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  • BossBoss Member, Trusted Posts: 13,581

    I guess we view genrush in different ways.

    I view genrush as: There's nothing else to do as a primary objective, so them going purely for Generators is a given.

    But because miscellaneous tasks are ignored and the focus is almost purely on the Generators, if they're done within a small-enough time window, i would then view it as a genrush.

    And no, that's not me saying: "You all should go for all Totems!"

    Heck, i like Killer more, but i don't even really view genrush as a bad thing, just unfun sometimes.

  • edgarpoopedgarpoop Member Posts: 5,569

    Can't upvote this enough. The "apply pressure" crowd must never play an M1 killer on Mt Ormond or Purgation. It can take 40 seconds to cross the map to where the survivors spawn if you get bad RNG on some maps. That's an entire gen without Ruin when toolboxes come into play. No amount of pressure changes a math problem.

  • gantesgantes Member Posts: 1,611

    "If" you get bad rng, "if" you're in some maps, "if" they have toolboxes, "if" they work through Ruin, "if" you have no CI.

    Guess what, "if" you play killer on Azarov and they get bad spawn RNG the game is rigged in your favor too. This goes for both sides. How about we stop trying to balance the game around the worst case scenario that happens 1 out of 2000 times

  • RatatoskRatatosk Member Posts: 23

    I more meant 'playing smart' as not being on the same gens and traveling in a pack the entire match. Sure, I get that it is boring, just doing gens and escaping, but sometimes that's all you can do. Also by 'playing smart', I meant that at least YOU know that you're on a gen by yourself, so you can hope that there's at least ONE other gen being done. All I ever do in games is play to have fun as well, but there are so many people complaining about this that and the other constantly, so it kinda ruins it already. Then being on the same gen, traveling together, not talking strategy is also boring for me. And by 'strategy' I just mean like who's going to break the totem we pass by, or who will open the gate for the points. Little things like that.

  • ZFennecFoxZFennecFox Member Posts: 510
    edited December 2019

    You have never seen true horror than seeing 4 survivors switch to Claudette at the very last second all armed with tool boxes. And then seeing 3 greater mist offerings and a swamp offering pop up.

  • RatatoskRatatosk Member Posts: 23

    No, thankfully not. Although I'm sorry that you have. Sounds like torture.

  • RatatoskRatatosk Member Posts: 23

    Yeah I agree, the objective, whether it's the gens being done or the killer killing the survivors, is done really quickly, it does usually end up being a really boring game.

  • ZFennecFoxZFennecFox Member Posts: 510

    Oh it really wasn't as bad as it sounded. I got a 4k they were really bad at looping.they only got 3 gens done with ruin still standing.

  • RatatoskRatatosk Member Posts: 23

    I'm not sure if this is directed at me specifically, but I do just want to point out that I have said many times that it's not always the player's fault for poor map pressure.

    And as for this, exactly. It's very rare that a killer gets the worst possible scenario when they get into a match, so they should definitely work on balancing the common things rather than the super rare things.

  • RatatoskRatatosk Member Posts: 23

    Yeah I figured it would have gone well, I more just meant seeing it then not being 100% sure if you were about to be covered with toxicity or not must've been torture.

  • ArrowTheGreat11ArrowTheGreat11 Member Posts: 306

    I’ve literally been found within the first 5 seconds of a game starting for the past three weeks.

  • Polychrome_BakuPolychrome_Baku Member Posts: 404

    The simple fact is that the game has been around long enough for people to point out the flaws: survivor objectives are static, killer objectives are not. What does this mean? Survivor objectives don't require any interaction with the killer whereas every killer objective requires survivor interaction. That aspect will never change, so the (killer) community will not ever be happy. Especially since the devs balance with the worst survivor players in mind, so god tier survivors are almost never affected.

    Oh and saying "just pressure gens mate" is a copout. Optimal survivor teams will always pressure you faster than you can pressure their gens. Its rare, but when every survivor can loop/land skill checks then you're ######### out of luck unless you're playing one of the big three killers. The only weak survivors are solos.

    So while gen rush isn't exactly real, it represents a fundamental flaw in this game. Survivor objectives are too easy.

  • Dennis_van_eijkDennis_van_eijk Member Posts: 1,557

    Ok i'll say it immediately, I didn't read all the comments so it might allready been said.

    I agree with what i read from the person who post this as well as some comments did.

    There are some big maps that can really hurt the killer no matter how well you play (think of trapper on blood lodge for example), the gen speed in general is imo pretty fast (3 survivors can do 5 gens in about 3:30 min), then there are (and maybe some will disagree with it) who really play for a gen rush.

    On that last one, I've faced several teams with prove thyself, green or purple toolboxes with either brand new parts or other high add ons, and 1 survivor with a rainbow map.

    And as you might guess, the perk ruin doesn't stay up long and the others will all 3 work together on the same gens.

    So yeah sometimes it is a thing but that's only when survivors actually play for it.

    Otherwise it's mostly the gen speed in general that is just to fast.

    And like the person who posted this, i play both sides at rank 1 and i am making it myself harder like running with my nea all purple (so hiding gets harder), no items, sometimes no perks or no mither, just so i have more to do and the game takes a bit longer.

  • ZoneDymoZoneDymo Member Posts: 1,946

    If survivors go into the match with the sole purpose of doing gens asap at hte expensive of everything else then yes, gen rushing does exist.

    all toolboxes to make it faster

    perks setup to make it as fast as possible

    no saving, just gens, then leave.

  • xEaxEa Member Posts: 2,972

    As you say, "gen-rushing" does exist. It simply means survivor are not wasting time with unneccessary stuff and do the gens as quickly as possible. There is nothing wrong with that, in fact its the most effective way to play as survivor.

    Everything you wrote is correct.

