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Am i dumb or they actually buffed DH ?

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  • AkumakajiAkumakaji Member Posts: 2,235

    And isn't this how BHVR should handle such a thing? As much as I chuckle at the notion of "nuke this perk from orbit", giving it a niche and usage, while taking away some of the painful plays of the past is awesome, isn't it? Some people will just wanna run DH, because they always have, and they will adjust. Others, that liked the comfort of "press E to gain distance" will claim that "they ruined DH lmao" and gravitate to something else. Everyone wins because the stale meta changes and new gameplays and tactics surfice.

  • JeanCharpentierJeanCharpentier Member Posts: 370
  • ViskodViskod Member Posts: 834

    The result of using Dead Hard is better, but you don't get that result if you don't get hit during its 1 second duration.

    So the rewards are higher, but so are the risks. You actually have to time it properly for it to work instead of just pressing a button and having it work whenever you want it to.

  • NamelessNameless Member Posts: 826
    edited June 23

    The distance might differ. I'm not going to sit here and pretend that I've done the math and that the survivor can use it at the exact same distance as Dead Hard now, but the point is that the lose-lose situation in the end is essentially the same. The killer won't be able to hit them for a second, which might be all the survivor needs to get to a completely safe position. It's the same thing as Dead Harding for distance right now.

    And sure they'll have to waste time mending, but that's only assuming you left the chase, and if you don't leave the chase you'll have to catch up to them again as they got a speed boost from the killer hitting them. If you do leave the chase, you're left without pressure so again: a lose-lose situation.

    As I said, it needs to be tested either way before drawing a permanent conclusion, but I'm just throwing my worries out here.

  • CameragoshaCameragosha Member Posts: 547

    Sure.

  • VikingDragonXiiVikingDragonXii Member Posts: 1,795

    But they won't be safe because the boost from the hit isn't that good to begin with and they are not fully invincible, they will get a deep wound which as we all know will down them if they don't heal. Do if the Killer keeps on them they will go down from the DW.

    Another thing is that the new DH will be fully skill based and not dumb luck or press E and forget. So in the hands of most of the "skilled" survivors it won't help them.

  • VikingDragonXiiVikingDragonXii Member Posts: 1,795

    If they used old DH to avoid Doc Mc Loves shock then they deserve to go down....that's just sad

  • ZeidoktorZeidoktor Member Posts: 1,284

    In thinking about it, I came to realize this is exactly the change I have been advocating for: You get your distance if, and only if, you successfully avoid a hit.

    I've never been against keeping the I-Frames aspect of the perk since, to my understanding, that was its whole premise considering flavor text like "you know how to take a beating".

  • c0ug4rc0ug4r Member Posts: 14

    Dead Hard lunge according to various sources is somewhere between 4m and 4.4m

    Survivor movement speed is 4m/s. So 1 second of Endurance equals 4m.

    Maybe I am missing something, but that still looks like Dead Hard for distance for me... only worse thanks to possible Endurance speed boost.

  • Mr_KMr_K Member Posts: 7,704

    At least they can't dead hard over traps anymore.

    Trapper buff. 😆

  • JeanCharpentierJeanCharpentier Member Posts: 370
    edited June 25

    Did not do the maths but now it is clear.

    That 1 second of invulnerability is stronger than the current DH dodge forward.

    So it means that the new DH version is a HUGE buff cause you will get 4 meters of invulnerability, enough to reach a pallet/window, and if the killer hits you it will grant the survivor an additional speedboost that will allow him/her to draw a 14 meters distance from the killer.

    Post edited by JeanCharpentier on
  • jesterkindjesterkind Member Posts: 3,719

    It's distance that you can only use when the killer is right on top of you, not at any time completely for free- consider that the 4.4 meters or whatever that you get from the current Dead Hard also pushes you further away from the killer than you'd get by running normally, because it's done much faster. It's also less impactful distance since it doesn't stop powers, doesn't stop grabs, and doesn't let you reposition through the killer.

    How much of a nerf this is will depend on stuff we simply don't know right now- like, are you animation locked and prevented from interacting with chase objects while DH is active? If so, it's a pretty huge nerf, and if not then the perk's still going to be very useful for preventing a hit that would otherwise land.

    ... But Dead Hard right now does way more than just that, so it is still a nerf.

  • NamelessNameless Member Posts: 826

    And if there's no animation to DH, then the killer will always hit you as well as they didn't get a heads up. There's literally no counterplay but that's if and only if this is really how Dead Hard works now. It's also just the PTB and nothing is permanent.

  • JeanCharpentierJeanCharpentier Member Posts: 370

    The current DH version just gives you a 2 or 3 meters dodge + immunity during this dodge.

    The new one will grant you 4 meters of invulnerability, it is more than what we have now. And you can use it when the killer is about to reach you.

    You do not need to have the dodge for it to be strong, you need the immunity. Immunity on a longer distance than what we have now = Buff.

    You will see guys, the new DH will be unbearable.

