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The problem with NOED [RANT]

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Comments

  • TeambossFlozeTeambossFloze Member Posts: 1,260

    @FireHazard said:

    I'm just a crap rank 16 killer - I cant argue i'm pretty rubbish. I'm more of a run and gun Ace Survivor tbh

    I main killer so I can understand what you mean, usually at rank 16 or 10 survivors are either actually new or rank 1s trying to bully low ranking killers because "Rank 1's too sweaty"

    I wish I was better but alas im not ..I do think there is a massive skill gap between rank 17 to 15 - but then changes game by game

  • FireHazardFireHazard Member, Trusted Posts: 3,716

    @TeambossFloze said:

    @FireHazard said:

    I'm just a crap rank 16 killer - I cant argue i'm pretty rubbish. I'm more of a run and gun Ace Survivor tbh

    I main killer so I can understand what you mean, usually at rank 16 or 10 survivors are either actually new or rank 1s trying to bully low ranking killers because "Rank 1's too sweaty"

    I wish I was better but alas im not ..I do think there is a massive skill gap between rank 17 to 15 - but then changes game by game

    To be frank, rank never really matters in the grand scheme of things. Even red rank can have potatoes...trust me, I know... Its hard to tell a survivors skill just off rank alone.

  • TeambossFlozeTeambossFloze Member Posts: 1,260

    @FireHazard said:

    @TeambossFloze said:

    @FireHazard said:

    @TeambossFloze said:

    @FireHazard said:

    @TeambossFloze said:
    I applaud you for at least making an insightful well thought out post. Better than the usual tripe on here likg OMG NOED IS FOR NOOBS WTFBBQ!? - so kudos there. My only issue really is this generalised lambasting of people who choose to use a perk and being derogatory because of it. NOED in my opinion is easily countered and If dealt with cleverly isn't that much of an issue, just because it forces survives to maybe think twice about using their crutch perks and go for something different like Small Game. Talk to me about a perk that is uncounterable and lets discuss that instead.

    Deadhard, DS, Balanced landing I suppose. Although Enduring counters DS, some killers don't run that perk. So its just a dice roll to see if the survivor can effectively use the perk to shift the chase. As for Deadhard and balanced landing they're just something you need to expect. I don't really see a counter to it but i could be wrong.

    Deadhard isn't an issue I don't think if the killer is patient enough to bait it out. Frenzy on Legion is pretty good for it, Doctor, Huntress ...although you have to have a pretty good bit of accuracy. Balanced landing...well I don't think there is any "particular" killer perk to counter...but I mean...how often is it used these days? I think its almost like the lottery of running Calm Spirit on the chance you may come up against a Doc or Slippery meat/small game for trapper etc..there is an element of chance for any perk that isn't a crutch one..but that only adds to the excitement for me. I ran Calm spirit for 8 matches straight just to stick it to a Doc main...didn't come across one...took it off ...next match..you guessed it..bloody Doc.

    Its more common than you think actually, the round I was just in a few minutes ago has 2 people with balanced landing. Even sprint burst is not that uncommon to find, it just depends on what survivor you're facing and their play style really.

    As for the two example you put, things like that usually happen to me also when i'm thinking of a counter for a specific killer. Where I make one up, and never come across said killer for like 5+ matches. unfortunately I'd assume that happens to most of us anyways.

    I do agree, I don't tend to see many Balanced landings myself - we can only go by what we see ourselves. Personally I'd run Small Game perk and just get them 5 totems then guaranteed NOED is gone. I think NOED is selected 75%? of the time or something? so it would make to be a pretty solid pick I think.

    That or you can also use a map which is surprisingly helpful, it usually grabs any nearby totems you walk past so even if you miss one you can go open the map to go right back to said totem.

    even better ! although I don't like maps xD in fact I rarely take in any items to try reduce lobby dodging

  • MrsPiggyIsSoSneakyMrsPiggyIsSoSneaky Member Posts: 308
    iTacoman said:

    @MrsPiggyIsSoSneaky said:
    So let's say a new player joins, completely new player, and after 5 games they got the chance to get noed from the bloodweb and they use it, are they garbage? And tell me, what's the point of making this if you said that, yeah its in the game, but still, if someone one uses it, they suck??? So your saying that, you know its in the game, and you understand that anyone can use it, but if someone does, they are garbage? This just sounds like a hate thread to killers who uses noed and just sounds like you get salty when you get hit by one.

    it's literally just a crutch to help killers. If you can't manage to secure at least 2 kills by the end of the match then you either had an off match or don't belong in your rank. Rank 20-15 i guess are the exception because they typically don't know what they're doing and are all ready garbage but i just expect everyone runs it and cleanse all totems myself.


