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My take on the Q&A 3.

2

Comments

  • SirFrancelotSirFrancelot Member Posts: 30

    @Runiver All I can say is I agree with everything you said. Have a good day :).

  • TroylusTroylus Member Posts: 40
    edited August 2018

    Good Insights, OP.

    I can see why the devs want to nerf BL - because of the technical issues created by such a big speed discrepancy between survivors and killer. But this nerf seems to undo the reasons for having it in the game as a "safety valve" to cut short endless chases in the first place.

    Personally, I think that the BL nerfs could work if the speeds were reduced, but the times to achieve each BL level were significantly reduced - maybe about half: 9 seconds to BL1, 18 to BL2, and 27 for BL 3. You'd end up with the same BL2 we see now happening three seconds earlier - but no overpowered current BL3 potential.

    Seems like a reasonable tradeoff to me.

  • DelfadorDelfador Member Posts: 2,553

    Kindred is much more powerful than most people think. The reason why it is not being seen as a powerful perk is because not all of the survivors use it in a match.

    Survivors can say that the killer side also has got powerful aura reading perks recently but the killers need to sacrifice a perk slot for that. For bitter murmur which perk slot should I give up? BBQ? Whispers? NOED? Bamboozle? Enduring? Brutal strength? Ruin? I am not saying that kindred should be removed, what I am saying is that if you don't like getting camped then use it and sacrifice a perk slot for that, give up your sprint burst, selfcare, adrenaline, borrowed time, bond, urban evasion or iron will.

    Survivors get something really cheap while killers need to make sacrifices constantly.

    I am okay with pallet changes tbh. I think that the game should be more responsive both for the killers and the survivors.

  • TsulanTsulan Member Posts: 12,687

    @deadwolfwalking said:
    "We know SWF is unbalaned. We're gonna fix it. We're gonna balance SWF by making solo play just as effective. See? We need 4 ppl happy to play and one miserable bastard to host em. We ******* hate killers " - DBD dev team 2018

    It´s always about the survivors fun. If survivors complain that something is unfun, devs nerf it (Freddy)
    If a killer says that it´s not fun to play killer, devs tell him to play survivor or civ.

  • DelfadorDelfador Member Posts: 2,553

    @Tsulan said:

    @deadwolfwalking said:
    "We know SWF is unbalaned. We're gonna fix it. We're gonna balance SWF by making solo play just as effective. See? We need 4 ppl happy to play and one miserable bastard to host em. We ******* hate killers " - DBD dev team 2018

    It´s always about the survivors fun. If survivors complain that something is unfun, devs nerf it (Freddy)
    If a killer says that it´s not fun to play killer, devs tell him to play survivor or civ.

    Then they get spanked by survivors as they try to get a single hook with hag. It is just sad. Maybe they are the ones who need to play civ.

  • WarmbeanoWarmbeano Member Posts: 10

    @Tsulan said:
    The BL nerf will remove all mind games. The fact that the killer had to reach BL3 to get a hit on the survivor, just shows how unbalanced the whole looping mechanic is. If the killer wasn´t able to get a hit with the old BL2 for 15 seconds, he won´t get a hit with the new BL3. Survivors will just loop the killer indefinitely and call it skill.

    Why the hell would you waste all the time to get to bloodlust 3 when you can easily just break the pallet which takes less time?

  • WarmbeanoWarmbeano Member Posts: 10
    edited August 2018

    @Tsulan said:

    @Warmbeano said:

    @Tsulan said:
    The BL nerf will remove all mind games. The fact that the killer had to reach BL3 to get a hit on the survivor, just shows how unbalanced the whole looping mechanic is. If the killer wasn´t able to get a hit with the old BL2 for 15 seconds, he won´t get a hit with the new BL3. Survivors will just loop the killer indefinitely and call it skill.

    Why the hell would you waste all the time to get to bloodlust 3 when you can easily just break the pallet which takes less time?

    Because in the time it takes to break one pallet, the survivor has already reached the next pallet and the loop starts again.

    It takes more time to bloodlust someone around a really safe pallet then to go around different loops you might aswell break it and move to the next one you will waste less time

  • TsulanTsulan Member Posts: 12,687

    @Warmbeano said:

    @Tsulan said:

    @Warmbeano said:

    @Tsulan said:
    The BL nerf will remove all mind games. The fact that the killer had to reach BL3 to get a hit on the survivor, just shows how unbalanced the whole looping mechanic is. If the killer wasn´t able to get a hit with the old BL2 for 15 seconds, he won´t get a hit with the new BL3. Survivors will just loop the killer indefinitely and call it skill.