  • xEmoGirlxAlexisxxEmoGirlxAlexisx Member Posts: 365

    Ist most likely going to be a Buff BHVR know how much Survivors Loves DH and they dont want to make there Babys Mad because they cant Escape whitout there Busted Perk

  • dugmandugman Member Posts: 7,892

    Just FYI Endurance doesn’t trigger Deep Wounds, all it does is make you immune to damage. For example Mettle of Man gives the survivor Endurance with no Deep Wounds downside. They didn’t mention Deep Wounds in the dev blog post on Dead Hard so it’s quite possible it doesn’t inflict them and is just a 1 second period of damage invulnerability with no downside.

    That said I don’t think this new Dead Hard is a buff because there are not uncommon scenarios where Endurance doesn’t protect you where the current version does, including

    • Endurance can’t stop a window grab, but with the current version of Dead Hard you can lunge entirelu out of reach of a killer to immediately go into a vault and the killer can’t grab you. If you try that with this new Endurance version you might get grabbed if the killer was already close enough when you triggered the Endurance and vaulted.
    • Endurance doesn’t stop non-damaging effects like Deathslinger’s spear hits and Trapper’s traps immobilozing you and Doctor’s Shocks, etc. All those are things the current version can evade.
  • rooCraahrooCraah Member Posts: 132

    Depends on the killer.

    DH can no longer juke the Legion out of their power, cross an active bear trap, or (shockingly, this has happened before) avoid either of Doctor's powers.

    Not to mention, Deathslinger absolutely counters the DH buff. Endurance doesn't prevent him from shooting you, and will expire by the time he hits you.

    Nemesis is hurting, though. I remember seceral occasions where a survivor has just dropped or vaulted a pallet, andI whipped over it to try and hit them, but they use DH. Since they were nonlonger a valid target, the whip instead defaulted to breaking the pallet, thanks to which I'd catch them soon after.

    In fact, the whip partly counters DH anyway due to its lingering hitbox. If you were close enough, the survivors would go down immediately after DH ended. A similar thing could happen when the survivor tried to dodge Plague's corrupt purge or Bubba's chainsaw. Now, however, all 3 powers will instead trigger endurance.

  • SeraphorSeraphor Member Posts: 4,232

    I wouldn't worry about Plague's corrupt purge, the first hit might trigger endurance but the next rapid hit will be guaranteed.

  • TeabaggingGhostfaceTeabaggingGhostface Member Posts: 2,259

    Legion and deathslinger hard counter new dead hard

  • JeanCharpentierJeanCharpentier Member Posts: 370

    "It is a nerf" 😂

    Reaction DH is way stronger than the old DH. Hello again 4 DH squads.

  • FolabiFolabi Member Posts: 11

    you are dumb, thank you next.

  • AneurysmAneurysm Member Posts: 5,091

    I only watched the first game but that is a very experienced survivor going against a killer who gets flashlight saved three times and swings at every window fake. You don't need DH for a killer like that (no disrespect to the spirit, she could be new) and I've tried the new dead hard against more experienced killers who don't just m1 the second you launch yourself at them.

    It's a nerf.

  • IamFranIamFran Member Posts: 1,115
    edited June 30

    No, it's not a buff (objetively).

    • Can't be used for reaching windows.
    • Can still be used to reach a pallet and stun the killer but require a better timing (more skill) and it's not a free loop one more time like before and it's not a "Press E to win".
    • Can't be used to avoid trapper traps.
    • No longer counter the Deathslinger Power.

    The only good thing of the new Dead Hard is it's better counter against strong killers (which is very good), it's better Against Nurse, Blight and Huntress.

  • burt0rburt0r Member Posts: 2,739

    Okay let me explain.

    Those 2 meters are ADDITIONAL distance.

    The 4 meters invulnerability don't give any additional distance, that is only distance traveled for the survivor AND the killer.

    The 2 meters are distance the killer has to catch up. Survivor run with 100% movement speed at 4 m/s and the killer with generally 115% at 4.6 m/s.

    Meaning that the killer needs 2:0.6= 3.3 seconds to catch up which in return are 13.2 meter distance traveled.

    And I hope i don't have to explain that 13.2 > 4.

  • CanasCanas Member Posts: 798

    They absolutely must add some sort of exhaustion which prevents the survivor from dropping down any pallets after using DH. There's nothing preventing them from saving it until they're at a pallet; if the killer goes for an early swing, the survivor will simply use DH to get their chase extender anyway.

  • DeathstrokeDeathstroke Member Posts: 886

    Never works on console and even if I use it before killer hits still killer hit downs me as hit vakidation always favour killer. It will be good on pc but on console garbage. That's why I wanted immortality and ability to dodge hits taken away so it can only be used for distance.

  • Killing_TimeKilling_Time Member Posts: 617

    I don't even put it past these devs. They know survivors are cream of the crop so the continuously cater to them YET AGAIN.

  • VetratheneVetrathene Member Posts: 1,423

    I really wish they had just made it so when you activate DS you cannot use interactbles for 1.5 seconds after your run had been completed. So it would let you avoid a hit as intended, but even with the distance gained you couldn't vault a window or throw down a pallet.

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