    So by using a perk because I had a bad match and or because I am not able to get just two kills automatically makes me a player that should not be in a certain rank? Dude, wtf is your logic? So you're saying that all high rank players are professional at playing, but if we do bad then we don't belong in the high ranks? Dude, come on, sometimes we just have bad games and good games, being at a higher rank doesn't mean that you'll automatically win and be professional. And the fact that you even considered saying rank 20-15 (new players) are garbage is literally so stupid of you to say, what do you expect of them? to be automatically Pro? If you're going to make it hate thread to Killers who uses perk, because that's what this is, you might as well make a hate thread for players who use decisive strike as well
  • TeambossFlozeTeambossFloze Member Posts: 1,260

    @FireHazard said:

    @TeambossFloze said:

    @FireHazard said:

    @TeambossFloze said:

    @FireHazard said:

    @TeambossFloze said:
    I applaud you for at least making an insightful well thought out post. Better than the usual tripe on here likg OMG NOED IS FOR NOOBS WTFBBQ!? - so kudos there. My only issue really is this generalised lambasting of people who choose to use a perk and being derogatory because of it. NOED in my opinion is easily countered and If dealt with cleverly isn't that much of an issue, just because it forces survives to maybe think twice about using their crutch perks and go for something different like Small Game. Talk to me about a perk that is uncounterable and lets discuss that instead.

    Deadhard, DS, Balanced landing I suppose. Although Enduring counters DS, some killers don't run that perk. So its just a dice roll to see if the survivor can effectively use the perk to shift the chase. As for Deadhard and balanced landing they're just something you need to expect. I don't really see a counter to it but i could be wrong.

    Deadhard isn't an issue I don't think if the killer is patient enough to bait it out. Frenzy on Legion is pretty good for it, Doctor, Huntress ...although you have to have a pretty good bit of accuracy. Balanced landing...well I don't think there is any "particular" killer perk to counter...but I mean...how often is it used these days? I think its almost like the lottery of running Calm Spirit on the chance you may come up against a Doc or Slippery meat/small game for trapper etc..there is an element of chance for any perk that isn't a crutch one..but that only adds to the excitement for me. I ran Calm spirit for 8 matches straight just to stick it to a Doc main...didn't come across one...took it off ...next match..you guessed it..bloody Doc.

    Its more common than you think actually, the round I was just in a few minutes ago has 2 people with balanced landing. Even sprint burst is not that uncommon to find, it just depends on what survivor you're facing and their play style really.

    As for the two example you put, things like that usually happen to me also when i'm thinking of a counter for a specific killer. Where I make one up, and never come across said killer for like 5+ matches. unfortunately I'd assume that happens to most of us anyways.

    I do agree, I don't tend to see many Balanced landings myself - we can only go by what we see ourselves. Personally I'd run Small Game perk and just get them 5 totems then guaranteed NOED is gone. I think NOED is selected 75%? of the time or something? so it would make to be a pretty solid pick I think.

    That or you can also use a map which is surprisingly helpful, it usually grabs any nearby totems you walk past so even if you miss one you can go open the map to go right back to said totem.

    even better ! although I don't like maps xD in fact I rarely take in any items to try reduce lobby dodging

  • Dwight_ConfusionDwight_Confusion Member Posts: 1,576

    There's nothing wrong with the killer having potential dominance at the end of a match.

    Break totems. It's a mechanic. Deal with it. And Prove Thyself isn't a big of a buff as you people think. It was a buff yes to gens. But it's shaking up the perks people are bringing to the table as well.

    I'm seeing a lot less of the Self Care, Adrenaline, Decisive Strike and Borrowed Time/Sprint Burst/Lithe meta.

    Distortion and the new Prove Thyself has really shook up the meta some. I'm welcoming it. NOED shouldn't be a problem for anyone. Especially against SWF.

    Stop complaining about something that is entitled to a killer... that is supposed to make it tough and miserable for you to survive anyways.

  • NeoVidNeoVid Member Posts: 34

    NOED is a perk made for players who are expecting to do badly so they can salvage a game at the last moment. I don't think that's an especially bad thing, it basically makes it the killer counterpart to Decisive Strike.

  • Well_Placed_HexTotemWell_Placed_HexTotem Member Posts: 677
    I run NOED on almost all killers, even ones with instant down attacks like LF and Myers. Why? Just for end game shenanigans. I rarely even have to use it because most games are either 4k or hatch escape. But it’s nice to know that it’s possibly there. 

    Theres a real simple way to avoid it. Cleanse the damn totems. I’m almost to the point of putting Detectives Hunch back on because my
    random teammates refuse to do totems. Can’t count the amount of times recently that I’ve literally cleansed four totems and the killer has NOED because no one else could do one totem. At that point why would I blame the killer, it’s the survivors fault.
  • Dwight_ConfusionDwight_Confusion Member Posts: 1,576

    @NeoVid said:
    NOED is a perk made for players who are expecting to do badly so they can salvage a game at the last moment. I don't think that's an especially bad thing, it basically makes it the killer counterpart to Decisive Strike.

    That is a misconception. I run it on a couple killers and to be very honest... I rarely get to use it. So what is the point? I recently switched to remember me

    I have it on there... so if they gen rush so hard and are SWF.. I'll have something to swing things in my favor.

    Killers kill. Deal with it.

  • GardeniaGardenia Member Posts: 1,052
    It looks like noed is doing it's job
  • OrionOrion Member Posts: 11,721

    Yes, NOED is a perk that affects noob Survivors who don't know they should break the totems.

  • VerconisspVerconissp Member Posts: 43

    Well if that's what you're gunna say about Noed. Then you must also agree that Anyone who uses Ds is a noob aswel? Because otherwise you'll just be one of thoes Survivor mains that says "OH NERF KILLER AND GIVE MORE BUFFS TO SURVIVOR!!" Cause...that's just dumb in my opinion. Most (not all) Use Noed if:
    1: they don't have any other perk to help. (tbh i'd rather run Noed than the other shite perks)
    2: Meme build. that is all..

