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"VoIP doesn't give that big of an advantage!"

SythalinSythalin Member Posts: 280

I've taken the time to note communications over VoIP me and my buddies have said during games with various perks. People seem to GREATLY underestimate the "free perks" and "free counters" VoIP gives survivors. Let's review:

VoIP "free perks:

Bond

"I see you, on my way."

Breakdown

"Killer is heading back to your hook."

Buckle Up

"My recovery is maxed, come heal back up."

Dark Sense

"Killer is heading towards X."

Deja Vu

"There's a gen over by the water tower."

Detective's Hunch

"The gen/chest/totem is near the exit door."

Distortion

"Pretty sure killer has BBQ, hide behind gens."

Empathy

"You're close to me, come over here so I can heal you."

"You're heading towards our gen, lead the killer the other way."

Kindred

"Killer is camping/proxy camping."

Object of Obsession

"I see the killer over there towards me at the digger."

Open Handed

VoIP = global distance

Plunderer's Instinct

"There's an unopened chest on the top floor."

Premonition

"Killer is heading towards your gen."

"Stop healing, killer is coming."

Small Game

"Found the totem, it's upstairs in the Myer's house."

Spine Chill

"Stop healing, killer is coming."

"Killer is heading this way."

Wake Up!

"Exit Gate is behind the house."

"I'm heading for the gate with killer chasing, cover me!"

Windows of Opportunity

"There's no more pallets on the main street."


VoIP counters killer perk:

A Nurse's Calling

"Killer came straight to me while healing, must have Nurse's."

Barbecue & Chili

"Killer heading straight for the furthest gen where you're at."

"Getting hooked, hide behind the gens."

Beast of Prey

"Killer is still chasing you."

Dark Devotion

"Careful, terror radius is on me at the moment so they probably don't have one."

Hex: Any

"Found the totem, it's by the killer shack. Getting chased away from it right now."

Insidious

"Killer is hiding/camping near my hook with no terror radius."

Knock Out

"I've managed to crawl away and currently by the exit gate."

Make Your Choice

"Just got MYC, careful when unhooking the rest of the game."

Monitor & Abuse

"Heartbeat just suddenly got louder, careful trying to juke since they have M&A."

Play With Your Food

"Killer is hitting me (the obsession) and leaving. Watch for PWYF speed buff."

Rancor

"I'm the obsession with no obsession perks, and I seem low priority on chases. Killer may have Rancor."

Territorial Imperative

"Went to basement for the chest, killer came straight downstairs and started searching lockers. Probably Territorial."

Tinkerer's

"Killer suddenly has no terror radius.", "My gen is almost done.", "Then they must have Tinkerer's."

Whispers

"Killer keeps patrolling the area I'm in, pretty sure they're using Whispers."


So, any survivors still want to try and claim how using VoIP doesn't grand HUGE advantages?

Comments

  • Dolphin9192Dolphin9192 Member Posts: 127

    The sad thing is that Dark Devotion is a new perk, that the devs thought would be good or fun.

  • SythalinSythalin Member Posts: 280

    I didn't miss them, I purposely skipped ones that still give highly noticable notifications outside of VoIP, such as noticing the screams with Iron Maiden. Thanks though for trying to help.

  • brokedownpalacebrokedownpalace Member Posts: 4,227

    Nothing they could do to buff solo players would be as effective as direct communication and coordination. And you know what the solo buffs would do? Also buff SWF. Buff the cases with 3 SWF and 1 solo. Buff 2 SWF teams. Etc.

  • JudithJudith Member Posts: 819

    If you give everyone communication, non swf loses it's charm. Solo can be hell yes but team with no comms can make the game more interesting too.

  • NuclearBurritoNuclearBurrito Member Posts: 5,145

    For many of these there is the unreliable assumption that someone is guaranteed to know the location of any given totem/gen and the Killer at any given moment in order to relay the information in the first place.

    For the ally tracking perks this holds true. However for perks like Object and Detectives Hunch it does not.

    Also both Breakdown and Distortion have a tangible effect and are not information gathering perks. Thus VOIP does not replicate their effects even in theory.

    Knowing that the Killer has BBQ thus hide behind gens is A: Not hard to figure out as solo anyways, B: Assumed to begin with because of how common it is and C: Not the sole value of distortion which also has scratch mark removal and immunity to aura reading in ADDITION to BBQ's (such as Scratch mirror, Nurses calling, Bitter Murmur, Freddy etc)

    But yeah, Killer and objective tracking perks don't belong on this list. Hell some people even run Spine chill for vault speed increase (which I'm not sure even exists).

    Also VOIP does not counter Beast of Pray at all. That perk is useless enough to counter itself.

    More importantly though if you don't think you are in a chase when you clearly are why would anyone else magically know to correct you?

    In fact most of the Killer counter's you listed are techniques that work just fine as solo survivor, specifically BBQ, Nurses, Rancor/STBFL* (remember the pregame chat exists to list your perk combos) Territorial and Whispers.

    Note: VOIP IS really strong. But this list includes too many things which just ends up hurting your credibility.

    *Rancor and STBFL look identical using the listed method of noticing it.

  • Condorloco_26Condorloco_26 Member Posts: 1,714

    Option 1.

    Separate mode for swf with stronger killers, i.e. 6 perk slots.

    Extra bps for everyone


    Option 2.

    Hide survivor names in lobby so there's no chance of joining party chat with randos.

    Then, nerf perk slots for people joining the lobby in a swf team.