    Why the hell would you waste all the time to get to bloodlust 3 when you can easily just break the pallet which takes less time?

    Because in the time it takes to break one pallet, the survivor has already reached the next pallet and the loop starts again.

    It takes more time to bloodlust someone around a really safe pallet then to go around different loops you might aswell break it and move to the next one you will waste less time

    Then you break this pallet, then the next one, the one after that and after 30+ pallets you finally realize that you are alone on the map.

    Yes, it´s unaviodable to break some pallets. But on some spots it might be better to get BL instead of breaking every pallet.

  • TsulanTsulan Member Posts: 12,687

    @TheXenoborg said:

    @Tsulan said:

    @Warmbeano said:

    @Tsulan said:

    @Warmbeano said:

    @Tsulan said:
    The BL nerf will remove all mind games. The fact that the killer had to reach BL3 to get a hit on the survivor, just shows how unbalanced the whole looping mechanic is. If the killer wasn´t able to get a hit with the old BL2 for 15 seconds, he won´t get a hit with the new BL3. Survivors will just loop the killer indefinitely and call it skill.

    Why the hell would you waste all the time to get to bloodlust 3 when you can easily just break the pallet which takes less time?

    Because in the time it takes to break one pallet, the survivor has already reached the next pallet and the loop starts again.

    It takes more time to bloodlust someone around a really safe pallet then to go around different loops you might aswell break it and move to the next one you will waste less time

    Then you break this pallet, then the next one, the one after that and after 30+ pallets you finally realize that you are alone on the map.

    Yes, it´s unaviodable to break some pallets. But on some spots it might be better to get BL instead of breaking every pallet.

    Why are survivors still giving redundant advice from 2016 like, "just break the pallet", "just use BS", "just chase someone else". It doesn't work and it never will. Honestly.

    At this point i honestly don´t know if they don´t know better, or if they simply troll.

  • thesuicidefoxthesuicidefox Member Posts: 8,227

    @brokedownpalace said:
    Can't believe people are legit complaining about unhook cancelling and not being able to hit a survivor who can't move. You will ADAPT and GET GOOD. 

    LOL right? It's like "Oh no the survivor can actually dodge my hit that was completely free before, how will I ever get a kill now?" Maybe don't camp hooks? Maybe don't tunnel a single person all game? Maybe focus on emblems and not on kills?

    I've had a few games over the past few days where I only managed to get 1 measly kill but still managed to pip because I had iri chaser and stuff like that. It's also really REALLY hard to depip as killer compared to survivor. I can have a truly crappy killer game and still safety quite easily. Survivor though, you can have a really good game and still not pip because of some BS usually related to Benevolence. Case and point, I had a game against a Clown yesterday where I play decently and escaped, but literally 2 seconds before I ran out the gate he hooked someone and I lost -10 Benevolence, which made me lose a single emblem point and I just missed out on a pip. It was quite BS IMO, since she was dead anyway (second hook basement IIRC), but because I didn't leave fast enough I only got a safety. If I ran out 2 seconds sooner I woulda pipped. That sort thing has never happened to me as killer, you almost have to purposely try to depip.

  • Mister_HoldoutMister_Holdout Member Posts: 3,144

    I think your analysis is spot on Runiver.

    My question is when are the devs going to do something about these ridiculous loops survivors still have?

    Seems to me like you should address these problems first before you go suggesting what the devs just did. Or, at the very least, handle it all at one time.

  • ChesterTheMolesterChesterTheMolester Member Posts: 2,771

    I think your analysis is spot on Runiver.

    My question is when are the devs going to do something about these ridiculous loops survivors still have?

    Seems to me like you should address these problems first before you go suggesting what the devs just did. Or, at the very least, handle it all at one time.

    Mclean mentioned on Twitter that many loops will like Fractured Cowshed will be removed/nerfed.

    If that is the case i will accept the BL nerf.
  • RuniverRuniver Member Posts: 2,095

    @ChesterTheMolester said:
    Mister_Holdout said:

    I think your analysis is spot on Runiver.

    My question is when are the devs going to do something about these ridiculous loops survivors still have?

    Seems to me like you should address these problems first before you go suggesting what the devs just did. Or, at the very least, handle it all at one time.