  • FireHazardFireHazard Member, Trusted Posts: 3,716
    edited January 30

    @NeoVid said:
    NOED is a perk made for players who are expecting to do badly so they can salvage a game at the last moment. I don't think that's an especially bad thing, it basically makes it the killer counterpart to Decisive Strike.

    Someone read the post for once. Yes its good for bad players and killers that need it which is OK. I consider it not OK if you for example you use nurse with NOED on top of bloodwarden and remember me. Its literal overkill ESPECIALLY if you already dominated the team before the last gen was even finished.

    If you have all that to aid in your 4k it shows you're pretty sweaty for every possible kill. It seems a lot of people are just skimming through the post and leaving regurgitated comments.

  • FireHazardFireHazard Member, Trusted Posts: 3,716

    @Orion said:
    Yes, NOED is a perk that affects noob Survivors who don't know they should break the totems.

    Sadly a lot of solo survivors don't consider that.

  • FireHazardFireHazard Member, Trusted Posts: 3,716

    @Well_Placed_HexTotem said:
    I run NOED on almost all killers, even ones with instant down attacks like LF and Myers. Why? Just for end game shenanigans. I rarely even have to use it because most games are either 4k or hatch escape. But it’s nice to know that it’s possibly there. 

    Theres a real simple way to avoid it. Cleanse the damn totems. I’m almost to the point of putting Detectives Hunch back on because my
    random teammates refuse to do totems. Can’t count the amount of times recently that I’ve literally cleansed four totems and the killer has NOED because no one else could do one totem. At that point why would I blame the killer, it’s the survivors fault.

    Yes, it is your teammates fault for not helping with getting rid of all the totems before they proc. Yet some entitled survivors still feel its OK to bash the team even though we all know you're dead on hook if NOEDs active.

    Unless you get lucky and find it which rarely happens in my matches.

  • CyanideCandyCyanideCandy Member Posts: 31

    @FireHazard said:

    @NeoVid said:
    NOED is a perk made for players who are expecting to do badly so they can salvage a game at the last moment. I don't think that's an especially bad thing, it basically makes it the killer counterpart to Decisive Strike.

    Someone read the post for once. Yes its good for bad players and killers that need it which is OK. I consider it not OK if you for example you use nurse with NOED on top of bloodwarden and remember me. Its literal overkill ESPECIALLY if you already dominated the team before the last gen was even finished.

    If you have all that to aid in your 4k it shows you're pretty sweaty for every possible kill. It seems a lot of people are just skimming through the post and leaving regurgitated comments.

    Did you read my post by any chance? Because I did read your post all the way through and you didn't comment on mine like you have on quite a few others' responses. It's on the first page, close to the bottom if you missed it. I honestly want to know if you saw it at all. I hope you did since you've commented so many times on the post since then.TL/DR, my and a few people's problem with your post isn't even about your opinion on the perk but instead on you encouraging people to be toxic and treat each-other poorly because you don't like a perk they use.

    You edited that part out and added a few exceptions and a comment at the end about the perk breeding toxicity when used by people who you believe don't need it, but your motivation is still clear as day in the post. You're not suggesting a change, you're not encouraging people not to rely on the perk or trying to suggest a more skillful alternative to them. You're calling them a noob, toxic, and in the way you typed the post the first time before rewording almost all of it, you called them garbage too. You're whining, and this entire post doesn't do anything besides add to the toxicity that you're blaming on killers using no-ed. Chastising people for playing in a way you don't like IS toxic.

    I've tried to re-read all of your original post, the edited version, and even my own original comment before I typed this, but I check the forums when I'm about to go to bed, so as before I'm tired. If I'm missing something here, please feel free to tell me.

  • NMCKENMCKE Member, Trusted Posts: 5,779

    @Nickenzie said:
    NOED is a tricky one since it destroys solo Q survivors but SWF will make sure it doesn't see the light of day.

    NOED should be reworked so it doesn't destroy one side too much in my opinion. No One Escapes Death:

    Progress infuriates you and gives you fuel to kill. Whenever a generator is completed, receive a 10% haste effect for 10/20/30 seconds. On the final generator being completed, all remaining pallets in the trial will get struck down by the Entity.

    Notice: It's not a Hex and it doesn't destroy only solo Q survivors. Both sides will have to be careful about this perk!

    Why would breaking pallets when the gens are done and gates open be useful? And a timed haste? I think Hope gives 2 minutes. That's utterly useless. What a horrible suggestion. Just bad. I mean who in their right mind would waste a perk slot all game for that? You should feel ashamed for even offering that as an alternative.

    I actually redone my rework for NoED, I changed a few things to make it feel better overall for both sides. Whenever something is weak the first time, take it back to the drawing board!

