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Gen Rushing Solutions

DreamnomadDreamnomad Member Posts: 2,847
edited May 2019 in General Discussions

First of all, I don't hold it against survivors for efficiently working on generators. That's just smart play. But at the higher ranks, it really is an issue when the killer barely gets the first survivor on a hook and 2 gens have already popped. I'm not talking a long protracted chase sequence either. High level survivors are just crazy fast at finishing gens!

So let's talk about possible solutions that are fair to everyone. Here is a concept I've been thinking about. If the average rank of all players in a lobby is between 10-1 then survivors get a 25% handicap on gen repair speed during the first 2 minutes of the match. Gen rushing isn't an issue for newer players and they shouldn't be unfairly punished.

Once a generator is at 50% repair status, survivors will not be able to progress further without finding and installing a part for the generator. When a survivor reaches half repair state they will see an icon on the generator showing the color and shape of a part at which point the part will spawn into the world at least 32 meters away from the generator. If a survivor is within 16 meters of a part, they will be able to see the aura of the part. The aura will be color coded to a specific generator. Once the survivor has picked up a part, they will be able to see the aura of the generator that it goes to.

Multiple survivors can pick up the same part, but once the first survivor installs the part it will be removed from all survivors inventories and survivors that had the part will no longer be able to see the aura of the generator. When a survivor with a part returns to the generator, they will receive a 1000 bloodpoint bonus for installing the part. If the generator is no longer at 50% repair status due to the killer kicking the generator while the survivor was looking for the part when they install the part it will repair the generator progress up to 25%, but will not raise the repair state past 50%.

If one or more survivor(s) are dead or DC then any generator that hasn't already reached the "part missing" stage will not be missing parts.

Brand New Part will lose all current text and be replaced with the ability to repair a generator without having to find the specific part. Using the part will consume it from the player's inventory.

I would also like to see it changed so when killers kick a gen, there is 5% immediate damage to the generator. That would put a little bit more power back in the killer's hands fighting gen progress. I'm open to other ideas and suggestions.

EDIT: Removed old idea and added new one due to feedback.

Post edited by Dreamnomad on
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Comments

  • JudithJudith Member Posts: 819

    Only time I am not genrushed is if I hook two people early or I am up against dumb squad who think they can bully Myers all they want.

  • VliegerVlieger Member Posts: 326

    Different difficulties at different ranks would just create incentive to derank or always play swf with at least one person who is not within the "high" ranks to get easier matches.

    I like the 5% immediate damage when a gen is kicked idea. Most of the time it isn't worth it to kick a gen since regression is so slow and a survivor can just walk by and tap it to stop the regression.

    I like suggestions of adding other objectives or something along the lines of you have to find a part to repair a generator. Once you find a part you put it in a gen, and anyone can then repair that gen. Could possibly even change the Brand New Part addon along with this into essentially bringing a part into the game with you so you can start repairing right away.

  • tt_ivi_99tt_ivi_99 Member Posts: 1,463

    The handicap thing is not really needed, I could see the 5% instant regression so that gen tap in the middle of a chase is removed.

    People dont want to hold M1 forever so the community has asked about new objectives for a long time, we can only wait now...

  • TheShape78TheShape78 Member Posts: 712

    Rather than talking stats, what I really want to know is if there is even a viable strategy a killer can take to deal with this long standing issue. I've had a number of games in the past where it seems like 3 minutes into the game, 2 generators are already repaired, before I can even find anyone.

  • ApeOfMazorApeOfMazor Member Posts: 471

    They won't increase gen times cause survivors say its boring and unfun so our only option is a new mandatory objective or hell some sort of BP pinata that will waste their time but give them big points so killers can hunt longer.

  • DreamnomadDreamnomad Member Posts: 2,847

    The de-ranking concerns are valid. Players would definitely abuse that. I like the idea finding and installing parts to repair a generator. It needs to be fair to survivors and actually buy time for killers. Here is what I propose:

    Once a generator is at 50% repair status, survivors will not be able to progress further without finding and installing a part for the generator. When a survivor reaches half repair state they will see an icon on the generator showing the color and shape of a part at which point the part will spawn into the world at least 32 meters away from the generator. If a survivor is within 16 meters of a part, they will be able to see the aura of the part. The aura will be color coded to a specific generator. Once the survivor has picked up a part, they will be able to see the aura of the generator that it goes to.

