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https://forum.deadbydaylight.com/en/discussion/194208

Pallet Changes in the PTB

DukeJukemDukeJukem Member Posts: 114

Anyone else dislike the vacuum being removed? I don't mind it being removed based on a skill perspective. pallets are still easy to use when it comes to blocking the killers path and u technically can do 1 less loop with the change but.........the mind game is gone now. if the pallet isnt thrown down and the killer respects pallets then its just you two standing there.....which is boring and not fun. theres no running close to the pallet faking the killer out anymore and the killer no longer has to try to fake you out at pallets either. killers have to be bored of this change as well. rework the pallets in a different way and keep the vacuum. maybe lessen the vacuum range

Comments

  • ShadowpornShadowporn Member Posts: 27

    "These pallet changes are utter garbage! Now it just makes it easier for killers to avoid a survivor's mind game and either get a guaranteed hit on a survivor when swinging through pallets or they'll just respect pallets even harder, making sure a survivor has a 0% chance of getting a killer stun. Along with the current blood lust mechanic, these pallet changes are trash and should definitely NOT go live! And also, they seem to be bugged, because even when on the other side, I couldn't pull down the pallet in time. I figured out I needed to stop holding shift, and then I am able to pull it down.. while WALKING. But also, not always. Sometimes the killer was close enough to block the "pull down" prompt, which he can also do in the live version, but that's why we've got the vacuum. So if this one goes live, I'm out, I've been playing this game since it's release, and as a survivor main, I had to adapt to a lot of stuff, but this one, unfortunately, is a little too much combined with the window blocker and blood lust mechanics."
    -As seen on a previous post of mine.

    Glad someone else mentions something like that as well.

  • OutlandOutland Member Posts: 535

    I'm sorry you guys are having a hard time adapting to the new pallet mechanics, but I think they got it right. It possible again for the Killer to trade a survivor hit for a stun. And there is no ridiculous visual teleporting. I hope it goes in just like it is.

  • TheReptileManPhilTheReptileManPhil Member Posts: 7

    i hope these changes do go live, there is no mind games at pallets. its literally you have enduring and don't respect pallets at which the survivor will just keep pulling it down on you or the survivor doesn't know the timing in which you can trade. mostly its just brainlessly following the survivor around loops or leaving him to find a lesser player to pull all the pallets down.

  • YuhgYuhg Member Posts: 40
    edited May 2018

    these changes need to go live, first it's logical that you have to be on either one side or another of the pallet to throw it. Second it's not logical the amount of lifes saved by the vacuum, even when i first started playing survivor i just had to mash space in a loop, i mean, come on xd. Just get used to it, start using the brain instead of just going like "i'm on a loop so i'm 100% safe". I already had a few games as a survivor and got used to it pretty fast.Now instead of bullying the killer at pallets you have to respect him, that's all.

  • MarkthehallowMarkthehallow Member Posts: 1

    I personally agree that the pallet vacuum should be kept as it is in the test build and definitely go live, i honestly think it gives the killer a bit of an advantage for a change.

  • ToxicTappToxicTapp Member Posts: 63

    Anyone have a video of the pallet change? I have barely been able to see it, and when I was able too I was focused on escaping the chase.

  • NMCKENMCKE Member Posts: 7,287
    I love the new pallet changes because it's no longer a "Hey, I'm going to teleport to the other side and get a get out jail free card!" And I wished the developers can make some of the walls bigger to prevent you from seeing the killer during a pallet loop which adds more room to mind games (Not every loop but the longer loops should get this treatment)! 
  • RuniverRuniver Member Posts: 2,095

    The vacuum wasn't a mindgame, it was a cheese that allowed you to teleport away from a hit.
    You can see the hit coming up and, since the teleportation was instant, it was just a matter of REFLEX for the survivor to press space in time.
    It's not a mindgame. It was just a safety measure allowing you to get away from a hit, especially after extensive looping.

    Its removal reduce looping, and still get you room for mindgames against pallet respecting killers.

  • ShadowpornShadowporn Member Posts: 27

    @Runiver said:
    The vacuum wasn't a mindgame, it was a cheese that allowed you to teleport away from a hit.
    You can see the hit coming up and, since the teleportation was instant, it was just a matter of REFLEX for the survivor to press space in time.
    It's not a mindgame. It was just a safety measure allowing you to get away from a hit, especially after extensive looping.

    Its removal reduce looping, and still get you room for mindgames against pallet respecting killers.

    That's bullshit, you won't stand a chance against a killer who doesn't respect pallets at all, and additionally just goes from left to right and right to left all over again (stacking up blood lust) because he'll catch up faster and you won't even be able to get to the other side of the pallet, which is a safe hit for the killer.