    Mclean mentioned on Twitter that many loops will like Fractured Cowshed will be removed/nerfed.

    If that is the case i will accept the BL nerf.

    Yes, if they actually remove some windows "hard" loops (the ones you cannot counter because survivors consistently have vision on you, while the vault spot remains super strong), then BL can easily go away for sure, as it's not a very healthy mecanic when it comes to pallets, especially with Bloodlust 3.
    Bloodlust 3 speed just need to go at some point as it's just a cheese and a rather toxic way to lock a survivor on a juking spot with 0 ways for him to get off of it.

  • TsulanTsulan Member Posts: 12,687

    @Runiver said:

    @ChesterTheMolester said:
    Mister_Holdout said:

    I think your analysis is spot on Runiver.

    My question is when are the devs going to do something about these ridiculous loops survivors still have?

    Seems to me like you should address these problems first before you go suggesting what the devs just did. Or, at the very least, handle it all at one time.

    Mclean mentioned on Twitter that many loops will like Fractured Cowshed will be removed/nerfed.

    If that is the case i will accept the BL nerf.

    Yes, if they actually remove some windows "hard" loops (the ones you cannot counter because survivors consistently have vision on you, while the vault spot remains super strong), then BL can easily go away for sure, as it's not a very healthy mecanic when it comes to pallets, especially with Bloodlust 3.
    Bloodlust 3 speed just need to go at some point as it's just a cheese and a rather toxic way to lock a survivor on a juking spot with 0 ways for him to get off of it.

    My prediction:

    • more nurse player
    • gens get done as fast in solo as they do in swf
    • killers will struggle to rank up because of how short the games are
    • long survivor ques for october (seems to be a tradition)
  • RepliCantRepliCant Member Posts: 1,436
    edited August 2018

    I appreciate how well you worded your opinions. Nice read.

    I don't care enough for the proposed changes, as a solo queuer I can't complain because it definitely helps with our balance but sadly SWF balance should be more focused than us solo queues.

    Since it'll be in the PTB, once I experience the changes perhaps I'll form a real opinion.

    Edit: I don't like the proposed BL changes though. I thought BL is well needed in the state it's in for Killers.

  • MasterMaster Member Posts: 10,200
    Tsulan said:

    @TheXenoborg said:
    They better add AI killers once they add in-built Kindred.

    The tutorial lvl already has AI killers. Now they only need to show them how to run in circles and they are good to go.

    Tsulan said:

    @TheXenoborg said:
    They better add AI killers once they add in-built Kindred.

    The tutorial lvl already has AI killers. Now they only need to show them how to run in circles and they are good to go.

    They better be working hard on the killer Ai,  otherwise survivors won't have anyone to bull soon
  • TsulanTsulan Member Posts: 12,687

    @Master said:
    Tsulan said:

    @TheXenoborg said:

    They better add AI killers once they add in-built Kindred.

    The tutorial lvl already has AI killers. Now they only need to show them how to run in circles and they are good to go.


    Tsulan said:

    @TheXenoborg said:

    They better add AI killers once they add in-built Kindred.

    The tutorial lvl already has AI killers. Now they only need to show them how to run in circles and they are good to go.

    They better be working hard on the killer Ai,  otherwise survivors won't have anyone to bull soon

    This october will be hot. Just grab some popcorn and enjoy the show.

  • LaakeriLaakeri Member Posts: 835
    edited August 2018

    @se05239 said:
    Most of these changes feel like emergency killer nerfing to help calm down the survivor masses who's bombarding the game with negative reviews after their minuscule exhaustion "nerf".

    Devs went full Freddy even tho they said they will never go full Freddy again.

    Exhaustion nerf had barely any effect in r1 as gens still get done in 5 mins.

  • TsulanTsulan Member Posts: 12,687

    @SovererignKing said:
    se05239 said:

    Most of these changes feel like emergency killer nerfing to help calm down the survivor masses who's bombarding the game with negative reviews after their minuscule exhaustion "nerf".

    It basically is. It’s another knee jerk reaction by the developers. 

    The problem is that the developers are trying to balance by taking one step forward with Killers, then one step forward with Survivors. Problem is that Survivors are ALREADY 2-3 steps ahead of Killers. The developers need to leave the Survivors alone and focus on the Killers. 

    Map Balance for Killers first, then Bloodlust. Ect. 

    But survivors don´t believe that. They think killers are OP (especially Freddy) and that even the slightest nerf is unjustified. Then they review bomb and make fun of killers that complain about serious issues.