    No One Escapes Death

    Progression infuriates you and causes your hunger to grow! Whenever a generator is completed, receive a 5%/10%/15% haste effect until you perform an offensive action. Your genius modifications to the exit gates causes them to short out; the time it takes to open the exit gates is increased by 10/15/20 seconds.
  • BroosmeisterBroosmeister Member Posts: 252

    G I T
    U
    D

    You're such an idiot. I literally see you everywhere commenting this same comment. Do you have any imagination at all? I bet you're one of the worst players of Dead by Daylight who only says this over and over again just to make himself feel better.
  • FireHazardFireHazard Member, Trusted Posts: 3,716

    @CyanideCandy said:

    @FireHazard said:

    @NeoVid said:
    NOED is a perk made for players who are expecting to do badly so they can salvage a game at the last moment. I don't think that's an especially bad thing, it basically makes it the killer counterpart to Decisive Strike.

    Someone read the post for once. Yes its good for bad players and killers that need it which is OK. I consider it not OK if you for example you use nurse with NOED on top of bloodwarden and remember me. Its literal overkill ESPECIALLY if you already dominated the team before the last gen was even finished.

    If you have all that to aid in your 4k it shows you're pretty sweaty for every possible kill. It seems a lot of people are just skimming through the post and leaving regurgitated comments.

    Did you read my post by any chance? Because I did read your post all the way through and you didn't comment on mine like you have on quite a few others' responses. It's on the first page, close to the bottom if you missed it. I honestly want to know if you saw it at all. I hope you did since you've commented so many times on the post since then.TL/DR, my and a few people's problem with your post isn't even about your opinion on the perk but instead on you encouraging people to be toxic and treat each-other poorly because you don't like a perk they use.

    You edited that part out and added a few exceptions and a comment at the end about the perk breeding toxicity when used by people who you believe don't need it, but your motivation is still clear as day in the post. You're not suggesting a change, you're not encouraging people not to rely on the perk or trying to suggest a more skillful alternative to them. You're calling them a noob, toxic, and in the way you typed the post the first time before rewording almost all of it, you called them garbage too. You're whining, and this entire post doesn't do anything besides add to the toxicity that you're blaming on killers using no-ed. Chastising people for playing in a way you don't like IS toxic.

    I've tried to re-read all of your original post, the edited version, and even my own original comment before I typed this, but I check the forums when I'm about to go to bed, so as before I'm tired. If I'm missing something here, please feel free to tell me.

    The main post was re-worked because in a previous comment I stated it was created out of salt and anger.

    I agree that the original post was also hypocritical at stating the perk breeds toxicity while also being toxic myself. The main idea of the post itself was to just rant about its existence and how certain individuals use the perk knowing full well its overkill on certain characters that do not need it.

    Its like for example putting it on nurse, if you're already so good at demolishing the team why would you also need NOED on top of that? To rub salt in the wound or something? And before you say the [Insert just cleanse every dull totem] meme i'm FULLY aware of this... The perk itself is fine in the hands of those who really need it against better players, and killers that need to to apply some pressure end game since they couldn't at the start of middle of it.

    I just consider it not to be ok when its used by people who clearly don't need it on killers that never SHOULD use it.

  • chemical_rejectchemical_reject Member Posts: 930
    Master said:

    A killer that downs the whole team with NOED is not a good killer, the survivors simply have been bad and probably over altruistic.

    In the end it comes down to the classic argument, you can completely deny NOED and even remove it BEFORE it activates.

    Lol the way I read this way like " those naughty bad survivors"  
  • Paddy4583Paddy4583 Member Posts: 864
    edited February 3

    @CyanideCandy said:

    @FireHazard said:

    @NeoVid said:
    NOED is a perk made for players who are expecting to do badly so they can salvage a game at the last moment. I don't think that's an especially bad thing, it basically makes it the killer counterpart to Decisive Strike.

    Someone read the post for once. Yes its good for bad players and killers that need it which is OK. I consider it not OK if you for example you use nurse with NOED on top of bloodwarden and remember me. Its literal overkill ESPECIALLY if you already dominated the team before the last gen was even finished.

    If you have all that to aid in your 4k it shows you're pretty sweaty for every possible kill. It seems a lot of people are just skimming through the post and leaving regurgitated comments.

    Did you read my post by any chance? Because I did read your post all the way through and you didn't comment on mine like you have on quite a few others' responses. It's on the first page, close to the bottom if you missed it. I honestly want to know if you saw it at all. I hope you did since you've commented so many times on the post since then.TL/DR, my and a few people's problem with your post isn't even about your opinion on the perk but instead on you encouraging people to be toxic and treat each-other poorly because you don't like a perk they use.

    You edited that part out and added a few exceptions and a comment at the end about the perk breeding toxicity when used by people who you believe don't need it, but your motivation is still clear as day in the post. You're not suggesting a change, you're not encouraging people not to rely on the perk or trying to suggest a more skillful alternative to them. You're calling them a noob, toxic, and in the way you typed the post the first time before rewording almost all of it, you called them garbage too. You're whining, and this entire post doesn't do anything besides add to the toxicity that you're blaming on killers using no-ed. Chastising people for playing in a way you don't like IS toxic.

    I've tried to re-read all of your original post, the edited version, and even my own original comment before I typed this, but I check the forums when I'm about to go to bed, so as before I'm tired. If I'm missing something here, please feel free to tell me.

    The main post was re-worked because in a previous comment I stated it was created out of salt and anger.