  • RuniverRuniver Member Posts: 2,095

    @Shadowporn said:

    @Runiver said:
    The vacuum wasn't a mindgame, it was a cheese that allowed you to teleport away from a hit.
    You can see the hit coming up and, since the teleportation was instant, it was just a matter of REFLEX for the survivor to press space in time.
    It's not a mindgame. It was just a safety measure allowing you to get away from a hit, especially after extensive looping.

    Its removal reduce looping, and still get you room for mindgames against pallet respecting killers.

    That's bullshit, you won't stand a chance against a killer who doesn't respect pallets at all, and additionally just goes from left to right and right to left all over again (stacking up blood lust) because he'll catch up faster and you won't even be able to get to the other side of the pallet, which is a safe hit for the killer.

    The possible "bloodlust" issue is totally unrelated to my point tho.
    The vacuum wasn't a mindgame. At all.

    Also, most pallets are very safe before bloodlust 3.
    And if he simply goes back and forward, just stay around the pallet and don't move, he won't stack bloodlust as you only stack bloodlust against sprinting survivors, as killer, making the BL 3 stacking to be more than 1 min in order to get ONE hit, making it very time consuming for the killer.

  • Michael_MyersMichael_Myers Member Posts: 104

    @Runiver said:

    @Shadowporn said:

    @Runiver said:
    The vacuum wasn't a mindgame, it was a cheese that allowed you to teleport away from a hit.
    You can see the hit coming up and, since the teleportation was instant, it was just a matter of REFLEX for the survivor to press space in time.
    It's not a mindgame. It was just a safety measure allowing you to get away from a hit, especially after extensive looping.

    Its removal reduce looping, and still get you room for mindgames against pallet respecting killers.

    That's bullshit, you won't stand a chance against a killer who doesn't respect pallets at all, and additionally just goes from left to right and right to left all over again (stacking up blood lust) because he'll catch up faster and you won't even be able to get to the other side of the pallet, which is a safe hit for the killer.

    The possible "bloodlust" issue is totally unrelated to my point tho.
    The vacuum wasn't a mindgame. At all.

    Also, most pallets are very safe before bloodlust 3.
    And if he simply goes back and forward, just stay around the pallet and don't move, he won't stack bloodlust as you only stack bloodlust against sprinting survivors, as killer, making the BL 3 stacking to be more than 1 min in order to get ONE hit, making it very time consuming for the killer.

    Vacuum is basically a built in dead-hard survivors could exploit against killers. Now that this has been addressed, time to nerf ds into the ground like they did Freddy. It's only fair xD

  • LoupedLouped Member Posts: 6

    I have the Feeling the most People Killer and surivior missing the point. Alle killers always crying cause they dont get a 4K evry game and surivior dont need to escape evry game... I dont miss the Vacuum but the activation range off pallets feels sometimes to small u got to stay in the Pallets to activate them~
    And u still get to the wrong side soemtimes after using it so it was only a hard nerf for suriviors and the only positiv the devs tried to do for surivior still dont works ~ please fix before bringing it on live servers

  • ReshaosReshaos Member Posts: 40
    edited May 2018

    Let me preface my post by stating I do not care about the vacuum being removed. There are just issues in general with pallet interaction right now, specifically as a survivor.

    The pallet changes are absolutely terrible. There are times where you cannot just throw down the pallet. If you're going through a pallet then you're forced to constantly spam your space bar hoping one of your key strokes lands on that super delayed pallet prompt. There are times where you can stand in the exact middle of a pallet and get a prompt, then there are times where you will not get a prompt. It is extremely inconsistent.

    Now, let me explain how it affects game play.

    Scenario 1 (pallet saves): Let's say a teammate goes down under a pallet. The killer is forced to pick that survivor up and risk another survivor dropping that pallet saving their teammate. I just had a match where I was standing on the side of the pallet spamming my space bar looking for that prompt to come up and when it finally came up the killer was already out of the pallet range. That defeats the purpose of the killer having to take risks or ensuring he scoured the area before picking up under a pallet.

    Scenario 2 (looping): You are being chased by the killer and run to the nearest pallet loop. The very first thing a good rank 1 survivor does is "test" the killer to see if they respect pallets. This is where the mind games and outplay potential really comes in. This is what separates the good and bad killers/survivors. So what do you do? As you run through the loop you pause for a second as if to throw down the pallet, killer backs off, you immediately do another loop. You just punished (outplayed) the killer for respecting the pallet. If the killer would've just swung through it would've been a free hit on the survivor because that's the risk the survivor took to get that extra loop out of that one pallet. Now you go for the next loop. Do you drop it now? Or does the killer think he won't do that a 2nd time. Respected again. That's an extra free loop for the survivor, again, because the killer made the wrong choice. This is that mind game between the survivor and killer at rank 1. Each one (killer and survivor here) has to take a risk. Sometimes that risk pays off and sometimes it doesn't for both sides.

