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Unpopular opinion but survivor has a higher skill ceiling than most killers



  • NekooNekoo Member Posts: 133

    Comparing omegablink to SWF with toolbox,

    but not comparing base-kit nurse to SWF at red rank in general LMFAO?

    The community mostly agreed base-kit nurse was fine, it was her add-ons that need to be dealt with, in fact, if you put 4man SWF with no items against base-kit nurse, SWF will win most of the time.

    But sure, compare that base-kit nurse to that 0.01% SWF toolbox team, cuz they are equal.

    Who's being nonsense here?

  • MochanMochan Member Posts: 2,886

    How many I win as killer depends on which killer I play. But generally (this is a ballpark number) I can win about 3 out of 5 games as killer at the lower ranks (I do not play high ranks). By "Win" I define that as killing 3 or more survivors. I consider 2 kills a "draw" and not a "win."

    Not sure what that has to do with anything, but that's how it looks when I play killer.

    Also I have never personally attacked you per se. I attack whiny killer mains with a victim complex. Not you personally. If you felt you were being attacked it's because you were affected by the arguments I make.

    I do agree that the whiny people tend to be the ones who make mistakes. In fact, you know someone made a mistake when they post about it here on this board. People complaining about something usually is a clear indicator that they just lost to it. And I myself admit this. I'm not god survivor I get stomped all the time.

    Also I have never once said that killers are OP. That's simply your bias interpreting everything I say with a killer-hating slant simply because I'm a survivor main.

    If you actually read what I say I have never once said Killers are OP. And in fact I'm more of a centrist and I fight against extremists who think too much one side or the other.

    People who say "Killers are weak Survivors are the Power Role Killers only win if Survivors make mistakes" qualify in my view as extremists who are just too killer-sided and not seeing the game as a whole.

  • KycerKycer Member Posts: 337

    Nah.. imo killer requires more skill. And the only reason why killers get destroyed in the red ranks is because gen rushing is a thing.

  • immortalls96immortalls96 Member Posts: 4,652

    Lol despite tha fact that your entire argument falls apart when numbers and design are taken into account but hey..you do you

  • EndstilleEndstille Member Posts: 2,246
    edited November 2019

    So explain to me why that is dumb logic, should be entertaining, coming from someone who advocates nerfs on bbq because he thinks the perk is op.

    Someone who sincerely proposed to "distortion" to have unlimited charges not even knowing about OoO. Entertain me again about NOED and how it punishes genrushing.

    The only sad thing is that you have 0 clue on how this game looks when you play 4 man swf with decently skilled survivors and why it is so infuriating that people like you beg for nerfs on killers that actually enrich the skillcap of survivors to more than looping. While they make outright lies about killers not having counterplay while there are tournaments showing that there is.

    Post edited by Rizzo on
  • BenZ0BenZ0 Member Posts: 4,125

    Spirit has a high skill ceilling too, pretty much at the level of huntress. I only saw 1 good spirit in all my 2k hours in dbd (pc). All the rest use stridor or are just decent and only knows the basic. None of them dont even know why wakizachi saya is good for and much more things like that. No good husk blocks, always using 100% of the phasewalk in chase, predict really bad and cant even hear healthy survivors or the different ground noices from foodstebs (yeah you can hear wooden grounds louder then normal ground). There are ton more things you should know on spirit.

    But I agree, overall survivor has a higher skill ceilling in chase, but you still dont need to be good in chases because rushing gens is the most effective and easiest strategy.

  • GrootDudeGrootDude Member Posts: 14,112

    I’ve actually found a lot of good spirits but no stridor Spirits.

  • oxygenoxygen Member Posts: 2,889

    There's a lot of horribly unfair stereotypes about the skill requirements on both sides. Billy has an incredibly low skill floor as he's very easy to pick up and play compared to some other strong killers, but stuff like curving during the initial high sensitivity at the start of a chainsaw charge is something that'll take a while to get good at, and even more to get close to mastering it. Obviously the killers relying on unique mechanics like Nurse, Huntress, Hax and indeed Spirit are generally more tricky as you often can't fall back on regular M1 chasing (which in itself isn't as "just put on enduring and spirit fury and then bloodlust 4Head" as some megaminds claim)

    Same for survivor. So much "just run in circles 4Head", but that's more because it's a common thing in games to undervalue types of skill that aren't explicitly mechanical and "flashy". Hitting a crazy hatchet as Huntress is a lot more flashy and impressive to a random observer than knowing how to run all the variations of every tile, and how to combine them in an effective way. Doesn't matter if you hate good loopers or even the fact looping exists for whatever reason - it's still a skill that's part of what seperates bad, good and excellent survivors. And that's without even thinking of actions that involve more than one survivor, teamplay in other words.