    Multiple survivors can pick up the same part, but once the first survivor installs the part it will be removed from all survivors inventories and survivors that had the part will no longer be able to see the aura of the generator. When a survivor with a part returns to the generator, they will receive a 1000 bloodpoint bonus for installing the part. If the generator is no longer at 50% repair status due to the killer kicking the generator while the survivor was looking for the part when they install the part it will repair the generator progress up to 25%, but will not raise the repair state past 50%.

    Brand New Part will lose all current text and be replaced with the ability to repair a generator without having to find the specific part. Using the part will consume it from the player's inventory. Comments?

  • thesuicidefoxthesuicidefox Member Posts: 8,227
    edited May 2019

    What really needs to happen is there needs to be a cap to how fast a gen can be done. A gen should NEVER be finished faster than 50 seconds. NEVER. Doesn't matter how many survivors are on it or if they have toolboxes or not. The gen should NEVER get done faster than 50 seconds.

    Next there needs to be some sort of buffer to prevent multiple gens from popping all at once. Something like, if 3 gens pop too quickly (say all within 60 seconds of each other) it will cause all other gens to overheat and lose like 50% progress (total progress, so -40s basically). This forces survivors to pace the gens at least for the start.

    Doing these 2 things will greatly slow down the game at higher ranks where it is needed, but won't negatively affect low ranks because they simply won't ever meet the cap for gen speed and/or they won't be popping gens super fast to overheat them.

    More objectives won't work. Survivors will just find a way to rush that too. You end up with a situation where you seriously punish low rank survivors, and only get a net gain of like 30 seconds at high ranks. Finding parts is dumb too because sometimes that isn't an option. Sometimes you NEED to finish the gen now and not later.

    There simply needs to be limits to how fast gens can go. This would only affect high rank survivors that blow through gens super fast. Anything else you do will just hurt the low rank survivors.

  • Army_StichArmy_Stich Member Posts: 16

    I can understand your frustration with "gen rushing" but your idea is a bit ridiculous. looking for parts to repair a generator would just be a nightmare situation and if there is only 2 people left in the match.... it would just cause survivor mains ######### to the point they quit.

  • tt_ivi_99tt_ivi_99 Member Posts: 1,463

    @Army_Stich

    Both killers and survivors have been asking for the "looking for parts" idea, I dont see why they would ######### about it...

  • NoShinyPonyNoShinyPony Member Posts: 4,570

    @thesuicidefox "More objectives won't work. Survivors will just find a way to rush that too."

    Survivors will find a way to efficiently handle a 2nd objective, but the objective still needs to be done and doing so will consume time.

    If you give survivors more work and don't change anything for the killer, it will lead to the killer having more time for chasing survivors.

  • CorianderCoriander Member Posts: 1,069

    I like the parts idea, but I think they should be generic and not coded. I see people taking a part and just running off with it. You would be unable to complete the gen if it was one part for one specific gen.

  • thesuicidefoxthesuicidefox Member Posts: 8,227

    My point is it won't consume enough time to significantly effect top tier survivors, which is where the problem is in the first place. All you do with a second objective is slow down bad survivors, who don't rush gens anyway. The gain isn't worth completely screwing over bad survivors.

    You need something specific to target the good survivors if you want to have a positive impact on the game.

  • Bravo0413Bravo0413 Member Posts: 3,631

    You do make a good point.. a repair speed cap should be implemented.. the overheating could be like a waiting period (gens can't be repaired) and maybe the killer could get like a little boost from the entity during that wait period in MS, attack cooldown, pickup, pallet break, etc... that could be interesting

  • ShaderzShaderz Member Posts: 32

    Excellent and fair idea.

  • paint1210paint1210 Member Posts: 95

    Just master NuRSe if you want ti counter gen rush

  • DreamnomadDreamnomad Member Posts: 2,847

    @Coriander You missed the part where I said multiple survivors can pick up the same part. And since you can see the aura of the generator it goes to highlighted with the matching color there shouldn't be any mistake where it goes. There is no way for survivors to screw each other over looking for or picking up parts.

