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Is LEGION in a good place now?

Th3NightmareTh3Nightmare Member Posts: 754
edited June 20 in General Discussions

I would like the opinion of experienced people ... because I believe that the changes were well oriented, but I think they have left it "out of play", it is my opinion.

Edit: I would like to transmit to the devs, that they keep an eye on him and that they do not give it for lost. He needs help. I hope that in the next mid-patch he will receive some interesting buffs to be able to play it again.

@Peanits @Janick

Post edited by Th3Nightmare on

Comments

  • GroxiverdeGroxiverde Member Posts: 512
    edited June 20

    I think the same as @Blueberry , with their best build and addons they're still mid tier at best. Loopable as hell, 32m terror radius, nothing special. Just a free hit at the start of the chase and that's all.

  • AetherBytesAetherBytes Member Posts: 966

    I believe thatwhile he doesn't hit the skill cap of other rank 1 killers, he is viable if played near perfectly. I've had games with legion where I steamrolled a team. I'm talking perfect plays almost every chancethereis.

  • ShroompyShroompy Member Posts: 215

    Id like to say they're in a better place then before, how ever they we're never really good to begin with.

    They have whats possibly the best tracking in the game and they can stall quite well, they're low, mid-tier at best how ever they can still do quite well in the right hands, I've played Legion quite a bit since the change and I find myself doing decent. (I hover around Rank 1-4) without Ruin. I use Thanatophobia, Sloppy Butcher, M&A and STBFL. Sloppy and Thana stall the game quite well, makes survivors waste a lot of time healing and if they don't heal, they can get caught off guard with Monitor. How ever you don't want to stay in chase for too long. If a survivor is in a very safe area with lets say, 3 pallets. Try to get one of those pallets broken and leave them or Frenzy to get Killer Instinct to try to find the others.

    I do think they need some tweaks, but I think they're ok where he's at.

  • BunnyTheHuttBunnyTheHutt Member Posts: 855

    No. He is just a basic M1 killer and his power does nothing but locate survivors. You're not even guranteed a hit for finding multiple survivors if they spread out, so chases can take just as long as trapper.

  • SpitfireOrMichinaSpitfireOrMichina Member Posts: 197

    Totaly a basic M1 killer now. I could play it and main it, if the frenzy stun was less long, and vault speed faster...

  • IhatelifeIhatelife Member Posts: 3,465
    edited June 20

    They're kinda dead. I didn't see them when the ghostface comes out.

  • MewMew Member Posts: 411

    legions dead lmao, but hes in a better place than being outright toxic to even use though.

  • Andreyu44Andreyu44 Member Posts: 1,332

    I find it...IDK.. interesting(?) how The Legion gets stunned for 4 FRICKING SECONDS after using their useless power , while Billy gets stunned for 1 sec and Nurse for 2,5 (2 blinks)

  • vampire_toothyvampire_toothy Member Posts: 344


    I'm not sure if I would say if Legion is in a good place, but they most certainly are in a way healthier place ever since they did the changes to them. That being said, since the changes happened I've been able to play new legion a whole lot without feeling like crap over it which is great.

    However, I do think now that we've had these changes for a little while that Legion could do with some buffs and adjustments to their power as where it stands right now I feel the following issues ;

    • The power does not provide enough utility, tracking and making survivors have to mend is great but I feel like it just isn't enough especially if survivors never heal, I know that in a post I made recently I proposed a stackable movement speed bonus for each chained hit you get until your frenzy is over.
    • Cooldown feels way too long, even getting an adjustment to both the movement speed and time would be great if we couldn't get a straight up buff in this area as 4 seconds just feels awful.
    • Sometimes getting your power feels like it takes way too long, for something that isn't lethal it doesn't make a whole lot of sense that I lose 50% of my charge for hitting people with a basic M1 attack.
    • Vaulting feels super slow and I feel like I actively lose distance if I ever do vault which makes this a serious problem at strong loops.

    I think by them working on Legion in any of those areas would help put them in a good position as far as both strength and fun goes. However like I said earlier, I give credit to the devs for making Legion way healthier for the game now which was obviously a very good move to make.

  • miaasmamiaasma Member Posts: 911

    i find a lot of success with legion in low red ranks. i usually at least 2k provided the map isn't abysmal and all 4 survivors aren't gods (the latter of which hasn't happened since i've started playing this killer)

  • OakLestatOakLestat Member Posts: 125

    Worst Killer in the game, once Freddy rework comes out.

