she is the worst killer and clearly needs buffs. HAH!


    There is no world in which a 1700 player should go agains a 3200 player - be it chess, dodgeball or DBD. If there are people with stupid high win rates then maybe we should look at why they have stupid high win rates. If it's a 4 man SWF then maybe we need to consider nerfing SWF : do not allow perk/item repeats. If It's a 3200 rating killer then nurse the Blight/Nurse. What - did you think they were playing Pig? No.


    The reason 3200 players match against 1700 rating players is because there aren't enough 3200 players. Well too bad. You should not get to stomp on 1700 rating players. There should be a gap that says : this is too much and you will just have to wait.

  • jesterkindjesterkind Member Posts: 3,759

    I don't care about how many hours you have in the game, or your MMR number. What I care about is the validity of the thing that you're saying, which could be completely accurate even if you picked up the game yesterday.

    The ability to analyse a game, or provide feedback on balance, is not inherently tied to hourcount or personal mechanical skill. If we consider a player with 10 hours and a player with 1000 hours, but the player with 10 hours has spent years analysing and critiquing various different games and the player with 1000 hours has no interest in looking at any game critically, I'm not going to discard the first player's opinion out of hand just because their completely arbitrary (to this discussion) number is lower.

    All that, and, the attitude that it fosters is still negative. Even if newer/less skilled players have nothing of value to add to a discussion, it is still a bad thing to have a community where they're just told to stfu out of hand in such a belittling tone.

  • PhantomChimeraPhantomChimera Member Posts: 625
    edited June 21

    One of the reasons it is hidden is because people were abusing it's predecessor by knowing their ranking. You can at least in some way thank those who were abusing the old system for the new one.

    I have also heard though I'm not completely sure on it's validity it is now a algorithm that runs when when setting up matches and not a single value which technically may make it harder to display. Game has been much better since they introduced MMR.

  • vectorvector Member Posts: 208

    they may show not exact number but only by marking certain points such as above average and very high.


    this is actually frustrating not seeing anything including ranks. At the beggining of season especialy on the first days after reset you at least could understand why you lost so badly if you see 1-3 rank. You understand those are good players. Now you can only guess.


    idk not showing even ranks drained from game sort of satisfaction. it is always interesting to know who your opponents are. I still chek hours after each game anyway. So DBD system that based on hide is kind of lame because you might chek player`s hours anyway

  • StarLostStarLost Member Posts: 6,346

    You've clearly never been on a videogame forum before. I used to play a lot of Starcraft 2 and it was literally 'lul you think Terran overpowered, get to my level and you'll see they are weak' from Diamond 3 players to Diamond 2 players.

    Secondly - new people's impressions of the game are absolutely vital. If a killer is absolutely rampaging through lowbies, then that's cause for alarm - because those are the people that, a year, could be faithful veterans, and if their experience is miserable you'll lose them.

    Of course you can't balance entirely around low MMR (see: Wraith) but it has to be a consideration.

    I'd love to be able to see my own.

    Outside of that - I don't care at all.

  • legacycoltlegacycolt Member Posts: 1,369

    Theyre hiding MMR so we can’t see that it’s not working.

    All I know is that in all my soloQ matches there’s guaranteed minimum 2 terrible players and I’m so done with it.

    It doesn’t matter how many matches I escaped before, I’m always getting matched with clowns.

  • JPLongstreetJPLongstreet Member Posts: 2,929

    I'll play devil's advocate here. It also could be argued the opinion of those who play this game the best (the mythical top 1% high MMR whatever) also do not count, as they don't balance the game around the best play.

    I don't personally believe this myself.

  • BranBran Member Posts: 1,471

    I say just show it.

  • MrPeanutbutterMrPeanutbutter Member Posts: 952

    The only reason it’s hidden is because if it was shown, it would reveal what we all know already. Most of the time, the system doesn’t work and you’ll just get matched with the next killer/survivor group in line (which is done to keep queue times down).

  • FlameLickVAFlameLickVA Member Posts: 137

    They hide MMR because


    1. Online gaming has neckbeard elitists who segregate feedback to the game based off rank points, and create an unhealthy environment. In this already unhealthy one, it would be even worse.
    2. People would set goals to lower theirs even more so to dunk on new players so they can feed their disgusting superiority complexes (which btw is a HUGELY unattractive trait to have and can make someone an extremely toxic as a person)
    3. The game is not ranked.
  • BlueberryBlueberry Member Posts: 10,074

    I mean the fact of having an mmr system in the first place essentially throws out the whole it’s just a casual game and not competitive right off the bat. You don’t put an mmr system into a casual game. Any game with an mmr system the default expectation would be to have the mmr shown or a rank that essentially correlates with your mmr. Not really arguing whether the game should or should not be a “competitive game” just that the devs have already essentially made that decision themselves by putting an mmr system in.

  • jesterkindjesterkind Member Posts: 3,759

    Short version: No, they haven't.

    Longer version: You're conflating "MMR" with "ranked mode". They're not the same thing- games that have a ranked mode will show you your MMR in that mode, and they will not show you your MMR in the casual/quick play mode. What makes a mode a "ranked mode" is not the existence of MMR, because that same concept is used in the quick play mode, and we do not have a ranked mode in DBD.

  • BlueberryBlueberry Member Posts: 10,074

    The only rational and legitimate reason to have it hidden is because it doesn’t work well and we can’t call them out on it if it doesn’t. Essentially how we were able to point the problems out before when it showed rank. Any game with an mmr system the default expectation would be to show the mmr or a rank equivalence. The only games you don’t show it are casual games..but you don’t put an mmr system into a casual game..hence I find it difficult to argue it’s a casual game. Until they stop putting anything other than mmr/rank into the post game lobby they are going to continue to confuse new/casual players.

  • Babadook83Babadook83 Member Posts: 165

    Just show us the hot darn MMR score. so we know who we lost against. what score that dwight had who did nothing in the game. and the nea who was looping the killer... it's not reall y that hard. you don't even had to give us super concrete numbers, give us visuals that indicate the rank. i don't care. give us something

Sign In or Register to comment.