    I agree that the original post was also hypocritical at stating the perk breeds toxicity while also being toxic myself. The main idea of the post itself was to just rant about its existence and how certain individuals use the perk knowing full well its overkill on certain characters that do not need it.

    Its like for example putting it on nurse, if you're already so good at demolishing the team why would you also need NOED on top of that? To rub salt in the wound or something? And before you say the [Insert just cleanse every dull totem] meme i'm FULLY aware of this... The perk itself is fine in the hands of those who really need it against better players, and killers that need to to apply some pressure end game since they couldn't at the start of middle of it.

    I just consider it not to be ok when its used by people who clearly don't need it on killers that never SHOULD use it.

    If NOED has kicked in and there’s a whole team left, it’s pretty obvious that the killer either needs it, or likes to play the end game.
    theres nothing better than NOED for
    end game, it’s only survivors that let this perk work
  • NMCKENMCKE Member, Trusted Posts: 5,779
    edited February 3
    NoED just needs a rework in general because it destroys solo Q survivors but SWF won't let it see the light of day. Therefore, we need to change the perk where it's equally as threatening for both survivor sides [SWF & solo Q survivors] in my opinion!
  • CyanideCandyCyanideCandy Member Posts: 31

    @FireHazard said:

    @CyanideCandy said:

    @FireHazard said:

    @NeoVid said:
    NOED is a perk made for players who are expecting to do badly so they can salvage a game at the last moment. I don't think that's an especially bad thing, it basically makes it the killer counterpart to Decisive Strike.

    Someone read the post for once. Yes its good for bad players and killers that need it which is OK. I consider it not OK if you for example you use nurse with NOED on top of bloodwarden and remember me. Its literal overkill ESPECIALLY if you already dominated the team before the last gen was even finished.

    If you have all that to aid in your 4k it shows you're pretty sweaty for every possible kill. It seems a lot of people are just skimming through the post and leaving regurgitated comments.

    Did you read my post by any chance? Because I did read your post all the way through and you didn't comment on mine like you have on quite a few others' responses. It's on the first page, close to the bottom if you missed it. I honestly want to know if you saw it at all. I hope you did since you've commented so many times on the post since then.TL/DR, my and a few people's problem with your post isn't even about your opinion on the perk but instead on you encouraging people to be toxic and treat each-other poorly because you don't like a perk they use.

    You edited that part out and added a few exceptions and a comment at the end about the perk breeding toxicity when used by people who you believe don't need it, but your motivation is still clear as day in the post. You're not suggesting a change, you're not encouraging people not to rely on the perk or trying to suggest a more skillful alternative to them. You're calling them a noob, toxic, and in the way you typed the post the first time before rewording almost all of it, you called them garbage too. You're whining, and this entire post doesn't do anything besides add to the toxicity that you're blaming on killers using no-ed. Chastising people for playing in a way you don't like IS toxic.

    I've tried to re-read all of your original post, the edited version, and even my own original comment before I typed this, but I check the forums when I'm about to go to bed, so as before I'm tired. If I'm missing something here, please feel free to tell me.

    The main post was re-worked because in a previous comment I stated it was created out of salt and anger.

    I agree that the original post was also hypocritical at stating the perk breeds toxicity while also being toxic myself. The main idea of the post itself was to just rant about its existence and how certain individuals use the perk knowing full well its overkill on certain characters that do not need it.

    Its like for example putting it on nurse, if you're already so good at demolishing the team why would you also need NOED on top of that? To rub salt in the wound or something? And before you say the [Insert just cleanse every dull totem] meme i'm FULLY aware of this... The perk itself is fine in the hands of those who really need it against better players, and killers that need to to apply some pressure end game since they couldn't at the start of middle of it.

    I just consider it not to be ok when its used by people who clearly don't need it on killers that never SHOULD use it.

    What is it that makes you so sure they don't need it? I get what you're implying but here's the problem. You may not think a hillybilly or a myers or so on need the perk and that it's overkill, but the killer may not think so. Just because they had a good match and no-ed popped at the end and gave them the last 2 kills doesn't mean EVERY match goes that well. For all you know, that killer might ordinarily get absolutely thrashed and just have had a good match this time. Or they just have the perk because they expect all the generators to pop before they can even get more than a handful of hooks.
    With how fast they do pop why WOULDN'T you want to use a perk that gives you a chance to still get some kills? There's no way to know how a match is going to go before you're in it and if most killers get the same experience I have then they've had days where it's just back to back 4 man swf groups kitted out to the gills with every advantage they can get. I've more than once had a 4 man P3 claudette group where they ALL had decisive strike, one had a flashlight, another had a map and the other two had purple toolboxes.
    Do you have a problem with perks like Franklin's demise if I ran it to deal with that? Nurse's calling because it doesn't let you heal willy nilly close to the killer? What about ruin? Most killers put a perk in their setup because they believe it's needed for one reason or another, and frankly with the prove thyself changes, I'd be more surprised if people did NOT start using post gen pop builds. It'd be stupid not to prepare for that outcome when the majority of matches, especially in high rank, the gens are done in under 5 minutes.
    I won't sit here and pretend some people don't rely on no-ed too much and maybe should work on their skills, but at the end of the day using it alone doesn't dictate whether you're good or bad at the game. I've had no-ed on some of my builds because I just don't feel like being treated like a joke after the gens are finished, getting tea-bagged until I force them out.
    Nothing you suggested or I did applies to every killer playing what you think should never use the perk in every match. You just assume it does and post about how much of a noob they are.