  • LordGlintLordGlint Member Posts: 6,586

    While I'm one to say "just apply more pressure" against survivors that take 80 seconds each to complete a gen, its abit different when survivors are stacking toolboxes/addons/perks to pump them out significantly faster than 80 seconds each. I just use this screenshot here as an example.

    And they sent me to Haddonfield too, lol

  • Dennis_van_eijkDennis_van_eijk Member Posts: 1,557

    Exactly as i described a few minutes ago.

    Imo they should reduce the general gen speed and leave the toolboxes and add ons as they are.

    So when they use toolboxes it gets as fast as they are now without toolboxes.

    That way toolboxes have a normal purpose instead of using to rush the gens (most of the time), and nit using it makes it as it suggests slower off course.

  • LordGlintLordGlint Member Posts: 6,586

    That would just make gen speeds incredibly slow for anyone NOT using a toolbox. IMO, they need to just set a limit on extremes. They already noticed extreme slowdowns when looking at "Forever Freddy". They need to set a ceiling for how slow actions can get as well as how fast they can get.

  • Bravo0413Bravo0413 Member Posts: 3,638

    Correct gen rush doesnt exist....

    How bout we call it "poor objective design", that seems like a better way of saying it, yeah? Since that's what the gens are.

  • Dennis_van_eijkDennis_van_eijk Member Posts: 1,557

    True, or make it so that when not using toolboxes it becomes just slightly slower (a term bhvr loves instead of giving it actual numbers), and when they use toolboxes it becomes the speed it is now without toolboxes.

    So not incredibly slow just a tiny bit slower.

    But i also like the one from you where there's a limit of what you can take.

    They do that with offerings as well, where there are 2 of the same offerings, 1 person gets the offering back

  • LordGlintLordGlint Member Posts: 6,586

    I figured with a limit...it would work to offset what the other player has without going into crazy extremes. If we set the limit for a 25% boost to gen speed for example, you could STILL bring in stuff to give you more than 25%...you just wouldnt see an increase beyond 25% right away. Any excess beyond 25% could then be applied once things are being applied to slow you down. Bring a toolbox that gives an extra 40%...you get 25% of that. The killer is using slowdown stuff that slows you down by 15%, now you get the full value of the +40% box to put your speeds back to a +25%.

  • Dennis_van_eijkDennis_van_eijk Member Posts: 1,557

    It sounds good but what you then would see (just guessing) is 3 survivors working on 3 seperarte gens with the best toolboxes because it will take just 60 sec instead of 80 sec because of the 25% repair boost.

    So while 1 is getting chased within 1 minutes 3 gens are done.

    And the best toolboxes aren't depleted after 1 gen so they can all 3 rush 3 separate other gens to spread the chances.

    Imo just slowing the general gen speed down a bit will allready help a lot

  • LordGlintLordGlint Member Posts: 6,586

    Like I said though, that would punish those people NOT using toolboxes. to reuse your same scenerio here with a small change...

    You're chasing 1 person with 3 other people working on separate gens without ANYTHING speeding them up...so just 80 seconds each.

    Do you have a problem with THIS? If not...theres no reason to change the base speeds.

  • DecarcassorDecarcassor Member Posts: 651

    This guy get it.

    Add to that bad map design and weaker killers and you get why the complains about "gen rush" exist. And toolboxes of course, lets not forget thoses.

    The gen rush might not be a thing by itself, but there are multiple factors in this game that when put together create the problem know as gen rush. You can't solve the gen rush. You can only address the issues that create it to begin with.

  • Dennis_van_eijkDennis_van_eijk Member Posts: 1,557

    lol relax mate, I'm not here to fight you.

    I'm only giving my thoughts here about this subject and yours nothing more.

    It is allready 80 sec no when 1 person is working on it, 2 people on it is a bit over 40 sec i believe.

    Im talking here about teams that go for a gen rush and not solo playing (and I see them a lot in the red ranks, don't know about the lower ranks tho).

    So if they know the devs change it to your idea, then the 3 split up.

    Doing nothing about the gen speed and they look for eachother and rush on the same gen with the perks and boxes.

    Again I'm nit here to fight you, just giving my ideas and findings

  • LordGlintLordGlint Member Posts: 6,586

    Im not being heated here, although its hard to judge tone based off text. My point was simply that its not really Gen-rushing when were just looking at the base numbers. 3 people doing gens at normal speeds currently is fine and really shouldnt be touched. If your problem is the INCREASE in speeds, the solution should be centered on that. Your solution of nerfing base speeds would affect EVERYONE, not just the people stacking gen speed perks/items.

  • Victor_hensleyVictor_hensley Member Posts: 800

    Does that mean gens getting done fast doesn't exist either?

  • Victor_hensleyVictor_hensley Member Posts: 800

    most killers can't put on pressure. yea, I lost while playing clown and leatherface because i wasn't pressuring enough, sure.

    Say whatever you want to deny that there are no problems with the game, the exact same mindset as the devs (remember the "just play Civ 5" meme?)

  • Johnny_XManJohnny_XMan Member Posts: 5,844

    Gen Rush has become an exclusive excuse for poor judgement/play/tactics/time management on the killer side.

    Even though you know the tools are there to slow gens down if you find that it is an issue in your own personal matches.

  • Dennis_van_eijkDennis_van_eijk Member Posts: 1,557

    That is true, but because you used caps it looked like you got a bit angry or something.

    But I do think it is still pretty fast as it is now.

    How many times are you working on yourself on a gen?

    I personally work most of the times with at least 2 on 1 gen, and i play solo.

    So even as a solo survivor i think the gen speed is pretty high.

    Even when i try to make the games longer than 8 minutes i fail at it as survivor.

    I let myself getting chased, do totems, walk from gen to gen etc and still the games last about 8 minutes

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