Seriously, before legion this was a meta perk and everyone agreed it was perfectly balanced. Then legion dropped and BT got buffed, for absolutely no reason. Now it's getting buffed again? Just bring back the pre-legion borrowed time.
Agreed, it's already powerful enough in the endgame
It's not a buff unless you're a moonwalker exploiting the chase mechanic.
It still functions as it should. Unless you follow backwards to negate the perk completely. Which is an exploit.
@Carpemortum Not true. Unless I'm mistaken you can hear survivors mending. You didnt have to cheese the moonwalk for them to be in your TR mending. Now if you lose them while they have deep wounds you have no way to find them and they have no pressure to mend.
@KingB That's a decent, albeit relatively situational, point. That assumes that the killer hits them, chases them but loses them, and either does not search the area well enough and leaves, or searches to find nobody, as they're hiding in the TR and not mending.
It also assumes they're not running whispers or stridor, already, or in response to the change for just this. The old "perks for every issue" thing.
I would assume it wont be used like that in the endgame, as most people take the hit and run as far away as possible, towards the exit gates.
But, let's be honest, if a killer loses track of someone they're chasing, late game or not, and they believe they have borrowed time, most good killers won't waste time searching for that one person. They'll do a sweep if they lose LoS, and move on, as to not get hung up on one person and let 3 others run rampant.
While I can't argue that there isn't a situation that it is NOW slightly more useful, it being unable to be moonwalk exploited is a far better change than this perceived buff is. The buff, if it can actually be considered that, is minimal compared to the QoL fix it's gotten. It also still does it's job effectively. It is intended to prevent tunneling on an unhook.
Pre-Legion BT would be so much worse. It would go back to killers hitting you and jsut following you around. Which is what the timer was supposed to prevent in the first place.
But I do again have to say, it's a small situation I hadn't fully considered, even as situational as it may be.
@Carpemortum the moonwalk exploit should have never impacted BT regardless. It was a stupid and un-necessary buff for borrowed time. This is a small buff for BT granted but any buff is unnecessary. I fully believe and always have BT should revert to the pre legion version. It would be like tweaking the speed boost on noed, it's not big but the perk is already strong. Theres no need.
@KingB I get where you're coming from about the pre Legion BT, but that version was so much worse. Even if it felt more balanced, the way it worked ENCOURAGED tunneling. It turned into "I hit them, but they're not down yet? F that i'm just gonna follow them until they hit the ground."
At least with the bleedout change that attitude was curbed. Granted you can still tunnel, but if so you actually HAVE to catch up and land that second hit.
I think they should just give BT its own distance values, if withing X meters of killer it won't tick down. Keep it at what a chase distance is supposed to be. This way you cant negate Bleedout with moonwalking, but you also cant hide 25 meters away with no repercussions.
See how that works maybe as a nice middle ground.
@Carpemortum Unsafe unhooks were supposed to be self-explanatory. You weren't supposed to be guaranteed an escape. That was the point,that's why it's called borrowed time not bulletproot lol. It was never supposed to do anything other than give you a chance. IF you had an exhaustion perk could you make it to the door before collapsing? It was balanced for both sides.
You shouldn't have to land a second hit. It was only supposed to delay the effect of one so you might have the chance of escaping.
That would be better than nothing. I don't understand why the devs had to try to fix something that wasn't broke. No one had any complaints before DW was a thing and there were not any threads claiming it needed a buff.
@KingB True, given how many second chance perks are in game now, putting BT on a base timer would balance things a little better.
BT, MoM (as NOT OP as it actually is), Dead Hard put together could make a 2k into a 0k nightmare.
If the old timer was in place even with them possibly escaping with the other perks, they would eventually hit the ground.
Get used to hitting the BT recipient twice. Or 3x, with MoM. Or 4x, with MoM and DS.
Or 5x, with MoM, DS, Adr.
Or 5x + 1 whiff, with DH, MoM, DS, Adr
@Carpemortum MoM isnt op it's just really unfun like NOED. I have no issue with dead hard tbh, if I don't bait it out I genuinely feel like I got outplayed. I don't feel robbed of anything. If BT was the only anti-tunnel perk I could see it being strong as it is, but there are other viable options now.
@KingB Yeah thats what I was saying. If it was the only one it wouldn't be so bad, but considering how people could pair them together with the new TR change may be a bit excessive.
Was it actually confirmed that the Deep Wound changes also affect BT instead of just Legion’s Frenzy?
@SnakeSound222 It affects Deep Wounds, the status. Deep Wounds is applied by Feral Frenzy and Borrowed Time. So yeah, it affects both.
This is the second buff to BT after I already considered it an S tier perk. This is getting a little out of hand.
Wanna stop buffing Borrowed Time? Stop tunneling.
Stop tunneling gens. Whenever your gen reaches 33 or 66%, go look for another one.
if you happen to find a 33 or 66% gen while running around, ABSOLUTELY ignore it.
What buff did it get?
Look at the Deep Wound changes on The Legion Update.
@Dwight_Fairfield It wont tick down while in killers TR, not just in chase.
All of deep wounds got it. So BT was affected.
It pauses when in the killers radius now no matter if your in a chase or not. The Killers can no longer see the progress bar go down, they'll just see it as full until the survivor goes down or mends. and Lastly, the timer now Pauses when your mending too.
As a killer main, even I know this is just stupid.
Of course it is stupid, it's an analogy illustrating the stupidity of the "tunneling" concept.
i generally dont understand their logic how deep wounds work...
"when you run at full speed, your wounds (deep enough to make you drop deadly injured after a very short time btw) will neigther open, nor hinder you in any way!" or "when you are somewhere around the killer, the wounds will stay closed, no matter what you do." i dont think thats how real deep wounds are working...
They should rename it to "annoying time consuming status"
People can sometimes endure injuries in fight-or-flight situations. The in-game perks Unbreakable and Adrenalin are based off the same concept of people going beyond their limits in dangerous situations.
Everyone does realized it was buffed because of legion right
OP seems a little confused, with the DW change BT was NERFED, not buffed, therefore if they simply make BT not give DW timer it will be a buff, but from a nerfed position and will still be more nerfed than it was pre legion. (since they reduced the timers also with legion release)
However I agree completely return BT to it's pre legion effect! PLEASE!?!?!?
If there werent as many killers face camping hooks and tunneling players off them there wouldnt be so many complaints therefore devs have to listen if it gets to a certain percentage of the player base otherwise who would play the game admit this is only to a certain degree i.e if the gates are powered you get a hook etc you wanna proxy but when its the 1st hook at 5 gens what is the point of it ? It cant be banned because of the 2 different situations given and they expect players to respect the difference and this happens to me 8 out 10 games so you cant complain to anyone but the killers responsible for causing the buff to happen
Just my opinion good fog dwellers
@HURRI_KAIN No, pre DW borrowed time you would go down in I think 25 seconds at level 3 no matter what. You can say reducing the timer by 5 seconds was a nerf but it really isnt. DW isnt threatening to survivors. Instead of going down in 25 seconds you can extend the chase indefinitely.
Instead of buffing the worthless perks, the borrowed is getting buffed again. Just stop.