  • TsulanTsulan Member Posts: 12,687

    @Hillbilly420 said:

    @Tsulan said:

    @SovererignKing said:
    se05239 said:

    Most of these changes feel like emergency killer nerfing to help calm down the survivor masses who's bombarding the game with negative reviews after their minuscule exhaustion "nerf".

    It basically is. It’s another knee jerk reaction by the developers. 

    The problem is that the developers are trying to balance by taking one step forward with Killers, then one step forward with Survivors. Problem is that Survivors are ALREADY 2-3 steps ahead of Killers. The developers need to leave the Survivors alone and focus on the Killers. 

    Map Balance for Killers first, then Bloodlust. Ect. 

    But survivors don´t believe that. They think killers are OP (especially Freddy) and that even the slightest nerf is unjustified. Then they review bomb and make fun of killers that complain about serious issues.

    Survivor mains and fake Survivor mains (you know, "those" guys who claim they play Survivor/Killer equally but always say "Well, I think Freddy was OP and needed the nerfs." Or "Blood Lodge doesn't have that many pallets. Killers need to git gud." One of those guys) are some stupidest people I have ever come across in any community. The mental gymnastics these guys go through to somehow convince themselves that running around a piece of level geometry is difficult is astonishing.

    Running in circles clearly requires a lot of skill. I wonder what would happen if survivors and killers had suddenly the same hitbox. Probably review armageddon.

  • RuniverRuniver Member Posts: 2,095

    @Tsulan said:

    @Runiver said:

    @ChesterTheMolester said:
    Mister_Holdout said:

    I think your analysis is spot on Runiver.

    My question is when are the devs going to do something about these ridiculous loops survivors still have?

    Seems to me like you should address these problems first before you go suggesting what the devs just did. Or, at the very least, handle it all at one time.

    Mclean mentioned on Twitter that many loops will like Fractured Cowshed will be removed/nerfed.

    If that is the case i will accept the BL nerf.

    Yes, if they actually remove some windows "hard" loops (the ones you cannot counter because survivors consistently have vision on you, while the vault spot remains super strong), then BL can easily go away for sure, as it's not a very healthy mecanic when it comes to pallets, especially with Bloodlust 3.
    Bloodlust 3 speed just need to go at some point as it's just a cheese and a rather toxic way to lock a survivor on a juking spot with 0 ways for him to get off of it.

    My prediction:

    • more nurse player
    • gens get done as fast in solo as they do in swf
    • killers will struggle to rank up because of how short the games are
    • long survivor ques for october (seems to be a tradition)

    Possibly. Might be the case if all the changes they put on the PTB go live even if people on the forums do not agree with it, similarly to the exhaustion change. I doubt the majority was for that change, and wanted more of a sprint burst change instead.

    I doubt it will be that hard to rank up, but as usual, it won't be due to the killer's skill, but rather to the survivor's stupidity and ability to make a shitload of mistakes.

    @Tsulan said:

    @Hillbilly420 said:

    @Tsulan said:

    @SovererignKing said:
    se05239 said:

    Most of these changes feel like emergency killer nerfing to help calm down the survivor masses who's bombarding the game with negative reviews after their minuscule exhaustion "nerf".

    It basically is. It’s another knee jerk reaction by the developers. 

    The problem is that the developers are trying to balance by taking one step forward with Killers, then one step forward with Survivors. Problem is that Survivors are ALREADY 2-3 steps ahead of Killers. The developers need to leave the Survivors alone and focus on the Killers. 

    Map Balance for Killers first, then Bloodlust. Ect. 

    But survivors don´t believe that. They think killers are OP (especially Freddy) and that even the slightest nerf is unjustified. Then they review bomb and make fun of killers that complain about serious issues.

    Survivor mains and fake Survivor mains (you know, "those" guys who claim they play Survivor/Killer equally but always say "Well, I think Freddy was OP and needed the nerfs." Or "Blood Lodge doesn't have that many pallets. Killers need to git gud." One of those guys) are some stupidest people I have ever come across in any community. The mental gymnastics these guys go through to somehow convince themselves that running around a piece of level geometry is difficult is astonishing.

    Running in circles clearly requires a lot of skill. I wonder what would happen if survivors and killers had suddenly the same hitbox. Probably review armageddon.

    I'd love to see this, honestly. Would be so much smoother to run loops.

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