    Now let's take a different but more specific type of pallet loop (still on scenario 2 here). The unsafe pallet that you find on cold wind farms where its usually a single tree on one side and a trailer full of hay on the other. The killer just has to walk around the tree and easily hit you. He doesn't have to walk through the pallet. This is another set of those mind games between the killer and survivor. You, as a good survivor, know you cannot just drop that pallet if the killer isn't close enough. So you have to fake the drop again, kind of like you're testing the killers respect for pallets, but this time you cannot run because its an unsafe pallet that you cannot loop. So you stay then run back as the killer runs around the tree. Now its the typical killer is running around an object and the survivor is pallet jumping desperately from one side to the other, expect the pallet hasn't been dropped yet.You, as the survivor, is just swaying back and forth like the killer. The killer goes for the slice and boom drop the pallet, get the stun, now you just turned that unsafe pallet into a safe one.

    The current PTB pallet changes do not allow for anything I described in scenario 2. The extremely delayed, inconsistent, and clunky pallet interaction completely breaks that. You can no longer guarantee that you can drop the pallet at a moments notice due to you trying to find some ambiguous sweet spot around the pallet. The potential to outplay has been removed and is now entirely linear. Circle around the pallet, killer near? Drop the pallet and run for the next loop. Repeat until you go down. Completely mindless and boring.

    Again, I am not looking to keep vacuum pallets. I am looking to bring back immediate and consistent pallet interaction. I, as a survivor, shouldn't be fumbling around trying to drop a pallet when not moving. I shouldn't have to constantly spam my space bar in hopes of hitting the sweet spot to drop the pallet. I want the mind games and outplay potential to remain in the game too. This constant battle of the wits and what move are you going to make and how I will react to be in the game too. This game needs more skillful decision making, not more linear.

    And yes, I do play killer too. However, I play majority survivor. I won't sit here and pretend like some of the killer mains posting acting like they are a survivor main stating they love the pallet changes. I mostly play hill billy, but also love playing the wraith. There are days where I just want to play killer only so, yes, I know the killer pains. That doesn't mean the game needs to become even more linear for killer though. Again, I mostly play survivor though.

  • sorrowensorrowen Member Posts: 742
    Louped said:

    I have the Feeling the most People Killer and surivior missing the point. Alle killers always crying cause they dont get a 4K evry game and surivior dont need to escape evry game... I dont miss the Vacuum but the activation range off pallets feels sometimes to small u got to stay in the Pallets to activate them~
    And u still get to the wrong side soemtimes after using it so it was only a hard nerf for suriviors and the only positiv the devs tried to do for surivior still dont works ~ please fix before bringing it on live servers

    I’m not crying I’m not getting a 4k but I do have a issue with looping and gen fix times. Can’t be expected to even get a 2k without ruin. I like the pallet changes though it makes going for them not a outright safe bet.
  • TradebaronTradebaron Member Posts: 135
    Thing is the pallet vacuum wasn't intended design. They realized that it was an animation issue and technically a product of a bug, not because it's great tactical game design.
  • NeskaNeska Member Posts: 132

    My only complaint so far is, that the pallets feel very weird and delayed.. I often die because I don't run through them but wait for the killer at that pallet and when he's there I can't throw it while standing there, I have to move in that pallet and out of it again to actually throw it.. additional to that it feels like the pallet isn't that smooth while running through & throwing it and I get often a hit while throwing them or I'm stuck for a 0.5 seconds because of the animation.. I have to problem with the fact that the vacuum is gone but as I said it doesn't feel smooth and I hope they do a little rework on that

  • ReshaosReshaos Member Posts: 40
    edited June 2018

    @Neska said:
    My only complaint so far is, that the pallets feel very weird and delayed.. I often die because I don't run through them but wait for the killer at that pallet and when he's there I can't throw it while standing there, I have to move in that pallet and out of it again to actually throw it.. additional to that it feels like the pallet isn't that smooth while running through & throwing it and I get often a hit while throwing them or I'm stuck for a 0.5 seconds because of the animation.. I have to problem with the fact that the vacuum is gone but as I said it doesn't feel smooth and I hope they do a little rework on that

    I feel the exact same way. You feel like an absolute snail going through the pallet now. I decided to do some investigation as to why I think pallets feel so clunky (see my post above). Check out my video (its 36 seconds) and take note of when I have the sprint button held down and when it is not, especially watch as I stand in the middle and the prompt disappears (its because I pushed and held the sprint button down):

    Notice how you can drop the pallet when you're two feet away from it when walking? Now notice the huge delay when sprinting toward the pallet. That's why it feels clunky.

    It should be worth noting that you cannot throw down the pallet if you do not get the prompt. You can go to a pallet, stand in the middle, get the prompt, now hold down sprint, watch as the prompt disappears, now spam your space bar and notice the pallet doesn't drop.

    Post edited by Reshaos on
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