  • thesuicidefoxthesuicidefox Member Posts: 5,321
    edited February 3

    I've come to accept NOED, as dumb as it is when it helps bad killers. It's there as a counter to gen rush, and against certain killers I've just come to accept it.

    The only thing that still bothers me about NOED is that there is no tell for it. Most if not all perks have a tell, something that gives away you have the perk, but not NOED. For as powerful as it is, it needs a tell. I've suggested before something small like it changes the color of gen sparks for a short time or maybe it causes an extra totem to spawn. Something that an astute survivor can see and go "that's NOED, better cleanse totems" but not something so obvious that you will never get it to proc. Then makes them waste time which is ultimately what I want as killer. The one shot at end game is nice, but if the threat of NOED can force the survivors to slow down I'd rather that. Mainly because if I can secure at least 2 kills before end game I don't feel like I need NOED, and in fact it almost feels like cheese at that point. Only time I actually want NOED is if all 4 survivors make it to end game, because that usually means gen rush.

  • FireHazardFireHazard Member, Trusted Posts: 3,716

    @CyanideCandy said:

    @FireHazard said:

    @CyanideCandy said:

    @FireHazard said:

    @NeoVid said:
    NOED is a perk made for players who are expecting to do badly so they can salvage a game at the last moment. I don't think that's an especially bad thing, it basically makes it the killer counterpart to Decisive Strike.

    Someone read the post for once. Yes its good for bad players and killers that need it which is OK. I consider it not OK if you for example you use nurse with NOED on top of bloodwarden and remember me. Its literal overkill ESPECIALLY if you already dominated the team before the last gen was even finished.

    If you have all that to aid in your 4k it shows you're pretty sweaty for every possible kill. It seems a lot of people are just skimming through the post and leaving regurgitated comments.

    Did you read my post by any chance? Because I did read your post all the way through and you didn't comment on mine like you have on quite a few others' responses. It's on the first page, close to the bottom if you missed it. I honestly want to know if you saw it at all. I hope you did since you've commented so many times on the post since then.TL/DR, my and a few people's problem with your post isn't even about your opinion on the perk but instead on you encouraging people to be toxic and treat each-other poorly because you don't like a perk they use.

    You edited that part out and added a few exceptions and a comment at the end about the perk breeding toxicity when used by people who you believe don't need it, but your motivation is still clear as day in the post. You're not suggesting a change, you're not encouraging people not to rely on the perk or trying to suggest a more skillful alternative to them. You're calling them a noob, toxic, and in the way you typed the post the first time before rewording almost all of it, you called them garbage too. You're whining, and this entire post doesn't do anything besides add to the toxicity that you're blaming on killers using no-ed. Chastising people for playing in a way you don't like IS toxic.

    I've tried to re-read all of your original post, the edited version, and even my own original comment before I typed this, but I check the forums when I'm about to go to bed, so as before I'm tired. If I'm missing something here, please feel free to tell me.

    The main post was re-worked because in a previous comment I stated it was created out of salt and anger.

    I agree that the original post was also hypocritical at stating the perk breeds toxicity while also being toxic myself. The main idea of the post itself was to just rant about its existence and how certain individuals use the perk knowing full well its overkill on certain characters that do not need it.

    Its like for example putting it on nurse, if you're already so good at demolishing the team why would you also need NOED on top of that? To rub salt in the wound or something? And before you say the [Insert just cleanse every dull totem] meme i'm FULLY aware of this... The perk itself is fine in the hands of those who really need it against better players, and killers that need to to apply some pressure end game since they couldn't at the start of middle of it.

    I just consider it not to be ok when its used by people who clearly don't need it on killers that never SHOULD use it.

    What is it that makes you so sure they don't need it? I get what you're implying but here's the problem. You may not think a hillybilly or a myers or so on need the perk and that it's overkill, but the killer may not think so. Just because they had a good match and no-ed popped at the end and gave them the last 2 kills doesn't mean EVERY match goes that well. For all you know, that killer might ordinarily get absolutely thrashed and just have had a good match this time. Or they just have the perk because they expect all the generators to pop before they can even get more than a handful of hooks.
    With how fast they do pop why WOULDN'T you want to use a perk that gives you a chance to still get some kills? There's no way to know how a match is going to go before you're in it and if most killers get the same experience I have then they've had days where it's just back to back 4 man swf groups kitted out to the gills with every advantage they can get. I've more than once had a 4 man P3 claudette group where they ALL had decisive strike, one had a flashlight, another had a map and the other two had purple toolboxes.
    Do you have a problem with perks like Franklin's demise if I ran it to deal with that? Nurse's calling because it doesn't let you heal willy nilly close to the killer? What about ruin? Most killers put a perk in their setup because they believe it's needed for one reason or another, and frankly with the prove thyself changes, I'd be more surprised if people did NOT start using post gen pop builds. It'd be stupid not to prepare for that outcome when the majority of matches, especially in high rank, the gens are done in under 5 minutes.
    I won't sit here and pretend some people don't rely on no-ed too much and maybe should work on their skills, but at the end of the day using it alone doesn't dictate whether you're good or bad at the game. I've had no-ed on some of my builds because I just don't feel like being treated like a joke after the gens are finished, getting tea-bagged until I force them out.
    Nothing you suggested or I did applies to every killer playing what you think should never use the perk in every match. You just assume it does and post about how much of a noob they are.