    2 man team: 3 perk slots

    3 man team: 2 perk slots

    4 man team: 1 perk slot.

    Extra bps for all survivors.

    Now we're talking balance.

  • MystiKasTMystiKasT Member Posts: 289

    +1 @Peanits @not_Queen everyone needs to read and understand this

  • deathsiadeathsia Member Posts: 250

    Fun Fact: SWF wasn't even supposed to be an intended feature! It was added(hastily might I add!) due to the playerbase being so small and demanding the ability to play with their friends in a party.

    It's why when the host disconnects, you don't remain in the same party and have to remake a SWF lobby.

    The reason why it wasn't apart of the original game at launch is because the devs KNEW of the unfair advantages this would bring but added it to attract new players with the prospect of their pals being on voice chat with them if they were a new player and helping them learn the ropes.

    And of course, once added, would be a bad PR move to remove so they had no choice but to keep it in despite it going against their original vision for the game.

  • NuclearBurritoNuclearBurrito Member Posts: 5,145

    @Condorloco_26 you can use the steam menu to get their names even if they are perfectly hidden in the game itself.

  • BoxingRougeBoxingRouge Member Posts: 606
    edited April 2019

    They will never change swf, no one will play with the options listed above. Killers will just see a burning campfire.

  • Condorloco_26Condorloco_26 Member Posts: 1,714

    @NuclearBurrito

    Ok thanks, I didn't know that since I play on console.

    Although thinking about it, console also gives that option.

  • Condorloco_26Condorloco_26 Member Posts: 1,714
  • SythalinSythalin Member Posts: 280

    I'm not concerned with my "credibility". To summarize, you're basically saying that everything I listed doesn't matter if people are not paying attention and communicating. If you are in a SWF and you're NOT communicating and keeping tabs on each other then they're the minority.

    As I originally stated, I have personally said and have had said to me everything on this list during my SWF games. If other SWF + VoIP groups are less coordinated, that's their choice.

  • NuclearBurritoNuclearBurrito Member Posts: 5,145

    @Sythalin Strawman argument, I never claimed communication wasn't occurring or that people weren't keeping tabs. That communication is how you are replicating perks like bond and empathy.

    However Killer tracking perks like Object and Spine chill can either give you pieces of information that you would otherwise not have. Yes if you see the Killer VOIP can relay that information, however the only perk that really replicates that is Kindred and even then if the Killer is behind a wall SWF wouldn't know his actual location, just that he's likely in the terror radius of the hooked survivor, and with insidious not even that.

    Remember SOMEONE needs to get the Killer/Totem/Whatever's location in the first place before VOIP can be used to relay that information. Thus the only perks that VOIP can replicate are the perks that give information that another survivor would already have.

    So bond is redundant for SWF since they already can relay their exact locations. However Object is not since the Killer could be outside the LoS of all 4 survivors. In fact it is a common practice to use Object combined with VOIP specifically to take advantage of the fact that Object grants constant access to the most important piece of information that SWF can't automatically have perkless.

    As for the Killer perks. Again, if are able to relay that the Killer has BBQ that means you had to figure that out without using VOIP in the first place. And if you can do it then everyone else can too. Especially with perks like ToTH which announce their presence the second you work on a totem. The survivors will figure out pretty quick that you have it with or without SWF.

  • SairekSairek Member Posts: 3,977

    @brokedownpalace

    Again, it's not about making solos and SWF completely even, it's about bridging the gap between the two, so the disparity isn't so huge.

    No where did I say "make solos as strong as SWF". I said to balance the game with VOIP in mind, because it's what a lot of people use.

    Who cares if SWF gets buffed a little bit when solos and killers would be buffed a lot, thus still tightening the power gap between all three to be closer together.

  • ApeOfMazorApeOfMazor Member Posts: 382

    Make killers aware of what they are getting into. Provide proper incentives or power ups to the killer depending on party sizes.

  • ba_tetsuoba_tetsuo Member Posts: 289

    3 and 4 man swf get 3 perk slots. Killers get +1 perk slot per player for groups, and get to see which players are grouped.

  • MadjuraMadjura Member Posts: 909

    Balancing the game around voice chat when not every survivor has access to it is a bad idea

    Voice chat should be implemented in the game for all survivors to use (like tons of other games have it) and then the game should be balanced around it. Otherwise solo players have an unfair disadvantage

  • FeelsVeryBadManFeelsVeryBadMan Member Posts: 197

    Half of these aren't even used by average SWF teams, but ok.

    inb4 "you're just an entitled survivor main defending SWF"

  • Andreyu44Andreyu44 Member Posts: 1,528

    Braindead idiots will say:

    "TaKe It As A cHaLlEnGe"

  • Andreyu44Andreyu44 Member Posts: 1,528
  • OrionOrion Member Posts: 11,721

    My former SWF group was well below average and we used all of these (except the ones that only applied to perks and mechanics that didn't exist back then, for obvious reasons).

  • RaptorrotasRaptorrotas Member Posts: 1,718

    Even if OP might be exxagerating a bit, survivors who decide to play serious to win will be able to use it nearly as well as he fears they would.

    Good thing "most survivors are just potatoes chatting with their friends"

    But then again "*youtube fake scarejump scream* GO AWAY GO AWAGHAG STOP FOLLOWING ME111!!!111" is nearly the same as "killer is here, do gens you dimwits, why do i have to explain basic game strategies to you?"

    If survivors are playing to win and follow some basic rules, they dont need voicechat that much. I think depip squad summarized their strategy in less than 4 rules when they did 100 games wothout voicechat.

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