    It's not much different than the elitism you see in some games from people that play stuff like sniper/other aim-intensive characters/classes when they look down upon people playing support characters. I'd know, I used to be one of those snobby TF2 sniper mains that thought every other class was super easy ... until I actually started playing them. And there's a lot of these "softer" skills in all sorts of killer play too.

  • RizzoRizzo Member, Administrator, Mod Posts: 13,810

    Please try to tone down the discussion, there's really no need to attack others over a different opinion, try to be respectful.

  • FriendlyGuyFriendlyGuy Member Posts: 2,768

    It's the truth. Not an unpopular opinion.

  • whammigobambamwhammigobambam Member Posts: 1,168

    This is why lower tier killers keep falling to the wayside. The ceiling can be quite low.

  • NekooNekoo Member Posts: 133

    You don't need BNP at red rank to dominate the game, if you need that, you're pretty bad in the game.

    Simply Green Toolbox, 4man swf with comm is already insanely OP at rank 1,

    and the survivor rate for red rank swf is always above 50%, wdym "well below" 50% LMFAO?

    you trying to make me laugh? where did you get that

    And killers getting more resources? they also need to level up EACH killers to play it,

    while survivors are just skins, you aren't bound to level up all characters.

    reject your argument? look at your laughable logic first.

  • SaintDenisSlasherSaintDenisSlasher Member Posts: 227

    Look im not trying to be an ahole but as a current purple killer and green survivor I feel i might just be less biased than someone who describes themselves as survivor who complains and posts about something they lose to AND only plays low rank killer

    Im serious, try to get higher rank as killer and i think your whole mentally will change because if you're playing in low ranks its just kids and noobs. Get to AT LEAST green. Because as it stands i don't know how you can attack a side of the game so aggressively when you have no experience with it. It's not extremist to say survivor has the advantage its just reality. It doesn't mean killers are helpless, ive gotten like a 10 4k streak, and i can't remember the last game where i didn't get at least one kill. But i also think of myself as a pretty high skill killer, and a pretty lame survivor. But i know how easy and fast it is to win if you just do gens and are able to run the killer around. It also made me a better killer because i learned how easy it is to hide around gens and have a better game sense of where people will be

    So if you start playing killer it will give you a better understanding of a killers perspective, give your critiques more weight, AND probably make you a better survivor in the process. There's literally no down side!

  • PolarBearPolarBear Member Posts: 1,899

    You have to bind the look left and look right from the arrow keys to q and e. This also means you'll have to rebind the active ability button to something else.

  • aregularplayeraregularplayer Member Posts: 906

    Another point for survivor is: you have to be good against all killers. Let me explain: you never know what to expect from a match, what killer is coming, you have to be good against all of them knowing common mind games and plays of all killers.

    Killers always know what they are facing and they can main one single killer and destroy everyone playing this single killer over and over again.

  • justarandyjustarandy Member Posts: 1,711

    Agree, I hate when people say Billy is pisseasy. These are probably the people who only use m2 to travel the map and M1 for survivors.

  • AcculllaAccullla Member Posts: 984

    It really depends on how you play him. If you only backrev people and otherwise use basic hits at pallets/windows, then yes, Billy is a pretty easy killer. Strong and very consistent in a chase, but pretty boring to play. However, once you start curving your chainsaw around pallets and loops, that's when you open up an insane amount of potential in exchange for a really steep learning curve.

    On the plus side, whenever you manage to pull off a good curve, you'll almost always get a hit, because most survivors will never think they can get hit from a particular position position.

    The downside is that whilst you're learning you'll get stomped consistently, because you'll spend most of your time bumping into objects due to the amount precision required to pull off consistent curves.

    This includes knowing exactly when to start revving your chainsaw in any position on each tile, consistently keeping the charge at 99 without letting it go down too far or popping it by accident, learning the exact amount you need to turn your mouse (analogue stick) to perform a certain degree rotation and knowing exactly when you need to start turning after the initial run begins.