    Don't you think if a killers getting 4k every match (for example) and still uses post-gen perks to make sure the team dies is not overkill? Or to the very least makes them look like an ass? When I say "noob" i'm really referring to them intentionally being toxic, and as such should be made fun of for it.

    Of course they have the right to use any perks they want its their character, does that justify what they're doing though? No not really. Like for example, do you really need to punch someone in the face because they were being rude to you? You had the option to... but still choose not to because it wasn't the right way to handle the situation. In someones mind it may be, but in reality its not because it can bring on consequences.

    If you assume its OK to play a 5 blink nurse for example while having blood warden, NOED, Remember me, and Ruin then somethings wrong here lmao.

  • OrionOrion Member Posts: 11,721
    edited February 3

    @FireHazard said:
    Of course they have the right to use any perks they want its their character, does that justify what they're doing though? No not really.

    Yes, it absolutely [BAD WORD] does, as long as they don't break the rules. Who are you to tell someone else how to play the game they bought, as long as they don't break the rules? Who are you to tell someone else which parts of the game they bought they're "allowed" to use, as long as they don't break the rules? As long as they don't break the rules, they're justified in doing whatever they want, because that's the product they paid for. Who are you to say otherwise, as long as they don't break the rules?

    EDIT: Added "as long as they don't break the rules" to every single sentence to avoid people pretending they didn't read it.

  • FireHazardFireHazard Member, Trusted Posts: 3,716

    @Orion said:

    @FireHazard said:
    Of course they have the right to use any perks they want its their character, does that justify what they're doing though? No not really.

    Yes, it absolutely [BAD WORD] does. Who are you to tell someone else how to play the game they bought? Who are you to tell someone else which parts of the game they bought they're "allowed" to use? As long as they don't break the rules, they're justified in doing whatever they want, because that's the product they paid for. Who are you to say otherwise?

    So what you're saying is, since I bought the game I can be an [BAD WORD] to everyone I come across and be utterly toxic? And theirs justification for it? Sounds amazing.

  • OrionOrion Member Posts: 11,721

    @FireHazard said:

    @Orion said:

    @FireHazard said:
    Of course they have the right to use any perks they want its their character, does that justify what they're doing though? No not really.

    Yes, it absolutely [BAD WORD] does. Who are you to tell someone else how to play the game they bought? Who are you to tell someone else which parts of the game they bought they're "allowed" to use? As long as they don't break the rules, they're justified in doing whatever they want, because that's the product they paid for. Who are you to say otherwise?

    So what you're saying is, since I bought the game I can be an [BAD WORD] to everyone I come across and be utterly toxic? And theirs justification for it? Sounds amazing.

    You'd be breaking the rules, so no. I should've known I should've added "as long as they don't break the rules" to every single point, just so you couldn't pretend you didn't read it.

  • CyanideCandyCyanideCandy Member Posts: 31

    @FireHazard said:

    @CyanideCandy said:

    @FireHazard said:

    @CyanideCandy said:

    @FireHazard said:

    @NeoVid said:
    NOED is a perk made for players who are expecting to do badly so they can salvage a game at the last moment. I don't think that's an especially bad thing, it basically makes it the killer counterpart to Decisive Strike.

    Someone read the post for once. Yes its good for bad players and killers that need it which is OK. I consider it not OK if you for example you use nurse with NOED on top of bloodwarden and remember me. Its literal overkill ESPECIALLY if you already dominated the team before the last gen was even finished.

    If you have all that to aid in your 4k it shows you're pretty sweaty for every possible kill. It seems a lot of people are just skimming through the post and leaving regurgitated comments.

    Did you read my post by any chance? Because I did read your post all the way through and you didn't comment on mine like you have on quite a few others' responses. It's on the first page, close to the bottom if you missed it. I honestly want to know if you saw it at all. I hope you did since you've commented so many times on the post since then.TL/DR, my and a few people's problem with your post isn't even about your opinion on the perk but instead on you encouraging people to be toxic and treat each-other poorly because you don't like a perk they use.

    You edited that part out and added a few exceptions and a comment at the end about the perk breeding toxicity when used by people who you believe don't need it, but your motivation is still clear as day in the post. You're not suggesting a change, you're not encouraging people not to rely on the perk or trying to suggest a more skillful alternative to them. You're calling them a noob, toxic, and in the way you typed the post the first time before rewording almost all of it, you called them garbage too. You're whining, and this entire post doesn't do anything besides add to the toxicity that you're blaming on killers using no-ed. Chastising people for playing in a way you don't like IS toxic.

    I've tried to re-read all of your original post, the edited version, and even my own original comment before I typed this, but I check the forums when I'm about to go to bed, so as before I'm tired. If I'm missing something here, please feel free to tell me.

    The main post was re-worked because in a previous comment I stated it was created out of salt and anger.