  • Nescau_FernandoNescau_Fernando Member Posts: 44

    In my opinion:

    High Tier: Old Legion (Frank's Mixtape)

    Mid Tier: Old Legion (Moonwalking)

    Low Tier: Old Legion (no Frank's, no Moonwalking), New Legion

    Old Legion with Frank's Mixtape would down Survivors in 3 Feral Frenzy hits. Pretty similar to Spirit in the sense that they could down with 2 power activations. High Mobility + High Lethality = High Tier.

    Old Legion without Frank's Mixtape could cheese the Deep Would timer by artificially cancelling the chase while still being there (Moonwalking, looking down etc.). There was no counter to this and the Survivor would go down, but it still took some time. High Mobility + Medium Lethality = Mid Tier.

    Old Legion without Frank's Mixtape or Moonwalking could still down a Survivor with 4 Feral Frenzy Hits. That took at least 3 power activations, making the power quite slow, but still lethal. High Mobility + Low Lethality = upper Low Tier.

    New Legion's mobility was somewhat sidegraded, but Feral Frezy lost its lethality, making it bottom of the Low Tier. New Legion's power grants you just an easy first hit. After that, you are a powerless pallet restricted M1 Killer. Similar to Wraith, Freddy, Pig etc...yikes.

  • FireHazardFireHazard Member, Trusted Posts: 3,897
    edited June 21

    @Th3Nightmare I'll give you my opinion on how Legion currently is. I P3-50'ed him 3 days into his official launch and played through the PTB with him as well.

    I've stuck with him, helped pioneer one of the most effective (or used to be his best build till he was changed) builds he's had, and people still use to this day... With minor tweaks here and there.

    How Legion stands right now, makes him sit right at Mid-Tier. This isn't a bad place to be, but if you were used to him beforehand he could very well have been Top-Tier in the right hands.

    Now, this may still be true... But he was way better before, even with the 4.4 Movement speed. This was because he had insane pressure to keep people mending, and had little downtime in this regard. While you still can do this, its much more difficult to pull off as one mistake and you'll cancel his power with a miss or a stun.

    People abused his OP add-ons like Franks Mixtape, the "looking down while following bug", and the double knife mend times. I never did this, as this wasn't the way to play him effectively. Sure, it was nice to insta down people in 2 hits, but that wasn't what made Legion... Legion.

    You can still do something as well that I do from time to time. Its called "force farming" and its where Legion can farm an entire team even if they don't want to farm. This is because of how easy it is to rack up points with Legion, and he's the best Killer in this department. Doctor can't even compare now, Legion can easily farm an entire team and if he 0k's will still get Brutal Killer because of this.

    But there are downsides, they nerfed his power into the dirt of course, changed add-ons that didn't even need to be changed, and got rid of a lot of aspects that made him a very unique "rush down killer."

    tl;dr

    A lot of aspects that made Legion, Legion were removed, and now he's a simple Mid-Tier M1 killer. He isn't unique anymore like he used to be, and probably never will be again.

    He's still pretty effective with getting tons of BPs though, and is still one of the best Killers to do this with. And in the right hands, can even be a Top-Tier Killer. Of course people who used him in the past like I did, adjusted to how he is now.

  • FireHazardFireHazard Member, Trusted Posts: 3,897

    @Blueberry For the majority of Players now yes, for people who have stuck with him since his beginnings like me, no.

    I can 3k-4k with him pretty often, and even if I 1k-2k which is rare with him at Red Ranks, I still come out with like 27k because of how much profit he can give you.

    He's Mid-Tier, but in the right hands he CAN be Top-Tier, sadly... This USED to be true, now he's a solid Mid-Tier Killer with some Aspects of a Top-Tier Killer that still show in some games.

  • GardeniaGardenia Member Posts: 1,052

    I'm sorry, but I disagree. I've played him since PTB as well. He's not fun to play for me anymore personally, simply because his power lacks lethality and it's also contradictive to his "rush down". Part of the addiction to playing legion for me was using FF fast in chase, the Parkour vaulting and freedom of mobility, to catch up to a survivor while in chase, coupled with some lethality that made you feel a sense of power. I'm not saying running Frank's mixtape and abusing add-ons, but the feeling that you could EVENTUALLY down them, made it fun. Now, you're just sluggish with a stall hit and his playstyle feels very one note and streamlined, and limited to the point where there's no uniqueness or variety in playstyle. Yes he's healthier, but very bland and boring.

  • SpaceCoconutSpaceCoconut Member Posts: 862

    While no one is ignoring your skill with the Legion, how often was it his power that made those wins for you?