    All of that requires a lot of practice, however most people don't even try to learn, because the killer is strong enough even without utilising the power to it's fullest potential. That's why people fail to appreciate billy's high skill cap - because it's not required to reach it in order to perform well.

  • premiumRICEpremiumRICE Member Posts: 798

    If u are playing at high ranks and with both skilled sides there is a LOT involved from both sides.

  • DCh4rlieDCh4rlie Member Posts: 62

    The definition of "skill" is very blurry, isn't it?

    I mean doesn't it take as much/not less skill to perform good on a killer that naturally has a weaker kit (e.g. Wraith), than playing the strongest killer in the game?

  • thrawn3054thrawn3054 Member Posts: 5,283

    I'm saying both sides have deal with 4 other people. So that can't be used as an argument for how much skill either side takes.

  • Alice_pbgAlice_pbg Member Posts: 5,067

    Not exactly... it's a different skillset.

    An amazing wraith doesn't transfer a lot of it's skills to nurse for instance.

    Same for trapper and hag. You both set traps but you're going about it differently and with a somewhat different goal. Very rarely a trapper and hag would put a trap in the same spot.

    Billy and bubba have different situations when they would use their chainsaw.

    Huntress and clown both use projectiles but is there anyone who would say they have similar skillsets?

  • dinocat2dinocat2 Member Posts: 23

    Can confirm, playing clown today, and I managed to mind game someone and I would’ve gotten the hit had I not had the bottle out, the survivor got to the pallet and the chase continued for too long and I lost a ton of pressure. Sometimes killers just potato, even if you’ve made it to red ranks

  • dinocat2dinocat2 Member Posts: 23

    Exactly this. Sometimes I’ll pull off Mindgames where it wasn’t necessarily that the survivor did anything wrong, they just did what they could with the confusing and inconsistent info they had. I’m much more of a potato at survivor but from what I’ve seen, very few people on both sides don’t make mistakes.

    Also, the whole “survivors control the flow of the game” is another thing they spout. While it’s true that survivors can dictate it, that’s only when you’ve lost pressure to the point where the gen progress is out of your hands, which happens if the killer isn’t doing well. Which again, comes down to the killer’s performance, and less so the survivor’s.

  • White_OwlWhite_Owl Member Posts: 3,736

    I wouldn't say higher, but at least equal. I'm thinking about high rank play, but both solo survivors and low tier killers need to manage 4 other people without knowing exactly what they're doing, so they have to think about a ton of things to be successful. The main difference is that as a survivor all those 4 people could be trying to kill you.

  • BongbingbingBongbingbing Member Posts: 1,423

    You're basing this on Low rank gameplay? Of course Killers will do well against survivors who don't know who to play, Once survivors learn how to play the game becomes much more relaxed.

    What you should be doing is taking all ranks into consideration. Survivor is quite easy to get the hang of, Killer on the other hand can seem easy at low ranks but as soon as you start to face these survivors who know what they're doing it becomes much more difficult.

    Survivors have it harder in the beginning but overall Killers have a much higher skill ceiling in my opinion.

  • BirdmanOwOBirdmanOwO Member Posts: 43

    If you want to learn every Killer, there is a higher skill ceiling since you have to adapt to their playstyle, find out good perks and, as you said, that includes more challenging Killers like Nurse and Hag, especially Nurse since she plays almost completely different than other Killers.

  • TooKoolFoUTooKoolFoU Member Posts: 378

    I realize you don’t want to go very in depth so feel free not too as I don’t either. However, as I was reading the original post from I was thinking of how I agreed with him/her that some killers do not have as high as a skill cap due to idea of hillbilly. I personally do not play hill billy anymore because of the fact that I feel he is too easy to play. I don’t think he is that easy for everybody but I find his skill cap is much lower than a survivors. I play Console these days so my opinion could possibly be irrelevant to degree. I never played with a keyboard on pc back in the day anyway

  • darktrixdarktrix Member Posts: 1,790
    edited November 2019

    I like to say, rather than comparing skill ceiling is that - killers have to do a lot, survivors have to know a lot.

    I once made a list concerning survivors, but just to mention a few - not only do they need to know everything a killer does in order to do well in chases like looping or hiding; they need to know things like dealing with hex totems, killer perks like bbq, making good saves, best use of items and add-on (like flashlights), how to deal with the mechanics and add-ons for 15+ killers, choosing the right gens to do, map layouts for safe vs. dead areas, etc.

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