    I agree that the original post was also hypocritical at stating the perk breeds toxicity while also being toxic myself. The main idea of the post itself was to just rant about its existence and how certain individuals use the perk knowing full well its overkill on certain characters that do not need it.

    Its like for example putting it on nurse, if you're already so good at demolishing the team why would you also need NOED on top of that? To rub salt in the wound or something? And before you say the [Insert just cleanse every dull totem] meme i'm FULLY aware of this... The perk itself is fine in the hands of those who really need it against better players, and killers that need to to apply some pressure end game since they couldn't at the start of middle of it.

    I just consider it not to be ok when its used by people who clearly don't need it on killers that never SHOULD use it.

    What is it that makes you so sure they don't need it? I get what you're implying but here's the problem. You may not think a hillybilly or a myers or so on need the perk and that it's overkill, but the killer may not think so. Just because they had a good match and no-ed popped at the end and gave them the last 2 kills doesn't mean EVERY match goes that well. For all you know, that killer might ordinarily get absolutely thrashed and just have had a good match this time. Or they just have the perk because they expect all the generators to pop before they can even get more than a handful of hooks.
    With how fast they do pop why WOULDN'T you want to use a perk that gives you a chance to still get some kills? There's no way to know how a match is going to go before you're in it and if most killers get the same experience I have then they've had days where it's just back to back 4 man swf groups kitted out to the gills with every advantage they can get. I've more than once had a 4 man P3 claudette group where they ALL had decisive strike, one had a flashlight, another had a map and the other two had purple toolboxes.
    Do you have a problem with perks like Franklin's demise if I ran it to deal with that? Nurse's calling because it doesn't let you heal willy nilly close to the killer? What about ruin? Most killers put a perk in their setup because they believe it's needed for one reason or another, and frankly with the prove thyself changes, I'd be more surprised if people did NOT start using post gen pop builds. It'd be stupid not to prepare for that outcome when the majority of matches, especially in high rank, the gens are done in under 5 minutes.
    I won't sit here and pretend some people don't rely on no-ed too much and maybe should work on their skills, but at the end of the day using it alone doesn't dictate whether you're good or bad at the game. I've had no-ed on some of my builds because I just don't feel like being treated like a joke after the gens are finished, getting tea-bagged until I force them out.
    Nothing you suggested or I did applies to every killer playing what you think should never use the perk in every match. You just assume it does and post about how much of a noob they are.

    Don't you think if a killers getting 4k every match (for example) and still uses post-gen perks to make sure the team dies is not overkill? Or to the very least makes them look like an ass? When I say "noob" i'm really referring to them intentionally being toxic, and as such should be made fun of for it.

    Of course they have the right to use any perks they want its their character, does that justify what they're doing though? No not really. Like for example, do you really need to punch someone in the face because they were being rude to you? You had the option to... but still choose not to because it wasn't the right way to handle the situation. In someones mind it may be, but in reality its not because it can bring on consequences.

    If you assume its OK to play a 5 blink nurse for example while having blood warden, NOED, Remember me, and Ruin then somethings wrong here lmao.

    You missed my point entirely in your first sentence. Just because a match you were in went well does not mean every match that killer plays is a 4k. More importantly, you're again encouraging toxicity towards people for doing something you don't like. Something YOU perceive as toxic.
    Also, your comparison doesn't make any sense. They have the right to use any perks they want, it's their character. That DOES justify them doing it, regardless of motivation. There is no rule or limit that says "Killers can't do this, this is unjust." And in not being unjust, it is justified. It's that simple. This has nothing to do with sportsmanship or attitude, as calling it toxic suggests.
    More concerning than that, you compare it to choosing not to assault someone for being rude but you missed the part where assault is ILLEGAL. It is by definition unjust and will incur consequences because there IS a law saying not to do it.
    All that perk setup suggests is that that player likes a really slow match, safety nets, and doesn't know what an ideal addon choice for nurse would be. I'm not even sure off the top of my head if you can do 5 blinks, but I imagine it comes with a downside if you can.

  • FireHazardFireHazard Member, Trusted Posts: 3,716

    @Orion said:

    @FireHazard said:

    @Orion said:

    @FireHazard said:
    Of course they have the right to use any perks they want its their character, does that justify what they're doing though? No not really.

    Yes, it absolutely [BAD WORD] does. Who are you to tell someone else how to play the game they bought? Who are you to tell someone else which parts of the game they bought they're "allowed" to use? As long as they don't break the rules, they're justified in doing whatever they want, because that's the product they paid for. Who are you to say otherwise?

    So what you're saying is, since I bought the game I can be an [BAD WORD] to everyone I come across and be utterly toxic? And theirs justification for it? Sounds amazing.

    You'd be breaking the rules, so no. I should've known I should've added "as long as they don't break the rules" to every single point, just so you couldn't pretend you didn't read it.

    No I read it, what you're clearly saying is if I wanted to I can be a knob to everyone I come across and just because I bought the game that will justify what i'm doing. The same can be said to people who know they don't need NOED but use it anyways despite it being obvious in the match that they don't.

    I know that point flys past most your heads, but that's what the rants implying here. Idc if you're a rank 20 using it, or if you're a Freddy who uses it, or what have you. I care only when its on killers that DON'T need it but still have it on them because the killer knows it makes the survivors angry.

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