So you should be fine if we nerf SWF as that's the survivor equivalent of the Nurse.
SWF break the game just as how the Nurse breaks the game.
And don't say why should we be punished by playing with friends, or not all SWF are optimal or sweaty, because the same thing can be applied to Nurse.
The major difference is that Nurse requires a long time to learn how to play her, while SWF takes less time.
You're absolutely right, these killers are by no means weak, in fact many are very strong. What I am trying to convey is that these killers do not have high skillcaps. Skillcaps and actual strengths are separate. You can have a low skillcap killer that performs very well, Plague for instance. Her power is very easy to understand and use to its fullest potential. I think for the longevity of the game, killers that take time to learn will lead to less stale gameplay and will give us more bang for our buck when it comes to dlc killers. Hag is probably the only payed-for DLC that has a skillcap close to what should be expected of all killers. We have enough easy killers, what we need now is actually hard killers.
It's funny you say that because it wasn't her over-performing that lead to the changes. Something about the way her power interacted with the game they didn't like so they changed it on the backend and also included some lame ass balance excuse.
I really dislike the amount of killers they release that rely on their power having a cooldown.
Huntress is one of the most picked killers despite her low killrate, and this is because she is so easy to beat and how one mistake can cost you an entire game. But that doesn't matter because win or loss you can still have a ton of fun going for hatchets.
The best and most fun killers are those with active, engaging powers, and killers that can use their skill to win against a survivor, are much more rare these days because the devs are too afraid to make really good killers without huge downsides/counters.
The only M1 killer I enjoy is GF because I've always wanted a killer that could completely remove their red stain and their terror radius, and T1 Michael/T2 with addons was the only one that came close. Unfortnuately GF is tied to his powers CD.
Was Ghost face release stale though? I remember being insane with all the nerfs and buffs and now he's a super popular killer.
Addons yes, basekit no.
Honestly, both of them are okay. Oni needs to M1 to get his power. Survivors can easily deny that by dropping pallets early. Demo got mostly QoL problems like non-turnabke camera after shred and insanely much noise.
That is completely understandable. I feel the exact same way.
Hag doesn’t really have a high skill cap. You have to know the map layout and know where to place traps and herd survivors into your traps. I guess she’s a bit more of a strategic killer as opposed to Nurse and Huntress who are more mechanical harder to use. I believe she should be labeled as “Hard” instead of “Intermediate” as she does take a bit of skill and prediction to use properly. I just don’t find her that hard. Whenever I play Hag I tend to crush everyone and snowball easily and I don’t have as many hours on Hag as I do other killers.
Spirit and Oni are payed DLC that do not have a low skill cap. They are probably on the same level of “harder than most killers, but still not a high skill cap”. You won’t just pick them up instantly and be great with them, but they are nowhere near as hard to play as Nurse and Huntress.
One reason I think they release “low-skill cap” killers is because it is A LOT harder to play them on console. It is hard as hell to play Nurse and Huntress due to low sensitivity :/
If you think Oni is horrible at loops you haven't watched anyone good actually play him. He's nuts because of his flick. Sure you can't 180 anymore, but the 90 degree flick is still nuts and can work at almost every loop you use it at. Also, Demogorgon is a very good killer because of his ability to zone and stop longer loops with his shred, not to mention, he can control perks like STBFL, which makes him even stronger. GhostFace is a worse killer than both of them.
Yeah, no doubt he's a very strong killer. What I'm trying to get at is that his and the last few chapters worth of killers have had lacking skillcaps. It doesn't take a whole lot of time to become proficient with Oni unlike Nurse and Huntress. You don't have that seemingly endless application of power those two and a few others like Trapper and Hag. I think that future killers would benefit from being hard to use in a good way, with seemingly limitless applications. That's all.
I play on ps4. Go try oni. There is no flick. It doesn't exist there. And GF smokes either one of them if you know what your doing. GF has zero TR and no red stain, and has the ability to one shot. Run tru3's build and he's almost unstoppable.
I know he doesn't on PS4. Its 45 degreaser instead of 90. I'm speaking in terms of home at his fullest potential, which is on PC. GF is nowhere near better than either of them. His power is to basically take his TR away for a small amount of time. No red stain means nothing because you literally can do that at all times if you can actually moonwalk. His ability to hide his TR at times is the only thing that makes him slightly better than Myers. Other than that, he's just a better Wraith.
Tru3s build works against braindead survivors. Its 5 extra seconds of heal time, and Thanata adds like a solid 8 seconds to gens permitting you're able to actually keep them injured consistently. Even then, that's nothing verse a good team. PGTW is still better than both of those perks combined.
Ghostface and Demogorgon having a low skillcap. OOF. I mean, they definitely aren't the highest, but you need to be extremely strategic in how you play them.
Except that the stats showed us that the killers with the highest pick rates are Spirit, Billy and Freddy. None of them really has a high skill cap, their powers aren't hard to use after getting used to them and average players can still do good with them. So it doesn't look like players really like high skill based killers, especially because they can be very frustrating to play as an average player.
I also don't like killers like Nurse, who feels sluggish to play as or Huntress, who gets rekt by map design so hard, that her skill cap becomes irelevant. I gladly would play Plague over these 2 anytime.
That's where you and everyone else disagrees. Her basekit was broken, maybe you just didn't see it at the time.
I'm not intending to be a downer here, but is the issue not simply that the game mechanics are quite limited and you can't shake the boat too much without it becoming an issue?
If a killer cannot be looped, survivors will hate that killer, meaning every single release must be within that context (I'm not saying that's an unjustified desire for survivors, just pointing it out), and that's a tough one to get creative with.
How many unique killers can a game like dbd seriously accommodate?
The only argument for the basekit nerf people come op with: "She can ignore every survivor defense and has no counterplay, there for she should be legioned."
(completely ignoring a huge amount of people showing counterplay possibilities and weaknesses of nurse)
What's your argument for the basekit nerf? Or did i mention yours already?
She really had no reasonable counter play, if a Nurse was accurate there was nothing you could do. Now she has a window of counter play built in. More skill required? Yes. Nerfed to Legion Level? No. Still the best killer in the game? Yes.
As expected. The only argument is: "She had no counterplay."
High Skill Cap Killers are just M1 Killers to 90% of the Player Base.