    Could you accomplish the same with minimal use of his power or even without the use of his power at all?

    I'd be willing to bet that the impact of his power is negligible compared to your personal skill as a killer in those wins you've highlighted.

  • DreamnomadDreamnomad Member Posts: 1,910

    With a few tweaks, they could be pretty solid. The biggest change they need to do is extend the duration of their frenzy. The entire concept of the killer is built around the idea of hitting one survivor and then changing targets and going after another survivor. Then they are mending and healing instead of working gens.

    In and of itself, that isn't a terrible concept. But the underlying problem is that unless survivors are grouped very close together, you will run out of time before reaching the second target. This is just counter productive to the whole goal. If you try to play the killer the way that the devs envision them being played, you will find yourself slowing survivors from working on gens, but you won't stop them. (unless playing against potatoes)

    The other fundamental problem with the killer is that once you hit a survivor with Feral Frenzy, hitting them again does literally nothing. Nada. Zilch. So you can continue chasing after the survivor, but when you catch them the only thing to do is cancel your power which stuns you for a base duration of 4 seconds. So all that time you just spent catching back up to the survivor is pointless. You are seriously better off allowing the survivor to stun you out of frenzy than cancelling frenzy. 4 seconds is just too much time for the survivor to get to a safe loop or window and you are back to square one. The obvious solution is for them to lower that 4 second cooldown to something reasonable.

    If they did the following things, I think Legion would be in a really good place.

    1.) Increase base duration of Feral Frenzy by 3 seconds

    2.) Decrease cooldown of Feral Frenzy to 3.25 seconds

    3.) Add effect while in Feral Frenzy and hitting Deep Wounded survivor. 2 minutes broken status along with 20% decrease in all action speed.

    But as of right now, Legion is just a vanilla mid tier killer.

  • PhantomMask20763PhantomMask20763 Member Posts: 4,977

    He's just meh imo, I used to find them fun but now they just feel boring to play as. They were nerfed out of existence

  • miaasmamiaasma Member Posts: 911

    legion was fixed, not nerfed

  • HatCreatureHatCreature Member Posts: 3,089

    I don't enjoy playing Legion anymore, they're too slow and they intentionally took away the Speed add-ons and the difference hurts. Legion does not feel like the adrenaline fueled teenage Killers they used to be because their FF struggles to catch up to people so I don't have fun with them anymore.

    They made some good changes to Legion but other changes to the add-ons, the FF and Vault speed were not needed and ruined this character for me. I still play them because I love them but I don't have fun with them anymore.

  • TheluckyboiTheluckyboi Member Posts: 1,114
    edited June 21

    Hell no, coming form a legion main

    Everyone said "oh yes legion is better now" because they were tired of the exploiters and the crappy tactics of the legion players, they simply dont want legion to be that powerful again.

    He is really in a bad situation, while the deep wounds rework was perfectly fine, the nerfs to speed were not, i unironically run bamboozle on them because otherwise vaulting speed feels way too slow

    It is way too easy to 360 them now, the cooldown doesnt help at all and the fact that you lose all your power gauge when failing a hit is stupid.

    For me it is really sad that they had to get reworked because some idiots liked to have braindead games where they only needed to moonwalk and use franks mixtape to make everyone DC

    He is still really fun to play as and has a cool design, reason why i wont stop playing him

  • ReikoMoriReikoMori Member Posts: 1,245
    edited June 21

    Legion's got nothing that makes them feel special. Using their power is necessary hassle that the only real benefit for me is that it makes stacking STBFL go by faster. I bought Legion day one and I'm still playing him and trying to find prominent players that like them and play them. I've yet to find any. Tru3's put time into and made builds, but he does that for every killer. He's not necessarily into Legion though. I've spoken to Cahla, Tofu, Noob and the responses ranged from meh to "[BAD WORD] legion dude".

    The killer has never been in a good place. They were weak when they came out, but they made up for by being generally being different enough from other killers that it didn't really matter. Exploits ruined the play experience. Most players Legion players didn't even do them, but rather than fix the problem directly they felt the need to go very far.

    Playing Legion feels stale because most of the addons aren't really anything special or even useful. Being blinded for using the power for 4 seconds feels terrible to deal and cooldown addons getting nerfed just added salt to the wound. They took some much out of the killer, but put very little in its place. The pin addons would be great if they worked on the first frenzy hit. They said they are considering it, but after that its radio silence. They don't talk about Legion and it feels like they're just going to forget them and move on.

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