  • newdulsnewduls Member Posts: 90
    edited May 2019

    They could add new objectives, but its not really necessary.

    The gens themselves simple need to be gated.

    That is, when the game starts, only 1 of the 7 generators can be worked on, all the rest of the generators would be blocked. The killer should not know which ones are blocked.

    Every 2 mins an additionally generator is unlocked.

    That way the general duration of the game is 100% controlled by the developers. With 7 total generators available, it would take 12 mins for them all to become "unlocked". At 5 gens to win the game length would always be guaranteed to be over 8 mins

  • DreamnomadDreamnomad Member Posts: 2,847

    That really doesn't seem fair to survivors. The goal isn't to make the game unfair to survivors. The goal is to put the brakes on the game a little bit.

  • newdulsnewduls Member Posts: 90

    it can be calibrated to any game lenght, if the minimum game length of 8 mins is too long you only need to reduce the lock out time...

    if you believe the fair game length is 5 mins then make it 1 min each.

  • VliegerVlieger Member Posts: 326

    @thesuicidefox The problem with your idea is there is nothing stopping survivors from 99ing all gens, then just popping them within the "cooldown" constraints. Wouldn't add much time to the game unfortunately.

  • Bravo0413Bravo0413 Member Posts: 3,631

    The more these types of ideas come up the more I like em...

    An additional objective could hurt newer/inexperienced players badly if but something like this would be quite good

  • Karl_ChildersKarl_Childers Member Posts: 669

    Id first like to see statistics released, excluding games with DCs, that shows throughout ranks that killer is averaging less than 2K per game. If that’s the case, we can talk about slowing survivors down only. Otherwise, to extend games things need to happen for BOTH sides. I don’t see why generator repair should be slowed down but tunneling (aka “kill-rushing”) should be left as is. Also, with anything involving the slowing of gens, we have to have hard measures against camping. Campers should never be buffed, which would be the case if killer remains untouched but gens are slowed. That’s common sense. Chaser penalty doesn’t cut it, hook progression should slow to a crawl also if the killer is standing in whatever proximity of the hook and not in chase. This would compensate for it taking longer to repair gens. That’s only fair.

  • Tru3LemonTru3Lemon Member Posts: 1,358

    the only solution on genrush its making a second objective for survivors an example find a part for the gen that you cannot start unless you have a part also if they did that then they need to find another solution of campers

  • thesuicidefoxthesuicidefox Member Posts: 8,227

    If you 99 gens then killer can kick them.

    If you pop 3 quick then it regresses all the others.

    So yes it adds time. No survivors will 99 every gen on the map. Maybe 2 at most but you are talking about something that doesn't and wouldn't happen IRL.

  • NuclearBurritoNuclearBurrito Member Posts: 6,807

    I'd be down for finding a solution to both gen rush and tunneling. They both are somewhat problematic for slightly different but related reasons

  • SkycererSkycerer Member Posts: 179

    Tunneling fix is Decisive Strike

    Genrush fix is... ehm... no play

  • VliegerVlieger Member Posts: 326

    @thesuicidefox

    If the system was in place that you were suggesting and I am playing survivor and working on a gen, I see a gen just popped and know I will be penalized for finishing my gen, I would 99 it. Go hide nearby, if killer kicks it I would go tap it. Then go pop it once I am no longer penalized for doing so.

    Exciting gameplay. Yes it would happen if that was the objective. What else are the survivors supposed to do during the time they have to wait to pop a gen? You see the issue with adding a generic time gate? There is nothing for one side to do during that time other than hide and wait for the next time gate.

  • thesuicidefoxthesuicidefox Member Posts: 8,227

    Then you are wasting time and the killer is gaining time. You would be better served going to find a new gen to work on if that's your plan.

  • VliegerVlieger Member Posts: 326

    @thesuicidefox

    Either way the system would be punishing survivors for doing well, which is never good game design. Good game design would be to extend the length of a match fluidly and make it fun for both sides. Any generic time gate system is not fluid and very predictable.

    Adding another objective like the one I originally suggested in this thread would be a way to extend the match, give both sides something to do during that extra time, and would be dynamic to how well either side does. Not just some system that says "the game has to last at least this long"

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